Kids Grassroots Football - The good stuff!

[JQ]

Glassman said:

He does. But doesn't get involved much. I'm there too but I like to get involved.

It's the gap between training and match day that concerns me. I think what the hired coach does is one thing and then the manager saying, "Right, today we're going to try this" as they're about to run on the pitch for a game isn't doing them any good.

You're a parent and you were getting yourself involved in the coaching, which is being run by by professionals? No offence, but you're coming across as a pushy parent. Our parent's aren't allowed on the pitch during training sessions for exactly this reason.

From what you've said on here, you either need to take over the Manager's position or walk away and leave him to it. You seem to be totally at odds with the way the manager runs things and appear to want to run the team form the assistant's position - I can't imagine that ending well unless you're a master of manipulation. Did you discuss all your concerns with the manager prior to taking on the role? Does he know you've got all these plans? He might not enjoy the position and may be grateful of you offering to take over entirely. The chaps I replaced certainly was - he enjoyed the organisational element, organising games and tournaments, liaising with parents etc, but didn't enjoy the hands on stuff. So I offered to run the team and asked him to remain on board organising everything - win win. From my point of view he gets to deal with all the crap and I get to do the fun bits. I suspect he feels exactly the same.

[Glassman]

JQ said:

You're a parent and you were getting yourself involved in the coaching, which is being run by by professionals? No offence, but you're coming across as a pushy parent. Our parent's aren't allowed on the pitch during training sessions for exactly this reason.

From what you've said on here, you either need to take over the Manager's position or walk away and leave him to it. You seem to be totally at odds with the way the manager runs things and appear to want to run the team form the assistant's position - I can't imagine that ending well unless you're a master of manipulation. Did you discuss all your concerns with the manager prior to taking on the role? Does he know you've got all these plans? He might not enjoy the position and may be grateful of you offering to take over entirely. The chaps I replaced certainly was - he enjoyed the organisational element, organising games and tournaments, liaising with parents etc, but didn't enjoy the hands on stuff. So I offered to run the team and asked him to remain on board organising everything - win win. From my point of view he gets to deal with all the crap and I get to do the fun bits. I suspect he feels exactly the same.

I was invited to co-manage the team. I accepted.

[Gargamel]

Glassman said:

I was invited to co-manage the team. I accepted.

G. I ran several teams, and age groups as asst coach, coach, head coach, chairman of the club. everything from clearing up dog st on the pitch to meeting the National Lottery funding teams and everything in between.

The coaches would post mortem the matches for about 20 minutes, agree on what needs to happen at the next training session, what worked, what didn't work. We had a specific agreement with each other to be honest, no ego's and call each other out on good and bad behaviour.

We also used to meet every 3 for 4 weeks over a pint and assess each player individually, what we should praise them for, and what should we challenge them to improve. No player should be left in any doubt about what we think they are good at and should keep doing and what they should aim to improve.

If you are genuinely co managing, then have a serious chat with the other coach. How do we work together, how do we make decisions, what do we want from this etc.

I have seen a few friends fall out over coaching, getting styles to match is not easy.

[Glassman]

Gargamel said:

G. I ran several teams, and age groups as asst coach, coach, head coach, chairman of the club. everything from clearing up dog st on the pitch to meeting the National Lottery funding teams and everything in between.

The coaches would post mortem the matches for about 20 minutes, agree on what needs to happen at the next training session, what worked, what didn't work. We had a specific agreement with each other to be honest, no ego's and call each other out on good and bad behaviour.

We also used to meet every 3 for 4 weeks over a pint and assess each player individually, what we should praise them for, and what should we challenge them to improve. No player should be left in any doubt about what we think they are good at and should keep doing and what they should aim to improve.

If you are genuinely co managing, then have a serious chat with the other coach. How do we work together, how do we make decisions, what do we want from this etc.

I have seen a few friends fall out over coaching, getting styles to match is not easy.

Sound advice. Thank you.

[Gargamel]

Glassman said:

Sound advice. Thank you.

Hey no problem, I loved coaching and running the club, and my youngest still plays there, I stepped down a while ago, it is a challenge and personally I found it incredibly rewarding. I also changed my opinion of the FA over the 10 years or so I had to deal with them. Not perfect by any means, but they are really trying to move the game on.

[48Valves]

Gargamel said:

Glassman said:

I was invited to co-manage the team. I accepted.

G. I ran several teams, and age groups as asst coach, coach, head coach, chairman of the club. everything from clearing up dog st on the pitch to meeting the National Lottery funding teams and everything in between.

The coaches would post mortem the matches for about 20 minutes, agree on what needs to happen at the next training session,what worked, what didn't work. We had a specific agreement with each other to be honest, no ego's and call each other out on good and bad behaviour.

We also used to meet every 3 for 4 weeks over a pint and assess each player individually, what we should praise them for, and what should we challenge them to improve. No player should be left in any doubt about what we think they are good at and should keep doing and what they should aim to improve.

If you are genuinely co managing, then have a serious chat with the other coach. How do we work together, how do we make decisions, what do we want from this etc.

I have seen a few friends fall out over coaching, getting styles to match is not easy.

The 2 bits in bold are key for me. You should be coaching for the kids. To improve them in the game (as children see it, not the adult version of the game) and as little people.

For me there should be longer term development plans in place for training sessions rather than fire fighting what you perceived to have gone wrong in the previous game.

In this planning you can then work out how you can integrate some of the outcomes for individual players. Some sessions can be set up with one or two players in mind. But the others are still getting lots out of the sessions.

I like the regular discussions about each player and the post game review. We also do a post training session review. Did the players have any say in their individual and team development? I've found this key to getting their buy in.

[Gargamel]

Certainly as they get older you need them to agree/buy in to the development challenge.

It’s usually really simple, good dribblers are challenged to take a player on, beat them and look up for a pass. Or wingers challenged to cross in the game. Defenders challenged to pass to feet etc

We did have some longer term plans, but to be honest they are hard to make relevant all of the time especially when rotating players.

Challenging them as a team is also good, above all keep it fun and light. Almost all my age groups are competitive themselves without us needing to get at them.

[Glassman]

If a player comes off the pitch after being subbed and punches the manager (for subbing him) what is your view on this?

The kid in question is the manager's son.

Kid threw a real strop and walked off and turned his back to the pitch as he sulked it out. 10 minutes later he was back pining to be put back on. Manager [dad] obliged.

Views?

[48Valves]

Glassman said:

If a player comes off the pitch after being subbed and punches the manager (for subbing him) what is your view on this?

The kid in question is the manager's son.

Kid threw a real strop and walked off and turned his back to the pitch as he sulked it out. 10 minutes later he was back pining to be put back on. Manager [dad] obliged.

Views?

Being the managers son does add complexity to the situation. I'm sure many will say the child never plays for the team again. But thats easy to say when it's not your child. Like many grassroots teams, I bet the manager is only there because his son is.

The response very much depends on age and whether this behaviour is a common occurrence.

Punishment for an U7 would be different from an U13.

In either instance the kid certainly wouldn't be going back on the pitch during the game it happened in.

For younger kids if it was a one off I would probably say miss the next couple of games. If poor behaviour is regular then I might be tempted to tell them to stay away for longer. Including training.

For older kids I would tell their parents to keep them away for longer in the first instance. Then tell them if they come back they have to earn their place back in the team bu showing good behaviour and respect.

Tricky one

[48Valves]

Glassman said:

If a player comes off the pitch after being subbed and punches the manager (for subbing him) what is your view on this?

The kid in question is the manager's son.

Kid threw a real strop and walked off and turned his back to the pitch as he sulked it out. 10 minutes later he was back pining to be put back on. Manager [dad] obliged.

Views?

Problem the dad now has, is that his players are allowed to punch the coach.

[Gargamel]

The correct question is, what would happen if any of the other players, punched the coach?

Likely dropped for at least a match right ?

Do that then.

Does the club have a player code of conduct ? Might be worth finding one..

[Kinky]

And of course, if the ref had seen it, he could have red carded him

[Zoon]

Definitely wouldn't have played again that day.
Three match ban for violence towards others.

[anniesdad]

Glassman said:

If a player comes off the pitch after being subbed and punches the manager (for subbing him) what is your view on this?

The kid in question is the manager's son.

Kid threw a real strop and walked off and turned his back to the pitch as he sulked it out. 10 minutes later he was back pining to be put back on. Manager [dad] obliged.

Views?

That's a wellfare issue. Do you have an independent welfare officer that can consider meting out punishment or not?

In my mind, kid doesn't come back on and misses the next game or two to hopefully realise he can't go about doing that and there are repercussions for doing so.

[Kitchski]

Have enjoyed reading this thread.

I've got three boys in youth teams. A set of twins in U10, and another at U7 level.

The U7 lad is doing pretty well. He's got natural ability, good technique and balance. He was very shy to start with and wouldn't join in, but his coach is really patient and has had faith in him all along. He told him at a tournament that he can do things with a ball that he's never seen anyone else do, which was a little booster to him. And it's true; when he picks the ball up and starts to run forward, it's like everyone is suddenly on edge, because you don't know what he's going to do next with it. He's also pretty good at passing, and his positioning is probably miles ahead of any of the other kids (he makes runs, tries to find space etc.) Only problem is he's a bit of a luxury player - only turns up when he feels like it, and in the last couple of games the others in attack have been carrying him. All I can do is keep encouraging him, which is what we all do. It's just such a great feeling when he has a good game, and he's the smallest one there, so always looks funny watching him skin other kids with twists and turns etc. The ball seems to stick to his feet when he makes a run.

The U10 pair I'm having a harder time with. They're both pretty bright kids, and the love the game, but are both very much of 'slight' build, while the majority of kids they play against (or with) are much bigger and stronger. That wouldn't be too much of an issue, but they're both reluctant to embrace the physical side of the game too, and at the age they're at, I think that's probably the most important element.
One of them (smaller of the two) is usually put up front. He's a bit of 'fox in the box', as his previous manager used to say, and he's nearly always in the right place at the right time to create opportunities for tap-ins. Problem is, he never commits to actually shooting with any venom, so is very ineffective. He does have two goals this season, but it was a rare good game for him.
The other twin is slightly bigger, and does get stuck in a bit more. He's a good finisher and reads the game well, but his passing is probably one of the best of the team. He's got a cracking first touch, and normal hits one-touch passes to either wing from midfield for wingers to run onto. He's got this ability to look like he has time on the ball when he's being played in midfield, but like his brother, he's just not physical enough. Neither of them are quick, tenacious or eager to win the ball, and in the kind of games they're playing, those are the attributes they need.
They both say they love playing for the team, but the problem is their team has a new manager who's taking things quite seriously, and already this season it's clear they're only being brought on when the game is under control. In previous years, it's been a case of giving everyone equal playing time, and the result is the result, but things are obviously getting more serious now, and I can see them being left behind.

I try not to be the Dad on the sidelines barking orders at them, and certainly don't want to undermine the coach, but I need to get them into the game more and don't really know how to approach it. At the moment I keep encouraging them to win the ball back, give as good as you get etc. (regards push & shove) but it's just falling on deaf ears, and they'd be heartbroken if they got booted from the team.

Not sure what to do to help them.

[48Valves]

Kitchski said:

Have enjoyed reading this thread.

I've got three boys in youth teams. A set of twins in U10, and another at U7 level.

The U7 lad is doing pretty well. He's got natural ability, good technique and balance. He was very shy to start with and wouldn't join in, but his coach is really patient and has had faith in him all along. He told him at a tournament that he can do things with a ball that he's never seen anyone else do, which was a little booster to him. And it's true; when he picks the ball up and starts to run forward, it's like everyone is suddenly on edge, because you don't know what he's going to do next with it. He's also pretty good at passing, and his positioning is probably miles ahead of any of the other kids (he makes runs, tries to find space etc.) Only problem is he's a bit of a luxury player - only turns up when he feels like it, and in the last couple of games the others in attack have been carrying him. All I can do is keep encouraging him, which is what we all do. It's just such a great feeling when he has a good game, and he's the smallest one there, so always looks funny watching him skin other kids with twists and turns etc. The ball seems to stick to his feet when he makes a run.

The U10 pair I'm having a harder time with. They're both pretty bright kids, and the love the game, but are both very much of 'slight' build, while the majority of kids they play against (or with) are much bigger and stronger. That wouldn't be too much of an issue, but they're both reluctant to embrace the physical side of the game too, and at the age they're at, I think that's probably the most important element.
One of them (smaller of the two) is usually put up front. He's a bit of 'fox in the box', as his previous manager used to say, and he's nearly always in the right place at the right time to create opportunities for tap-ins. Problem is, he never commits to actually shooting with any venom, so is very ineffective. He does have two goals this season, but it was a rare good game for him.
The other twin is slightly bigger, and does get stuck in a bit more. He's a good finisher and reads the game well, but his passing is probably one of the best of the team. He's got a cracking first touch, and normal hits one-touch passes to either wing from midfield for wingers to run onto. He's got this ability to look like he has time on the ball when he's being played in midfield, but like his brother, he's just not physical enough. Neither of them are quick, tenacious or eager to win the ball, and in the kind of games they're playing, those are the attributes they need.
They both say they love playing for the team, but the problem is their team has a new manager who's taking things quite seriously, and already this season it's clear they're only being brought on when the game is under control. In previous years, it's been a case of giving everyone equal playing time, and the result is the result, but things are obviously getting more serious now, and I can see them being left behind.

