The Official Liverpool FC Thread [Vol 12]
Discussion
Pommygranite said:
I read it as 'PC knows he's not going anywhere, his agents completely ballsed it up, he's now in damage control and wants to save face and his agent knows he needs to get back in the clubs good books so PC doesn't get the Sakho treatment'
It is a complete dereliction of duty for his agents not to have put a buy out clause in his contract when it was renewed.Total incompetence.
However, I'll believe it's over on 1st of September.
damn, you got me there. 
Adam B said:
We can all agree to disagree on who has improved and by how much, and there will usually be one of the top 7/8 who surprises us, be it over or under-achieving.
Put simply I like some of our signings (Salah, Solanke) and hope Robertson turns into an astute bit of business, I am not writing anything off, but we have strengthened in areas we were already strong in and not (yet) addressed the one key weakness.
If the only squad changes this summer were VvD and Keita in and some minor players loaned out for experience I would have been delighted. Or two alternatives to VvD and Keita of similar quality.
Serious question Flip based on "speculating about stuff we have no hard facts about"
:
We keep PC, he plays well, and no other changes to top 6 teams - where would you guess LFC will finish this season?
I keep forgetting about Solanke - I think he will turn out well. Salah I think DID strengthen an area we needed - pace and creativity. We only had Mane and suffered when he wasn't around. We still might but we will be better going forward with Salah too.Put simply I like some of our signings (Salah, Solanke) and hope Robertson turns into an astute bit of business, I am not writing anything off, but we have strengthened in areas we were already strong in and not (yet) addressed the one key weakness.
If the only squad changes this summer were VvD and Keita in and some minor players loaned out for experience I would have been delighted. Or two alternatives to VvD and Keita of similar quality.
Serious question Flip based on "speculating about stuff we have no hard facts about"
:We keep PC, he plays well, and no other changes to top 6 teams - where would you guess LFC will finish this season?
Edited by Adam B on Tuesday 22 August 11:49
I'd never heard of Keita before this summer so I'm not really missing him
To answer your Q - if we keep PC, he plays for his world cup place and does well, no other changes... I would stick with what I hoped for (for this coming season) at the end of last season - top 2 or 3 after having competed realistically for the title and a trophy. That would be progress and I reckon we can still do it. Lallana being out for the first third of the season is a blow though.
Our defending leaves me cold but a new player won't sort that on his own - more cover for the CBs might. Which I think RT and others have also said. Guessing you're not as optimistic?
Flip Martian said:
Our defending leaves me cold but a new player won't sort that on his own - more cover for the CBs might. Which I think RT and others have also said. Guessing you're not as optimistic?
How about changing to 3 at the back? Or stop zonal marking and return to traditional marking? Or simply train and train and train on how to defend crosses. I think bringing in some fresh blood to shake things up a bit at the back can hopefully only be a good thing. If all we signed between now and the end of the window is a solid CB, I'd be pretty happy with our transfer dealings this summer.desolate said:
Pommygranite said:
I read it as 'PC knows he's not going anywhere, his agents completely ballsed it up, he's now in damage control and wants to save face and his agent knows he needs to get back in the clubs good books so PC doesn't get the Sakho treatment'
It is a complete dereliction of duty for his agents not to have put a buy out clause in his contract when it was renewed.Total incompetence.
However, I'll believe it's over on 1st of September.
OR - his contract was bigger and more lucrative to him and his a*** of an agent if they agreed not to have a buyout clause. The latter is perhaps more likely.
If Coutinho stays, then he and Lallana play in that advanced 3rd midfield role.
Of the other two roles. Can and who? Milner, Henderson, Wijnaldum?
I don't think any one of those 3 are really suitable. All squad filler, no doubt. But not starting 11 imo. Especially Wijnaldum. What was the stat, Robertson on his debut had more touches than Wijnaldum in all his games this season.
And I agree regarding Sakho. If we're not being anyone then what do we need the money from his sale for. Swallow some pride and re integrate him in to the team.
Of the other two roles. Can and who? Milner, Henderson, Wijnaldum?
I don't think any one of those 3 are really suitable. All squad filler, no doubt. But not starting 11 imo. Especially Wijnaldum. What was the stat, Robertson on his debut had more touches than Wijnaldum in all his games this season.
And I agree regarding Sakho. If we're not being anyone then what do we need the money from his sale for. Swallow some pride and re integrate him in to the team.
Adam B said:
agreed, would like the same approach on Sakho TBH
we all need to let this go, its been spoke about for so long now its boring,,, if Sakho was ever going to get brought back in he would have by now He is as much in Klopps plans as I am its obvious.... whether any of us agree or dont agree we cant change it
type-r said:
How about changing to 3 at the back? Or stop zonal marking and return to traditional marking? Or simply train and train and train on how to defend crosses. I think bringing in some fresh blood to shake things up a bit at the back can hopefully only be a good thing. If all we signed between now and the end of the window is a solid CB, I'd be pretty happy with our transfer dealings this summer.
