What the **** is wrong with people?
Discussion
pavarotti1980 said:
C70R said:
Staggering debating. You've really nailed this.
C70R said:
If everything that got thrown onto the pitch resulted in a fan being banned, we'd probably end up with half-empty stadiums.
I see it at many corner kicks, where the poor player is trying get on with his job and ignore the detritus landing around him. He's trying to put out of his mind that one of these objects might hit him and/or injure him.
Remember when we saw that at the Davis Cup tennis? No, nor me.
No it was the Australian Open with crowd problems but carry on I see it at many corner kicks, where the poor player is trying get on with his job and ignore the detritus landing around him. He's trying to put out of his mind that one of these objects might hit him and/or injure him.
Remember when we saw that at the Davis Cup tennis? No, nor me.
https://www.foxnews.com/sports/fan-ejected-fight-b...
Edited by pavarotti1980 on Tuesday 24th May 09:27
pavarotti1980 said:
C70R said:
If everything that got thrown onto the pitch resulted in a fan being banned, we'd probably end up with half-empty stadiums.
I see it at many corner kicks, where the poor player is trying get on with his job and ignore the detritus landing around him. He's trying to put out of his mind that one of these objects might hit him and/or injure him.
Remember when we saw that at the Davis Cup tennis? No, nor me.
No it was the Australian Open but carry on I see it at many corner kicks, where the poor player is trying get on with his job and ignore the detritus landing around him. He's trying to put out of his mind that one of these objects might hit him and/or injure him.
Remember when we saw that at the Davis Cup tennis? No, nor me.
https://www.foxnews.com/sports/fan-ejected-fight-b...
How does that relate to an endemic problem with violence in football?
Or objects being thrown onto the pitch at football?
C70R said:
Right. Two people fighting over COVID masks in an isolated incident.
How does that relate to an endemic problem with violence in football?
Same tournamentHow does that relate to an endemic problem with violence in football?
https://www.express.co.uk/sport/tennis/1555638/Mat...
French open
https://www.eurosport.co.uk/tennis/roland-garros/2...
Oh and another
https://www.express.co.uk/sport/tennis/1447828/Nov...
Dislikeable bunch these tennis fans
pavarotti1980 said:
C70R said:
Right. Two people fighting over COVID masks in an isolated incident.
How does that relate to an endemic problem with violence in football?
Same tournamentHow does that relate to an endemic problem with violence in football?
https://www.express.co.uk/sport/tennis/1555638/Mat...
If that's your standard for a "problem", you should have a "problem" every time a footballer approaches the touchline near opposing fans. Dozens of (largely white, middle-aged male) 'fans' screaming abuse and waving obscene hand gestures is the norm.
What you've highlighted is unpleasant, but far from the norm.
C70R said:
Again, a largely isolated incident.
If that's your standard for a "problem", you should have a "problem" every time a footballer approaches the touchline near opposing fans. Dozens of (largely white, middle-aged male) 'fans' screaming abuse and waving obscene hand gestures is the norm.
No I am merely pointing out you blindingly obvious hypocrisy. Various problems occur in every sport yet you pick on one. If that's your standard for a "problem", you should have a "problem" every time a footballer approaches the touchline near opposing fans. Dozens of (largely white, middle-aged male) 'fans' screaming abuse and waving obscene hand gestures is the norm.
May I suggest you don't watch attend or involve yourself in football if it offends you so much. Stick to rugby where the players are the ones fighting and not the fans
So by your reckoning if it happens in Tennis or Rugby it's always isolated. But in football it's endemic and the majority are involved (seeing as you already questioned the fact that it's a minority causing trouble, you presumably DO think it's a majority)?
The fact that it happens in Tennis now at all is surely endemic of a wider problem. Football fans have been going on the pitch over the last few years - but in celebration, and not attacking players/managers/officials. It has happened in some countries overseas. The fact that it IS now happening in football is surely now indicative of a wider problem that needs sorting. Action and solutions can come from within football but ignoring it in other sports doesn't help.
Don't blur the lines by painting all footy fans as louts because you happen to object to sweary songs. Running on the pitch and attacking people should be an urgent problem. People singing songs about disasters and deaths is disgusting and should also be stamped out. I don't know anyone who condones that. But a small group of people singing (and in a stadium of 40-50000, even a few hundred is small) obscenities makes a loud noise.
A few hundred people singing "we can see you holding hands" is hardly in the same league as either of those. You may be offended by it but most of the 40000 in the stadium won't be. Just because YOU are offended by particular things - well as Stephen Fry said "who cares?". You don't make the rules. If you don't like that, go elsewhere. If you want to have a genuine discussion about tackling increasing hooliganism, by all means join in with that.
The fact that it happens in Tennis now at all is surely endemic of a wider problem. Football fans have been going on the pitch over the last few years - but in celebration, and not attacking players/managers/officials. It has happened in some countries overseas. The fact that it IS now happening in football is surely now indicative of a wider problem that needs sorting. Action and solutions can come from within football but ignoring it in other sports doesn't help.