I try not to be the Dad on the sidelines barking orders at them, and certainly don't want to undermine the coach, but I need to get them into the game more and don't really know how to approach it. At the moment I keep encouraging them to win the ball back, give as good as you get etc. (regards push & shove) but it's just falling on deaf ears, and they'd be heartbroken if they got booted from the team.

Not sure what to do to help them.

When I read your post, it sounds very much like you are describing adults football. And that is the problem. They are kids playing a game for fun.
Some of them are scared of getting hurt in tackles or being hit by the ball. I've played with adults that are the same.
The manager/coach should be able to construct training sessions that work on the physical contact side of the game. Hopefully in a controlled manner.

To be completely honest. In my opinion phrases like "Get stuck in" have no place in junior football. They are inappropriate and send the wrong message. Thats if the kids understand what it means.
If you are saying it to your boys, it is likely they feel under more pressure. Which in turn affects their game.

As for the manager. Does the club have an equal playing time policy? If not ask the committee to introduce one. How are the kids supposed to improve by not playing.
Get hold of your country FA handbook. It should state minimum playing times.

[Kitchski]

48Valves said:

When I read your post, it sounds very much like you are describing adults football. And that is the problem. They are kids playing a game for fun.
Some of them are scared of getting hurt in tackles or being hit by the ball. I've played with adults that are the same.
The manager/coach should be able to construct training sessions that work on the physical contact side of the game. Hopefully in a controlled manner.

To be completely honest. In my opinion phrases like "Get stuck in" have no place in junior football. They are inappropriate and send the wrong message. Thats if the kids understand what it means.
If you are saying it to your boys, it is likely they feel under more pressure. Which in turn affects their game.

As for the manager. Does the club have an equal playing time policy? If not ask the committee to introduce one. How are the kids supposed to improve by not playing.
Get hold of your country FA handbook. It should state minimum playing times.

Thanks. I can see how my post comes across like that, but with the twins it was really more to highlight how far behind all the others they are. Yes, you'll get kids who are very physical, and others who are not so much, but my two are a long way behind any of the others, to the point it stands out and makes it look like they're not trying. Then they get their teammates on their backs etc., and that's when they stop enjoying it and having fun. And it's not like they offer nothing, it's just that what they do offer tends to go unnoticed by anyone else. It's almost like they're really good at the more advanced stuff, but not so good at the basic stuff.

They do get playing time at the moment, but they're ALWAYS the ones rotated in a game (them and another lad who's even smaller, less able but does try a bit harder). There are other players who never get subbed. My worry is that in the future, they'll get less time.

My post was really asking for advice from anyone who's experienced similar, and what they did to try and help their kids without piling on the pressure or pushing them into their shells.

[JQ]

Kitchski said:

My post was really asking for advice from anyone who's experienced similar, and what they did to try and help their kids without piling on the pressure or pushing them into their shells.

I spoke with the coach about game time. I pointed out that the team were entered in a league which contained rules that each child get equal gametime and positions are rotated. More gametime has had a positive impact with my eldest son, who's not a natural footballer.

[Zoon]

Kitchski said:

They do get playing time at the moment, but they're ALWAYS the ones rotated in a game (them and another lad who's even smaller, less able but does try a bit harder). There are other players who never get subbed.

In order to sub everyone equally you need enough players for two teams which can also be a problem.

[JQ]

Zoon said:

Kitchski said:

They do get playing time at the moment, but they're ALWAYS the ones rotated in a game (them and another lad who's even smaller, less able but does try a bit harder). There are other players who never get subbed.

In order to sub everyone equally you need enough players for two teams which can also be a problem.

You don't, equal game time isn't per game, but over the season. Quite easy to do so long as the manager is organised. I run a spreadsheet for my team.

I'm sure Kitchski wouldn't have an issue his kids being subbed, if it was happening every 3 games, I suspect it's because it's every game.

The issue for me is that it creates divisions within the team, the manager is effectively highlighting who he thinks are the worst players - pretty difficult for the kids to ignore that and impact how they treat these players.