Anyone else getting tired of it all?
Discussion
JagLover said:
GT3Manthey said:
This taken from the actual ONS page so no media spin involved -
View all data used in this article
1. Main points
In England, between 2 January and 2 July 2021, there were 51,281 deaths involving coronavirus (COVID-19); 640 occurred in people who were fully vaccinated, which includes people who had been infected before they were vaccinated.
The risk of death involving COVID-19 was consistently lower for people who had received two vaccinations compared to one or no vaccination, as shown by the weekly age-standardised mortality rates (ASMRs) for deaths involving COVID-19.
Maybe all us vaccinated people are missing the point and we’re all going to end up with some longer term implications who knows but looking at ONS numbers leaves me thinking being fully jabbed was, for me & my family, the logical thing to do.
Most of those deaths would have been during the winter peak and most were unvaccinated then as they hadn't had a chance to be vaccinated. View all data used in this article
1. Main points
In England, between 2 January and 2 July 2021, there were 51,281 deaths involving coronavirus (COVID-19); 640 occurred in people who were fully vaccinated, which includes people who had been infected before they were vaccinated.
The risk of death involving COVID-19 was consistently lower for people who had received two vaccinations compared to one or no vaccination, as shown by the weekly age-standardised mortality rates (ASMRs) for deaths involving COVID-19.
Maybe all us vaccinated people are missing the point and we’re all going to end up with some longer term implications who knows but looking at ONS numbers leaves me thinking being fully jabbed was, for me & my family, the logical thing to do.
The current data on hospitalisations etc doesn't show anything like as drastic a difference.
Nothing has changed. If you're old, vulnerable or both then you are most at risk. If you're healthy and young you are at virtually no risk. Guess soon they will start having to measure more variables now booster vaccines are in play. Young healthy people's risk is still unlikely to change though.
This has been posted on other threads. If you really want to understand what is happening to you and how you can respond it’s an excellent starting place. It has helped me to gain some perspective as to where I am at the moment.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRo-ieBEw-8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRo-ieBEw-8
craigjm said:
Like with all statistics we should make sure we are comparing apples with apples. It is easy to draw wrong conclusions if this is not the case. The issue with South Africa is that there are a number of things which mean their experience is very different to ours such as -
It is currently summer
They live a very outdoor orientated lifestyle
The vast majority of property is poorly insulated and certainly not double glazed
Their inside spaces are generally much larger than ours
They have a large population of people taking drugs for HIV and TB and we dont know what impact this is having
Government statistics are always poor. Some of the spikes in SA are because they "found" some data and this leads to severe doubt over their figures
Their testing regime is far behind ours
Their vaccination rate is much lower than ours
The poor population lead a very non-socially distanced lifestyle while those on modest incomes and above are much more socially distanced than we are
A huge percentage of the healthcare system is private and much better equipped than our NHS but the government hospitals of those uninsured are not up to our standard so there is inequality in play with whether you survive a hospitalisation
There is not really a functioning public transport system with modest incomes and above driving everywhere in private cars and only the poor using shared transport. That shared transport is much more claustrophobic than ours though
The list goes on
It is very difficult IMO to take statistics from any other country and compare them directly to another
Yes, but you know the models/predictions that the general public have got their knickers in a twist about is based on omricon having same virulence as previous waves, right?It is currently summer
They live a very outdoor orientated lifestyle
The vast majority of property is poorly insulated and certainly not double glazed
Their inside spaces are generally much larger than ours
They have a large population of people taking drugs for HIV and TB and we dont know what impact this is having
Government statistics are always poor. Some of the spikes in SA are because they "found" some data and this leads to severe doubt over their figures
Their testing regime is far behind ours
Their vaccination rate is much lower than ours
The poor population lead a very non-socially distanced lifestyle while those on modest incomes and above are much more socially distanced than we are
A huge percentage of the healthcare system is private and much better equipped than our NHS but the government hospitals of those uninsured are not up to our standard so there is inequality in play with whether you survive a hospitalisation
There is not really a functioning public transport system with modest incomes and above driving everywhere in private cars and only the poor using shared transport. That shared transport is much more claustrophobic than ours though
The list goes on
It is very difficult IMO to take statistics from any other country and compare them directly to another
The reason people are looking at South Africa and trying to form their own opinion is because what we are being told by the ‘experts’ is utter nonsense. It’s got to a point now that our most respected medical institutions with centuries of history are creating garbage models (see Spectator article from today), and the main stream media are just repeating this nonsense, and the government just say stuff that means nothing.