I would LOVE stopping zonal marking, it seems to be a disaster for us. Unless we have 4 or 5 players willing to get their head on a ball at all costs (and that doesn't seem to be the case). I'd be happy if we DID sign a CB - but I'm not going to get my knickers in a twist about it now. If we do buy one it won't be cos everyone grumbled about the lack of one on here - it'll be cos they've been working on it all along. That's all my take on it, is.Flip Martian said:
To answer your Q - if we keep PC, he plays for his world cup place and does well, no other changes... I would stick with what I hoped for (for this coming season) at the end of last season - top 2 or 3 after having competed realistically for the title and a trophy. That would be progress and I reckon we can still do it. Lallana being out for the first third of the season is a blow though.
Our defending leaves me cold but a new player won't sort that on his own - more cover for the CBs might. Which I think RT and others have also said. Guessing you're not as optimistic?
Correct - I see Utd getting top 4 this season, and I don't see us finishing above Chelsea or City - they have more squad quality to maintain a consistent win ratio, our defense will drop us points and turn wins into draws and draws into losses. That is before we are stretched playing in EuropeOur defending leaves me cold but a new player won't sort that on his own - more cover for the CBs might. Which I think RT and others have also said. Guessing you're not as optimistic?
So that leaves Spurs and Arsenal:
Arsenal have a good new striker but same old frailties (like us) - 50/50 who finishes above who
Spurs will suffer from Wembley but a good side - I think they won't do as well as last season but we have 10 points to make up - again 50/50 who finishes above who
worst case - 6th
best case - 3rd
most likely 4th or 5th with City/Chelsea and Utd above us
RedTrident said:
Big difference between being like them and being out spent by Huddersfield.
I'm not saying we want to be like them, though there are features to their model that are undeniably successful. Meanwhile we have won nothing at all under the stewardship of FSG and any off pitch revenue growth has not translated to a better squad. Our strength in depth for instance was better under Rafa.
You are forgetting we won the League Cup under FSG (and the useless Doglesh too)?I'm not saying we want to be like them, though there are features to their model that are undeniably successful. Meanwhile we have won nothing at all under the stewardship of FSG and any off pitch revenue growth has not translated to a better squad. Our strength in depth for instance was better under Rafa.
Also have we actually been outspent by Huddersfield, or is that just made up to make your point (genuine question, I honestly have no idea)?
Rafa for all the good work and great memories was in a time with a lot less competition from other clubs.
My view is I'd like a few signings to increase the depth in the squad, but to be honest the main issue of defence is much bigger. We've turned good defenders bad, and a lot of that is this zonal marking and the pressing style we play. If Phil comes back we will be the creative person in midfield, and so then having Can/Henderson/Milner is not such an issue as we need someone to hold things up when needed. I also cannot believe FSG have said there is no money available for a new CD/CM if Klopp wanted one. We clearly had a lot available for VvD until the illegal issue happened, so why would it not be available for someone else? That makes me believe it is down to Klopp rather than FSG, unless Klopp feels he can't get the money for the people he wants and so refuses to buy anyone else to put pressure on FSG through the lack of activity making fans unhappy.
Adam B said:
Correct - I see Utd getting top 4 this season, and I don't see us finishing above Chelsea or City - they have more squad quality to maintain a consistent win ratio, our defense will drop us points and turn wins into draws and draws into losses. That is before we are stretched playing in Europe
So that leaves Spurs and Arsenal:
Arsenal have a good new striker but same old frailties (like us) - 50/50 who finishes above who
Spurs will suffer from Wembley but a good side - I think they won't do as well as last season but we have 10 points to make up - again 50/50 who finishes above who
worst case - 6th
best case - 3rd
most likely 4th or 5th with City/Chelsea and Utd above us
I was basing my opinion on the footy we played before xmas last year. And having more guile and speed now with Salah added, to negate teams who put 11 behind the ball. I may be completely wrong, it has been known!So that leaves Spurs and Arsenal:
Arsenal have a good new striker but same old frailties (like us) - 50/50 who finishes above who
Spurs will suffer from Wembley but a good side - I think they won't do as well as last season but we have 10 points to make up - again 50/50 who finishes above who
worst case - 6th
best case - 3rd
most likely 4th or 5th with City/Chelsea and Utd above us
NRS said:
You are forgetting we won the League Cup under FSG (and the useless Doglesh too)?
Also have we actually been outspent by Huddersfield, or is that just made up to make your point (genuine question, I honestly have no idea)?
Rafa for all the good work and great memories was in a time with a lot less competition from other clubs.
My view is I'd like a few signings to increase the depth in the squad, but to be honest the main issue of defence is much bigger. We've turned good defenders bad, and a lot of that is this zonal marking and the pressing style we play. If Phil comes back we will be the creative person in midfield, and so then having Can/Henderson/Milner is not such an issue as we need someone to hold things up when needed. I also cannot believe FSG have said there is no money available for a new CD/CM if Klopp wanted one. We clearly had a lot available for VvD until the illegal issue happened, so why would it not be available for someone else? That makes me believe it is down to Klopp rather than FSG, unless Klopp feels he can't get the money for the people he wants and so refuses to buy anyone else to put pressure on FSG through the lack of activity making fans unhappy.
