Discussion
fesuvious said:
What an absurd response Eric.
There are more planets than there are grains of sand on a beach. To suggest that intelligent life may well exist elsewhere is not only plausible, but likely.
There's also a serious amount of evidence that 4 years ago an object came within our range from outside our solar system that was under some sort of intelligent control.
The David Fravor interview and footage on it own is compelling.
Let alone the thousands of pilots accounts
Bit of a stretch to suggest that there is a serious amount of evidence supporting Avi Loeb's theories about Oumuamua - that it was some kind of alien solar sail - compared to the more plausible theories of hydrogen outgassing causing the anomalies. It's nice to think that it was some form of alien probe, but now it's detected evidence of our existence we've got to wait another 400 million years - give or take - for the follow up party to arrive.There are more planets than there are grains of sand on a beach. To suggest that intelligent life may well exist elsewhere is not only plausible, but likely.
There's also a serious amount of evidence that 4 years ago an object came within our range from outside our solar system that was under some sort of intelligent control.
The David Fravor interview and footage on it own is compelling.
Let alone the thousands of pilots accounts
As I've said before, the nature of the cosmos at the the same time makes it very likely intelligent life has evolved elsewhere (because there is so much of it) whilst also making it vanishingly unlikely we would ever interact with it (because of the vast distances involved). Interesting topics for debate though - but can lead to the occasional infestation of these parts by woo enthusiasts (or, if you will enthwoosiasts) looking at the first part - the statistical chances of alien life - and taking that as carte blanche to start dribbling on about every unexplained visual observation being down to aliens, cheerfully disregarding (or being genuinely obtuse) as to the second part of the equation. Their assertions differ very little from those from proponents of the supernatural and mysticism, in that they are invariably a load of neurotic arse.
The papers linked to from the article on superluminal warp drives above are interesting, and hint at the more general proposition that at incredibly high energy density levels - higher than anything we've ever seen existing in the observable universe - spacetime may have significantly different properties than those now existing. On a practical level however, these warp drives would leave massive, livid scars across space as they mush solar masses worth of energy into small volumes. We've never seen that anywhere, and I suspect should such a drive appear in the solar system the effective difference between the drive being turned off as it stops to visit, and a good old fashioned supernova would be lost on the general population, as would everything else.
Edited by eharding on Wednesday 28th April 21:48
Eric Mc said:
It's not an appropriate topic for the Science forum. It's about peoples' fantasies , wishful thinking and pure guessing. There is no rational, scientific discussion to be had.
Sorry Eric, and I don’t wish to come across that I’m singling you out here as I enjoy 99% of what you post, but I’m afraid I’m going to have to disagree with your statement that there is no rational, scientific discussion to be had.It’s almost a given that there is life out there somewhere. Sure, that life might only be single cell organism, or it could be something far in advance of where we are now. Just think how much we as a species have advanced over the last 200 years, let alone the last 2000 years.
I acknowledge though that the unimaginable distances involved make the prospect of coming across other life very unlikely, but not entirely impossible.
Personally I hope these recent sightings aren’t life from other planets. If they are, then we are utterly f
ked !Mind you, if this technology is from this planet, then we could be equally as f
ked anyway.A book I read a long time ago, its heavy going. 
A NASA physicist witnessed a UFO that exhibited characteristics outside his understanding, the book explores the possible propulsion systems and how the occupants survived.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Unconventional-Flying-Obj...
A NASA physicist witnessed a UFO that exhibited characteristics outside his understanding, the book explores the possible propulsion systems and how the occupants survived.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Unconventional-Flying-Obj...
105.4 said:
Sorry Eric, and I don’t wish to come across that I’m singling you out here as I enjoy 99% of what you post, but I’m afraid I’m going to have to disagree with your statement that there is no rational, scientific discussion to be had.
It’s almost a given that there is life out there somewhere. Sure, that life might only be single cell organism, or it could be something far in advance of where we are now. Just think how much we as a species have advanced over the last 200 years, let alone the last 2000 years.
I acknowledge though that the unimaginable distances involved make the prospect of coming across other life very unlikely, but not entirely impossible.
Personally I hope these recent sightings aren’t life from other planets. If they are, then we are utterly fked !
Mind you, if this technology is from this planet, then we could be equally as fked anyway.