What do you believe and who do you trust?
Jiebo said:
craigjm said:
Like with all statistics we should make sure we are comparing apples with apples. It is easy to draw wrong conclusions if this is not the case. The issue with South Africa is that there are a number of things which mean their experience is very different to ours such as -
It is currently summer
They live a very outdoor orientated lifestyle
The vast majority of property is poorly insulated and certainly not double glazed
Their inside spaces are generally much larger than ours
They have a large population of people taking drugs for HIV and TB and we dont know what impact this is having
Government statistics are always poor. Some of the spikes in SA are because they "found" some data and this leads to severe doubt over their figures
Their testing regime is far behind ours
Their vaccination rate is much lower than ours
The poor population lead a very non-socially distanced lifestyle while those on modest incomes and above are much more socially distanced than we are
A huge percentage of the healthcare system is private and much better equipped than our NHS but the government hospitals of those uninsured are not up to our standard so there is inequality in play with whether you survive a hospitalisation
There is not really a functioning public transport system with modest incomes and above driving everywhere in private cars and only the poor using shared transport. That shared transport is much more claustrophobic than ours though
The list goes on
It is very difficult IMO to take statistics from any other country and compare them directly to another
Yes, but you know the models/predictions that the general public have got their knickers in a twist about is based on omricon having same virulence as previous waves, right?It is currently summer
They live a very outdoor orientated lifestyle
The vast majority of property is poorly insulated and certainly not double glazed
Their inside spaces are generally much larger than ours
They have a large population of people taking drugs for HIV and TB and we dont know what impact this is having
Government statistics are always poor. Some of the spikes in SA are because they "found" some data and this leads to severe doubt over their figures
Their testing regime is far behind ours
Their vaccination rate is much lower than ours
The poor population lead a very non-socially distanced lifestyle while those on modest incomes and above are much more socially distanced than we are
A huge percentage of the healthcare system is private and much better equipped than our NHS but the government hospitals of those uninsured are not up to our standard so there is inequality in play with whether you survive a hospitalisation
There is not really a functioning public transport system with modest incomes and above driving everywhere in private cars and only the poor using shared transport. That shared transport is much more claustrophobic than ours though
The list goes on
It is very difficult IMO to take statistics from any other country and compare them directly to another
The reason people are looking at South Africa and trying to form their own opinion is because what we are being told by the ‘experts’ is utter nonsense. It’s got to a point now that our most respected medical institutions with centuries of history are creating garbage models (see Spectator article from today), and the main stream media are just repeating this nonsense, and the government just say stuff that means nothing.
What do you believe and who do you trust?
Edited by craigjm on Tuesday 21st December 08:09
The Government are now trying to legislate against influenza. All the evidence points to Covid changing and becoming less dangerous.
We were told they would know in a couple of weeks how severe Omicron will be. That was three weeks ago. Still nothing.
We were told hospitals would be overrun. Cases with Covid in hospital are falling.
Deaths would rise. They are stable or falling.
Cases would double ever two or three days. They aren't. The cases may be high, but they are far from severe. Most are mild flu like symptoms.
It's about time there was some perspective.
We were told they would know in a couple of weeks how severe Omicron will be. That was three weeks ago. Still nothing.
We were told hospitals would be overrun. Cases with Covid in hospital are falling.
Deaths would rise. They are stable or falling.
Cases would double ever two or three days. They aren't. The cases may be high, but they are far from severe. Most are mild flu like symptoms.
It's about time there was some perspective.
Tyre Smoke said:
The Government are now trying to legislate against influenza. All the evidence points to Covid changing and becoming less dangerous.
We were told they would know in a couple of weeks how severe Omicron will be. That was three weeks ago. Still nothing.
We were told hospitals would be overrun. Cases with Covid in hospital are falling.
Deaths would rise. They are stable or falling.
Cases would double ever two or three days. They aren't. The cases may be high, but they are far from severe. Most are mild flu like symptoms.
It's about time there was some perspective.
If not up quite yet, the game is starting to unravel big time.We were told they would know in a couple of weeks how severe Omicron will be. That was three weeks ago. Still nothing.
We were told hospitals would be overrun. Cases with Covid in hospital are falling.
Deaths would rise. They are stable or falling.