Some current net spendsAlso have we actually been outspent by Huddersfield, or is that just made up to make your point (genuine question, I honestly have no idea)?
Rafa for all the good work and great memories was in a time with a lot less competition from other clubs.
My view is I'd like a few signings to increase the depth in the squad, but to be honest the main issue of defence is much bigger. We've turned good defenders bad, and a lot of that is this zonal marking and the pressing style we play. If Phil comes back we will be the creative person in midfield, and so then having Can/Henderson/Milner is not such an issue as we need someone to hold things up when needed. I also cannot believe FSG have said there is no money available for a new CD/CM if Klopp wanted one. We clearly had a lot available for VvD until the illegal issue happened, so why would it not be available for someone else? That makes me believe it is down to Klopp rather than FSG, unless Klopp feels he can't get the money for the people he wants and so refuses to buy anyone else to put pressure on FSG through the lack of activity making fans unhappy.
Spurs 36m
Chelsea - £110m
City - £145m
Arsenal - £26.8m
Utd - £140m
Everton - £36m
Leicester £43m
Watford - £37m
Brighton - £39.6m
Hudds - £38.8m
Us - £34.5m
Lets wait till sept 1 to see how this changes...
Adam B said:
m3sye said:
Some current net spends
Spurs 36m
Leicester £43m
Watford - £37m
Brighton - £39.6m
Hudds - £38.8m
Us - £34.5m
Jesus! being outspent by Spurs is just embarrassingSpurs 36m
Leicester £43m
Watford - £37m
Brighton - £39.6m
Hudds - £38.8m
Us - £34.5m
In other news Barca are now interested in Naby Keita, we'll see now how strong RBL resolve really is.
NRS said:
RedTrident said:
Big difference between being like them and being out spent by Huddersfield.
I'm not saying we want to be like them, though there are features to their model that are undeniably successful. Meanwhile we have won nothing at all under the stewardship of FSG and any off pitch revenue growth has not translated to a better squad. Our strength in depth for instance was better under Rafa.
You are forgetting we won the League Cup under FSG (and the useless Doglesh too)?I'm not saying we want to be like them, though there are features to their model that are undeniably successful. Meanwhile we have won nothing at all under the stewardship of FSG and any off pitch revenue growth has not translated to a better squad. Our strength in depth for instance was better under Rafa.
Also have we actually been outspent by Huddersfield, or is that just made up to make your point (genuine question, I honestly have no idea)?
Rafa for all the good work and great memories was in a time with a lot less competition from other clubs.
My view is I'd like a few signings to increase the depth in the squad, but to be honest the main issue of defence is much bigger. We've turned good defenders bad, and a lot of that is this zonal marking and the pressing style we play. If Phil comes back we will be the creative person in midfield, and so then having Can/Henderson/Milner is not such an issue as we need someone to hold things up when needed. I also cannot believe FSG have said there is no money available for a new CD/CM if Klopp wanted one. We clearly had a lot available for VvD until the illegal issue happened, so why would it not be available for someone else? That makes me believe it is down to Klopp rather than FSG, unless Klopp feels he can't get the money for the people he wants and so refuses to buy anyone else to put pressure on FSG through the lack of activity making fans unhappy.
Dalglish got sacked, he was a relic from a past time who should never have been offered the job permanently. Get over it.
Rafa competed at the top in a time of competition. Utd still strong, Chelsea formidable under Moreno, Arsenal still a force and an emerging Manchester City. He thumped Madrid, beat Barca away with Arbeloa debuted and had Messi in his pocket. Again I was there when we sang we won in Catalina, Everton shop in Matalan. How times have changed.
What good defenders do we have that have turned bad?
I refuse to believe that Klopp is saying because he hasn't signed VvD or Keita then he wants no one.
You think we had a lot available to sign VvD. I think it was a ruse. FSG were just toying and f
ked up the signing on purpose. The cock ups in our nearly signings under them is not something new. We've had the entirety of the window after the letter was sent. That isn't on Klopp mate and you know it. He is not responsible for transfers. It's up to the club to identify targets. Tell me, what targets have they identified in the 4 windows under Klopp? Matip on a free and a left back from Hull. m3sye said:
Some current net spends
Spurs 36m
Chelsea - £110m
City - £145m
Arsenal - £26.8m
Utd - £140m
Everton - £36m
Leicester £43m
Watford - £37m
Brighton - £39.6m
Hudds - £38.8m
Us - £34.5m
Lets wait till sept 1 to see how this changes...
By the time we've sold Lazer and Sakho, we will be in profit. Spurs 36m
Chelsea - £110m
City - £145m
Arsenal - £26.8m
Utd - £140m
Everton - £36m
Leicester £43m
Watford - £37m
Brighton - £39.6m
Hudds - £38.8m
Us - £34.5m
Lets wait till sept 1 to see how this changes...
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