I’ve been reading about the universe and the possibilities of life elsewhere for as long as I can remember.It’s almost a given that there is life out there somewhere. Sure, that life might only be single cell organism, or it could be something far in advance of where we are now. Just think how much we as a species have advanced over the last 200 years, let alone the last 2000 years.
I acknowledge though that the unimaginable distances involved make the prospect of coming across other life very unlikely, but not entirely impossible.
Personally I hope these recent sightings aren’t life from other planets. If they are, then we are utterly f
ked !Mind you, if this technology is from this planet, then we could be equally as f
ked anyway.I have no issues with discussing such matters. I’ve even attended lectures on the topic.
It’s trying to link that topic with the ignorance of those who don’t know what they are looking at that I have no interest in.
Eric Mc said:
I’ve been reading about the universe and the possibilities of life elsewhere for as long as I can remember.
I have no issues with discussing such matters. I’ve even attended lectures on the topic.
It’s trying to link that topic with the ignorance of those who don’t know what they are looking at that I have no interest in.
On every thread there are people who know less than me, sorry, I meant you, you don’t have to engage with them all, or it can get exhausting. But get back in the game !I have no issues with discussing such matters. I’ve even attended lectures on the topic.
It’s trying to link that topic with the ignorance of those who don’t know what they are looking at that I have no interest in.
https://ui.adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/2013AcAau..89..2...
This is a link, from a Smithsonian / NASA / Harvard thingy that talks about alien objects on the moon, and they seem to be taking it seriously. Can we have a little smile?
BT Summers said:
I hope that this thread doesn't deteriorate into the farce that we saw with the Ghosts and various religion based threads where people discuss an experience that they cannot explain and jerks come along and shout their mouths off.
I can think of one objectionable individual in particular who bullied an elderly and long term member.
Peeved me off that. People swinging in but then it's the internet and you get everyone from both ends including the deluded on ghosts. I can think of one objectionable individual in particular who bullied an elderly and long term member.
I live in a house where both the last owners wives died here and I've experienced something at work (old nunnery) where upon further investigation staff there never wanted to be the last person in.
I've moved and sat with numerous dead bodies so I'm not open to ooo what's that noise?
There have been things that I've experienced that can not be explained away.
eharding said:
Bit of a stretch to suggest that there is a serious amount of evidence supporting Avi Loeb's theories about Oumuamua - that it was some kind of alien solar sail - compared to the more plausible theories of hydrogen outgassing causing the anomalies. It's nice to think that it was some form of alien probe, but now it's detected evidence of our existence we've got to wait another 400 million years - give or take - for the follow up party to arrive.
As I've said before, the nature of the cosmos at the the same time makes it very likely intelligent life has evolved elsewhere (because there is so much of it) whilst also making it vanishingly unlikely we would ever interact with it (because of the vast distances involved). Interesting topics for debate though - but can lead to the occasional infestation of these parts by woo enthusiasts (or, if you will enthwoosiasts) looking at the first part - the statistical chances of alien life - and taking that as carte blanche to start dribbling on about every unexplained visual observation being down to aliens, cheerfully disregarding (or being genuinely obtuse) as to the second part of the equation. Their assertions differ very little from those from proponents of the supernatural and mysticism, in that they are invariably a load of neurotic arse.
The papers linked to from the article on superluminal warp drives above are interesting, and hint at the more general proposition that at incredibly high energy density levels - higher than anything we've ever seen existing in the observable universe - spacetime may have significantly different properties than those now existing. On a practical level however, these warp drives would leave massive, livid scars across space as they mush solar masses worth of energy into small volumes. We've never seen that anywhere, and I suspect should such a drive appear in the solar system the effective difference between the drive being turned off as it stops to visit, and a good old fashioned supernova would be lost on the general population, as would everything else.
The point of posting that link is that if the maths show a possibility then a practical solution may be possible. Even in the papers discussed, the mass necessary drops ftom known universe to Sun.As I've said before, the nature of the cosmos at the the same time makes it very likely intelligent life has evolved elsewhere (because there is so much of it) whilst also making it vanishingly unlikely we would ever interact with it (because of the vast distances involved). Interesting topics for debate though - but can lead to the occasional infestation of these parts by woo enthusiasts (or, if you will enthwoosiasts) looking at the first part - the statistical chances of alien life - and taking that as carte blanche to start dribbling on about every unexplained visual observation being down to aliens, cheerfully disregarding (or being genuinely obtuse) as to the second part of the equation. Their assertions differ very little from those from proponents of the supernatural and mysticism, in that they are invariably a load of neurotic arse.
The papers linked to from the article on superluminal warp drives above are interesting, and hint at the more general proposition that at incredibly high energy density levels - higher than anything we've ever seen existing in the observable universe - spacetime may have significantly different properties than those now existing. On a practical level however, these warp drives would leave massive, livid scars across space as they mush solar masses worth of energy into small volumes. We've never seen that anywhere, and I suspect should such a drive appear in the solar system the effective difference between the drive being turned off as it stops to visit, and a good old fashioned supernova would be lost on the general population, as would everything else.
Edited by eharding on Wednesday 28th April 21:48
In 70 years we went from bi-planes to landing on the moon.
In 150 years we've gone from steam engines to viable nano-motors.
This absolutely doesn't prove the existence of aliens and them visiting earth, but the science is suggesting it could be possible and given we've been successful at scaling technology, there is no reason why some other intelligent life couldn't.
It's interesting to discuss said science...and some of us even enjoy a good flying saucer story.
I saw a UFO a couple of years ago. It was massive, silent, and did not move remotely like any large aircraft.
I then realised it was an aerobatic drone, close enough to seem huge, but far enough away to not hear it...proper father dougal moment.
In my defence, it was night and I was very drunk.
fesuvious said:
Oumuamua deviated.
Loeb explains clearly why gas isn't possible.
He also explains the size of the object and how it cannot be organic.
Not sure where you're getting this from - his original paper is here: "Could Solar Radiation Pressure Explain Oumuamua’s Peculiar Acceleration?", where he merely cites Rafikov's work asserting that outgassing would induce the object to spin at a greater rate than that observed. He also observes that the colour of the object does closely resemble that of the surface of organic-rich Solar system objects, but proposes that this could be explained by the accretion of interstellar dust. Loeb explains clearly why gas isn't possible.
He also explains the size of the object and how it cannot be organic.
I don't see anywhere that he is asserting the object was "under some sort of intelligent control" - just that the orbital anomalies could be explained by it having a geometry consistent with artificial construction. Even if it was, it was tumbling arse over tit and covered in crap, which isn't indicative of something in good working order. Again, the best estimate of the last time the object was near another system was between 400 to 500 million years ago, so if it was sent deliberately someone was playing a very long game indeed.
Finally, there's an interesting piece of work here, which argues the orbital anomalies can be modelled without the need for exterior factors - be it solar radiation pressure on a light sail or outgassing - if we question the uncertainty ranges of some of the initial observations. Probably doesn't give scope for a follow-up book and a nice little boost for the retirement fund of the authors though....
Edited by eharding on Thursday 29th April 11:00
This science topic is receiving more and more mainline news coverage now in advance of June's report or announcement by the Pentagon.
James Clapper, former Director of National Intelligence on CNN, a few days ago. among other important statements he said this: "I don't know why we haven't been more transparent about it in the past and I'm part of that crime I guess"
https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/videos/politics/2021/05/17...
James Clapper, former Director of National Intelligence on CNN, a few days ago. among other important statements he said this: "I don't know why we haven't been more transparent about it in the past and I'm part of that crime I guess"
https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/videos/politics/2021/05/17...
RegMolehusband said:
This science topic is receiving more and more mainline news coverage now in advance of June's report or announcement by the Pentagon.
James Clapper, former Director of National Intelligence on CNN, a few days ago. among other important statements he said this: "I don't know why we haven't been more transparent about it in the past and I'm part of that crime I guess"
https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/videos/politics/2021/05/17...
I'm very cynical about this disclosure that is coming. It was attached as a rider to the covid relief bill, and they were given months to prepare what they had. Or months to shred/dispose of what they don't want to disclose. I'm not talking about little green men, but you know if the CIA had happened to hack the Chinese military and got the plans to the secret drones they won't want to be releasing that.James Clapper, former Director of National Intelligence on CNN, a few days ago. among other important statements he said this: "I don't know why we haven't been more transparent about it in the past and I'm part of that crime I guess"
https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/videos/politics/2021/05/17...
It will be a bunch of " we don't know", here's some grainy videos that may or may not show something.
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