Cases would double ever two or three days. They aren't. The cases may be high, but they are far from severe. Most are mild flu like symptoms.
It's about time there was some perspective.
The Twitter exchange between Fraser Nelson and Graham Medley, the chair of the Sage modelling committee, a few days ago really put the cat among the pigeons.
Tyre Smoke said:
The Government are now trying to legislate against influenza. All the evidence points to Covid changing and becoming less dangerous.
I said early on in the pandemic last year we would be having flu lockdowns going forward, and was greeted with insults and raised eyebrows. This will have opened their eyes to the possibility. It's a low hanging fruit to help the NHS. Rather than spend any money on it or attempt to sort out the failings, this is the easiest option. It's all very British. Add to the fact that we're the biggest bunch of sissies in the world in this country now, and that is how we're in this mess.I wonder when people are going to take notice of us "tin foilers" ?
So now Barts are reporting staff absences have gone up to 4700 from 1900 a week earlier across their 5 hospitals so are now cancelling planned operations in January.
Time to change this isolation requirement on a positive test.
It’s now outdated & this time round we have the vaccines where as before we didn’t .
The virus is everywhere already
Time to change this isolation requirement on a positive test.
It’s now outdated & this time round we have the vaccines where as before we didn’t .
The virus is everywhere already
Tyre Smoke said:
The Government are now trying to legislate against influenza. All the evidence points to Covid changing and becoming less dangerous.
We were told they would know in a couple of weeks how severe Omicron will be. That was three weeks ago. Still nothing.
We were told hospitals would be overrun. Cases with Covid in hospital are falling.
Deaths would rise. They are stable or falling.
Cases would double ever two or three days. They aren't. The cases may be high, but they are far from severe. Most are mild flu like symptoms.
It's about time there was some perspective.
If only We were told they would know in a couple of weeks how severe Omicron will be. That was three weeks ago. Still nothing.
We were told hospitals would be overrun. Cases with Covid in hospital are falling.
Deaths would rise. They are stable or falling.
Cases would double ever two or three days. They aren't. The cases may be high, but they are far from severe. Most are mild flu like symptoms.
It's about time there was some perspective.
croyde said:
How on earth is anyone getting tested now. LFTs are non existent in Wandsworth and other parts of SW London. All the chemists have no stuck.
Should help in lowering the positive rate
Pal of mine took 3 LFT all showed negative . Should help in lowering the positive rate
Didn’t feel right still so took a PCR that came back positive and is now isolating .
Shambles
GT3Manthey said:
So now Barts are reporting staff absences have gone up to 4700 from 1900 a week earlier across their 5 hospitals so are now cancelling planned operations in January.
Time to change this isolation requirement on a positive test.
It’s now outdated & this time round we have the vaccines where as before we didn’t .
The virus is everywhere already
Who knew? Paid sick leave and it's Christmas. What a surprise. Time to change this isolation requirement on a positive test.
It’s now outdated & this time round we have the vaccines where as before we didn’t .
The virus is everywhere already
GT3Manthey said:
Are they working at the University of Stating the Bleeding Obvious?GT3Manthey said:
This article has been briefly discussed (because it is b
ks) on other threads.Quite simply, it fails the science part because it is only using the level of antibodies in the blood as the reason for preventing infection, and completely ignores T & B cell immunity. The latter is way more critical over the medium and long term in the fight against infections.
Ashfordian said:
GT3Manthey said:
This article has been briefly discussed (because it is bks) on other threads.Quite simply, it fails the science part because it is only using the level of antibodies in the blood as the reason for preventing infection, and completely ignores T & B cell immunity. The latter is way more critical over the medium and long term in the fight against infections.
On the immunity, I too found this odd. It was only a few weeks ago I’d read a headline saying China’s vaccine using the full protein would give them the edge because the immune system is trained on much more material.
Yet now, it’s just antibodies that count to immunity, not the immune system and it’s trained response.
They really do just seem to want to be scaring people for fun now.
And another headline today. Maybe doctors giving out too many anti-depressants... maybe they’re not really so good for you.
This at a time when mental health was meant to be a big thing, taking away the stigma etc... and yet we have government and scientists sat there terrifying people day and night for years on end.
And now they’re banging on about the Flu too.
Just how desperate are the government to look like they’re required?
All they do is f
k everything up.
Gassing Station | Health Matters | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff