The Official Arsenal - 14 x FA Cup winners thread - Vol 4
Discussion
I think you’re being harsh on him, on his day when 100% fit, he’s a great defender, but his ability was always down to his mobility rather than reading the game and with the constant injury problems have hampered him, last season and some time before he’s been struggling with Achilles problems and it going completely was pretty much inevitable, expecting him to come back and be up to Premiere league pace after one under 23 game and a non entity from Azerbaijan was a tuff ask.
Cupramax said:
I think you’re being harsh on him, on his day when 100% fit, he’s a great defender, but his ability was always down to his mobility rather than reading the game and with the constant injury problems have hampered him, last season and some time before he’s been struggling with Achilles problems and it going completely was pretty much inevitable, expecting him to come back and be up to Premiere league pace after one under 23 game and a non entity from Azerbaijan was a tuff ask.
I think we’re saying the same thing in that as you say, his key ability was/is mobility rather than reading the game. But think we can agree to disagree on whether or not he is/was ever a “great” defender
I’ll tell you what: since you think it’s down to him being match fit, and in my view he has been error strewn for years, let’s revisit this later in the season. By then he’d have a few more games, and then we’ll see if his performance improves in terms of mistakes made. Internet bet?
Edited by tigerkoi on Sunday 16th December 20:02
tigerkoi said:
Koscielny at fault for both Southampton goals, in my view.
As the central man in a back three, he twice let’s their CF occupy space behind (opposed to where ball is) and just gives him free rein. Positional sense is useless.
I know there’s a CB shortage but surely this part of his play...he could self-improve!?
He's just not good enough and by him playing we seemed to return to the Wenger era.As the central man in a back three, he twice let’s their CF occupy space behind (opposed to where ball is) and just gives him free rein. Positional sense is useless.
I know there’s a CB shortage but surely this part of his play...he could self-improve!?
We were bound to leak goals after losing Holding to a long term injury and Sokratis to a suspension.
A back line of Lichtsteiner (which doesn't seem so bad) with a CH in his first PL game after injury (as well as playing three days earlier) and Xhaka. A tad harsh against a team, a) fighting to climb out of the drop zone, and b) well up for it being the new manager's first home game.
I never used to mind Southampton as a team/set of fans but today they were a bit ugly in their support; when we thought Redmond was injured we duly kicked the ball out. Moments later a Soton player (forget who it was) smashed into Koscielny and the fans started chanting 'same old Arsenal...'
There was also a moment when they responded to the Aubameyang chant with their own version. Maybe I'm being naive, but I always felt there was quite a bit of respect between the two clubs.
A back line of Lichtsteiner (which doesn't seem so bad) with a CH in his first PL game after injury (as well as playing three days earlier) and Xhaka. A tad harsh against a team, a) fighting to climb out of the drop zone, and b) well up for it being the new manager's first home game.
I never used to mind Southampton as a team/set of fans but today they were a bit ugly in their support; when we thought Redmond was injured we duly kicked the ball out. Moments later a Soton player (forget who it was) smashed into Koscielny and the fans started chanting 'same old Arsenal...'
There was also a moment when they responded to the Aubameyang chant with their own version. Maybe I'm being naive, but I always felt there was quite a bit of respect between the two clubs.
tigerkoi said:
Cupramax said:
It’s his first full league game after how many months out, didn’t expect much else to be honest? He was way off the pace but I’m not sure we had any other choice other than playing Elneny at CB or one of the academy players. After 22 games it was bound to go pear shaped eventually, better today than Wednesday night...
My point is, he was doing the same stuff before he got injured. Always has been a player that doesn’t read the movements of the opposing forwards around him, and just relied on pace and recovery to make it up.
That inability to read their attack makes any back three, four, porous. He just looks at and tries to play the incoming balls, not retard any opposition from making use of it. Tony Adams would be screaming at Bould or Keown or whoever to make sure Ings would have been covered. Koscielny does his own merry thing and doesn’t - for instance - manage Monreal, Lichsteiner, Xhaka into a unit.
Sure he’d have made France’s WC squad but with Umtiti, Varane etc he’s just back up. Those guys watch the ballplay and also ensure any attacker gets a rough ride and is watched tightly.
Edited by tigerkoi on Sunday 16th December 18:29
never a good defender, just used pace to recover from porr positioning, and beasted by anyone witha bit of muscle. the championship bustling strikeforce of ings and log were always going to have him for breakfast. tbh i would rather seen an academy player come in.
not sure when his contract is up, but no new one please.
dick needs to sort things out asap as i can see us drifting off the pace (still his task was always huge) as we have been lethargic since the spurs game. 0 creativity against a team who isnt coming out to play (see huddersfield too). we need the ozil situation sorted asap and need some pace on the wing. We must recall nelson in jan if we can.
He also needs to sort out the tactics and line ups to stop the slow starts, yet hes summarily failed so far. agianst Spurs and Liverpool we came out the blocks and did well. we can do it, we just don't. i hope its simply hangover from the mess hes been left with, but am concerned in his faith of the likes of iwobi, who despite improving from total crap last season is now just crap.
theplayingmantis said:
concerned in his faith of the likes of iwobi, who despite improving from total crap last season is now just crap.
I don't get Iwobi. Adds very little to attacks other than getting me out of my seat for a second. Also, I don't like the way he runs. Feet at 10-to-2 makes him look like his tracking's out.
Glassman said:
theplayingmantis said:
concerned in his faith of the likes of iwobi, who despite improving from total crap last season is now just crap.
I don't get Iwobi. Adds very little to attacks other than getting me out of my seat for a second. Also, I don't like the way he runs. Feet at 10-to-2 makes him look like his tracking's out.
I get the feeling Emery - as much as I rate him - looks too closely at Opta stats or whatever rather than use his intuition and feel. The stats might tell you that Iwobi has a great pass completion rate or whatever, but it won’t tell you that other teams reckon that he just won’t hurt you with his play.
tigerkoi said:
Makes three of us. I’m with you and Mr Mantis on this one. The guy obviously has potential but is so frustrating to watch. And yes the duck feet running style can’t be good for acceleration!
I get the feeling Emery - as much as I rate him - looks too closely at Opta stats or whatever rather than use his intuition and feel. The stats might tell you that Iwobi has a great pass completion rate or whatever, but it won’t tell you that other teams reckon that he just won’t hurt you with his play.
...and his head looks like it's covered with tarantula legs. I get the feeling Emery - as much as I rate him - looks too closely at Opta stats or whatever rather than use his intuition and feel. The stats might tell you that Iwobi has a great pass completion rate or whatever, but it won’t tell you that other teams reckon that he just won’t hurt you with his play.
theplayingmantis said:
seems spurs have added the 1-1 draw against Barca reserves and kids to their list of honors on the website, right alongside the Ipswich Hospital cup (joint).
imagine if they actually won something...!
Fair play they got a result when needed away, but all the crap about how well they played, best performance at Nou Camp etc (according to the idiot Gulliame Ballague, who just happens to be flogging a spurs book...) they are ignoring the huge elephant in the room, the team, (and effort, well lack of) put out by their opponents.
Completely ignoring it.
That's why they are generally the most disliked set of fan they have no perspective.
Likewise some on their are taking credit for developing certain players from the youth ranks (alli was signed they seem to forget) and all on a shoestring...again ignoring the fact that they are owned and funded (yes 'but we dont spend any money, or wages', oh yea cos your star players keep renewing out of love of the club, not the clever bonus scheme that isn't declared in wage spend built into their contracts) by the richest man in Britain!
Barca said screw the integrity of the competition effectively beforehand saying inter have only themselves to blame as they should have qualified already.
That said serves Inter right, crap side, just defend all game and hope icardi nicks one.
And it means they don't drop into Europa and knock us out!
Putting my tin hat on for our noisy neighbors inevitable comments!
u ok hun? ximagine if they actually won something...!
Fair play they got a result when needed away, but all the crap about how well they played, best performance at Nou Camp etc (according to the idiot Gulliame Ballague, who just happens to be flogging a spurs book...) they are ignoring the huge elephant in the room, the team, (and effort, well lack of) put out by their opponents.
Completely ignoring it.
That's why they are generally the most disliked set of fan they have no perspective.
Likewise some on their are taking credit for developing certain players from the youth ranks (alli was signed they seem to forget) and all on a shoestring...again ignoring the fact that they are owned and funded (yes 'but we dont spend any money, or wages', oh yea cos your star players keep renewing out of love of the club, not the clever bonus scheme that isn't declared in wage spend built into their contracts) by the richest man in Britain!
Barca said screw the integrity of the competition effectively beforehand saying inter have only themselves to blame as they should have qualified already.
That said serves Inter right, crap side, just defend all game and hope icardi nicks one.
And it means they don't drop into Europa and knock us out!
Putting my tin hat on for our noisy neighbors inevitable comments!
i have an irrational football hatred of spurs, so no i have issues in me head!
anyway you will drop off soon, poxy off to united with kane to follow in the summer is the rumor going around.
Joe Lewis will sanction both moves for 200m in total to help fund the new stadium, as hes doesn't want to dip into his own pocket any more on it and the NFL have break clauses in the contract with you that they can implement given the first game was missed and Lewis is fearful their gonna pull the plug, despite his successful 'influencing' the FA and sowing disharmony to unofficially reject Khans Wembley bid that would have been the death knell for Spurs NFL ambitions, yet would have helped English grassroots football massively!
Actually they may want someone whose actually won something in his career, so Wenger it is!
anyway you will drop off soon, poxy off to united with kane to follow in the summer is the rumor going around.
Joe Lewis will sanction both moves for 200m in total to help fund the new stadium, as hes doesn't want to dip into his own pocket any more on it and the NFL have break clauses in the contract with you that they can implement given the first game was missed and Lewis is fearful their gonna pull the plug, despite his successful 'influencing' the FA and sowing disharmony to unofficially reject Khans Wembley bid that would have been the death knell for Spurs NFL ambitions, yet would have helped English grassroots football massively!
Actually they may want someone whose actually won something in his career, so Wenger it is!
Glassman said:
...and his head looks like it's covered with tarantula legs.
to think Aw allowed the talent that was Serge Gnabry to rot and leave and keep Iwobi. baffling.iwobi reminds me of eboue (who i thought was a good player when he first burst on scene as right back) when he played right midfield. awful first touch, constant miscontrolling, running to blind alleys.
but in rality we have an awful lot of dross still and its gonna take a good few transfer windows before emery has 'his' players. we must be patient as hard as that is given the promising signs so far.
i fully expect a corn holing tomorrow night though!
Cupramax said:
but from what i may have misread, hes fined less for an abhorrent racist act than the bloke who chucked an plastic bottle on?theplayingmantis said:
Cupramax said:
but from what i may have misread, hes fined less for an abhorrent racist act than the bloke who chucked an plastic bottle on?cbmotorsport said:
Predictions tonight?
I'm hopeful, but apprehensive too. I don't think our defence is good enough to stop them scoring, and I don't think our attack is in enough form to batter them.That said, it looks like we have some players that understand what a derby means, and I hope that Emery is really going for this one. I'd like some silverware this season (although it isn't essential) and that's only going to come in the form of the EFL Cup, FA Cup or Europa.
I'm predicting we'll win it, by one goal. 2-1 or 3-2.
Glassman said:
theplayingmantis said:
Cupramax said:
but from what i may have misread, hes fined less for an abhorrent racist act than the bloke who chucked an plastic bottle on?
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