Don't blur the lines by painting all footy fans as louts because you happen to object to sweary songs. Running on the pitch and attacking people should be an urgent problem. People singing songs about disasters and deaths is disgusting and should also be stamped out. I don't know anyone who condones that. But a small group of people singing (and in a stadium of 40-50000, even a few hundred is small) obscenities makes a loud noise.
A few hundred people singing "we can see you holding hands" is hardly in the same league as either of those. You may be offended by it but most of the 40000 in the stadium won't be. Just because YOU are offended by particular things - well as Stephen Fry said "who cares?". You don't make the rules. If you don't like that, go elsewhere. If you want to have a genuine discussion about tackling increasing hooliganism, by all means join in with that.
Edited by Flip Martian on Tuesday 24th May 09:58
mickk said:
Oops you've played the colour card, good work.
Who would have thought that there were more white, middle aged men at football? I wonder if there’s also lots of white, middle aged men at the rugby as well? How many popular sports do not have white, middle aged men as their largest percentage of fans?
C70R is a Volvo, yes? I should imagine that the majority of Volvo owners fall into the white, middle aged male category myself.
What of it C70R?
Flip Martian said:
So by your reckoning if it happens in Tennis or Rugby it's always isolated. But in football it's endemic and the majority are involved (seeing as you already questioned the fact that it's a minority causing trouble, you presumably DO think it's a majority)?
Until you can show me any data that trumps the actual data I've provided numerous times in this thread, I won't believe it's anywhere near as much of a problem in any other sport as it is in football.But sure, feel free to continue the whataboutism rather than admitting the problem.
gazza285 said:
This is the point I've made a number of times. When an incident happens in football it's headline news. Everyone gets to hear about it and the clubs and fans are widely called out. When the same thing happens in rugby it doesn't make the top of sport pages and goes unnoticed. Even if it does get noticed there isn't the same reaction. Nobody really cares for some reason. Reading the club's statement. "Alcohol was thrown". That gives the impression that fans and players were splashed with alcohol, not that pints were thrown. When something is thrown in football it's a bottle, it's a missile, it's a projectile. It's never been described as throwing water or Coca-Cola at players before.
It's strange that two identical incidents can end up with a completely different reaction and tone.
Edited by Driver101 on Tuesday 24th May 09:56
Flip Martian said:
Don't blur the lines by painting all footy fans as louts because you happen to object to sweary songs. Running on the pitch and attacking people should be an urgent problem. People singing songs about disasters and deaths is disgusting and should also be stamped out. I don't know anyone who condones that. But a small group of people singing (and in a stadium of 40-50000, even a few hundred is small) obscenities makes a loud noise.
A few hundred people singing "we can see you holding hands" is hardly in the same league as either of those. You may be offended by it but most of the 40000 in the stadium won't be. Just because YOU are offended by particular things - well as Stephen Fry said "who cares?". You don't make the rules. If you don't like that, go elsewhere. If you want to have a genuine discussion about increasing hooliganism, by all means join in with that.
If you don't see a problem with thousands of fans singing racist, homophobic and sectarian songs, I can't help you.A few hundred people singing "we can see you holding hands" is hardly in the same league as either of those. You may be offended by it but most of the 40000 in the stadium won't be. Just because YOU are offended by particular things - well as Stephen Fry said "who cares?". You don't make the rules. If you don't like that, go elsewhere. If you want to have a genuine discussion about increasing hooliganism, by all means join in with that.
If the football marketing machine has convinced you that it's an intrinsic part of the atmosphere or the "rivalries", then you're beyond help.
Singing about and mocking a Korean player eating dogs is racist. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's fans' ethnicity is racist. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's fans' sexuality is homophobic. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's tragedy (Munich, Sala etc.) is horrendous. No debate.
Singing horrible things about a team's fans' religion is horrendous. No debate.
But you think all of this is fine? And that if anyone has a problem with it, they should just "go elsewhere"?
C70R said:
If you don't see a problem with thousands of fans singing racist, homophobic and sectarian songs, I can't help you.
If the football marketing machine has convinced you that it's an intrinsic part of the atmosphere or the "rivalries", then you're beyond help.
Singing about and mocking a Korean player eating dogs is racist. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's fans' ethnicity is racist. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's fans' sexuality is homophobic. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's tragedy (Munich, Sala etc.) is horrendous. No debate.
Singing horrible things about a team's fans' religion is horrendous. No debate.
But you think all of this is fine? And that if anyone has a problem with it, they should just "go elsewhere"?
Have you got any evidence of thousands of fans doing that? If the football marketing machine has convinced you that it's an intrinsic part of the atmosphere or the "rivalries", then you're beyond help.
Singing about and mocking a Korean player eating dogs is racist. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's fans' ethnicity is racist. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's fans' sexuality is homophobic. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's tragedy (Munich, Sala etc.) is horrendous. No debate.
Singing horrible things about a team's fans' religion is horrendous. No debate.
But you think all of this is fine? And that if anyone has a problem with it, they should just "go elsewhere"?
Driver101 said:
gazza285 said:
This is the point I've made a number of times. When an incident happens in football it's headline news. Everyone gets to hear about it and the clubs and fans are widely called out. When the same thing happens in rugby it doesn't make the top of sport pages and goes unnoticed. Even if it does get noticed there isn't the same reaction. Nobody really cares for some reason. Reading the club's statement. "Alcohol was thrown". That gives the impression that fans and players were splashed with alcohol, not that pints were thrown. When something is thrown in football it's a bottle, it's a missile, it's a projectile. It's never been described as throwing water or Coca-Cola at players before.
It's strange that two identical incidents can end up with a completely different reaction and tone.
Edited by Driver101 on Tuesday 24th May 09:56
I suspect if any other sport had a problem approaching that level, it would get the same reaction.
C70R said:
Until you can show me any data that trumps the actual data I've provided numerous times in this thread, I won't believe it's anywhere near as much of a problem in any other sport as it is in football.
But sure, feel free to continue the whataboutism rather than admitting the problem.
I pointed out in never used to happen in those sports but IS NOW STARTING TO. I never said it was a big problem. But it is now appearing in those sports. Nothing to do with whataboutism, grow up.But sure, feel free to continue the whataboutism rather than admitting the problem.
C70R said:
If you don't see a problem with thousands of fans singing racist, homophobic and sectarian songs, I can't help you.
If the football marketing machine has convinced you that it's an intrinsic part of the atmosphere or the "rivalries", then you're beyond help.
Singing about and mocking a Korean player eating dogs is racist. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's fans' ethnicity is racist. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's fans' sexuality is homophobic. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's tragedy (Munich, Sala etc.) is horrendous. No debate.
Singing horrible things about a team's fans' religion is horrendous. No debate.
But you think all of this is fine? And that if anyone has a problem with it, they should just "go elsewhere"?
It's like if someone says "apples" you start talking about oranges. You're lumping in everything you're offended by and adding it to everything I said was offensive. And then suggesting I find NONE of it offensive, to support you repeating yourself.If the football marketing machine has convinced you that it's an intrinsic part of the atmosphere or the "rivalries", then you're beyond help.
Singing about and mocking a Korean player eating dogs is racist. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's fans' ethnicity is racist. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's fans' sexuality is homophobic. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's tragedy (Munich, Sala etc.) is horrendous. No debate.
Singing horrible things about a team's fans' religion is horrendous. No debate.
But you think all of this is fine? And that if anyone has a problem with it, they should just "go elsewhere"?
It's a pity you deliberately choose to misread what people say so you can say the same boring things over and over and not actually engage in sensible debate. For someone who can clearly string 2 words together, that would appear to be a pity. But you are clearly more interested in trolling, so I'll leave you to bait others. Cheers.
pavarotti1980 said:
C70R said:
If you don't see a problem with thousands of fans singing racist, homophobic and sectarian songs, I can't help you.
If the football marketing machine has convinced you that it's an intrinsic part of the atmosphere or the "rivalries", then you're beyond help.
Singing about and mocking a Korean player eating dogs is racist. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's fans' ethnicity is racist. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's fans' sexuality is homophobic. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's tragedy (Munich, Sala etc.) is horrendous. No debate.
Singing horrible things about a team's fans' religion is horrendous. No debate.
But you think all of this is fine? And that if anyone has a problem with it, they should just "go elsewhere"?
Have you got any evidence of thousands of fans doing that? If the football marketing machine has convinced you that it's an intrinsic part of the atmosphere or the "rivalries", then you're beyond help.
Singing about and mocking a Korean player eating dogs is racist. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's fans' ethnicity is racist. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's fans' sexuality is homophobic. No debate.
Singing about and mocking a team's tragedy (Munich, Sala etc.) is horrendous. No debate.
Singing horrible things about a team's fans' religion is horrendous. No debate.
But you think all of this is fine? And that if anyone has a problem with it, they should just "go elsewhere"?
https://en.yna.co.kr/view/AEN20211005002600315
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juO_mbkvepQ&ab...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0sgmsbEPm4g&ab...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7gxlW9d9tc&ab...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JMosG5LEALQ&ab...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3tkLKhJzGk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DY6s3gmew7c&t=...
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/o...
Nah, not really.
C70R said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-22toakr9o
https://en.yna.co.kr/view/AEN20211005002600315
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juO_mbkvepQ&ab...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0sgmsbEPm4g&ab...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7gxlW9d9tc&ab...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JMosG5LEALQ&ab...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3tkLKhJzGk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DY6s3gmew7c&t=...
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/o...
Nah, not really.
No I want stats, not something you have seen https://en.yna.co.kr/view/AEN20211005002600315
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juO_mbkvepQ&ab...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0sgmsbEPm4g&ab...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7gxlW9d9tc&ab...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JMosG5LEALQ&ab...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3tkLKhJzGk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DY6s3gmew7c&t=...
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/o...
Nah, not really.
ps I was 99% sure you would post YouTube links completely ignoring the post you made 2 pages back about "seeing something" not being good enough. Jump back in your box you clown
Edited by pavarotti1980 on Tuesday 24th May 10:14
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