Anyone ever had a trailer tyre blow out?

[Fun Bus]

Seems very harsh, CW and I wish you well in your interview.

Is it worth asking if they could check CCTV footage of you coming into the yard at the end of the shift this incident revolves around? I'm not a driver as you know, but if you were pulling one of your firms DD's - would a blow out be as apparent considering they're fitted with much smaller wheels than on your typical, single deck trailer? (IYSWIM)

[philthy]

Not all tyres "blow out" though mate.
If you had a puncture, the tyre would deflate, then delaminate, and break up. After it has broken up, the rim damage would occur.
I would bet my right nut on this being the case. It is possible of course that you wouldn't hear a full on blowout, but it is extremely unlikely, that you would hear a puncture, or even feel the effects.
I once had a brake cam go over, and stick on the top of the lobe, locking the rear trailer axle offside up. Luckily for me, a motorist alerted me to it, because I didn't see/hear a thing.
Good luck, but being honest, I don't think you'll need it. Be firm, after all, you did your checks. You're not the first this has happened to, and won't be the last.

[philthy]

Just read through again.
Was the tyre still on the rim, and if so, how did the damage occur?

[Cock Womble 7]

philthy said:

Was the tyre still on the rim

Yes.

philthy said:

and if so, how did the damage occur?

If I knew that, I wouldn't be in the st would I?


Here's a picture of the damage:



(Sorry for the poor quality, but it's a scan of a photocopy of a printed photo.)

[Humper]

Looks like it's clipped a high kerb? So possibly your fault for cutting a corner?
But ffs, what kind of firm do you work for? It's a bit of damage, it's a fkin wheel, it's not like you mowed down a bus queue!
Had you used a bridge as a can opener or something i could see the point but honestly, someone should have ripped you a new one for the wheel, job done, we've all damaged stuff, i once reversed a trailer to within 2 inches from the front of a 7.5 tonner, sadly it was 2 inches inside the cab..... I got a(well deserved) bking. 2 weeks susp for a tyre? Time to find a new job.

[Cock Womble 7]

Thing is, I'm not being investigated for the damage, I'm being investigated because I didn't report the damage.

Having seen the damage now, do you think it's plausible that I could have done that and not noticed?

[4key]

Check out my drunken ramblings from last night, I dont even remember posting that

Id say looking at that, the best excuse would be that the tyre had deflated and then you drove over something big and hard afterwards to damage the rim. Thats a big clump in the wheel and theres no way that you wouldnt have felt it if you did that with the tyre inflated. IMO It would be quite easy to miss that damage if you wasnt looking for it and wasnt walking towards the trailer from the side, rather than walking down the side from the cab.

e.t.a. yeah, if theyre suspending you for a week over stuff like that go find another job.

[philthy]

Cock Womble 7 said:

If I knew that, I wouldn't be in the st would I?

I'm trying to help.

That wheel has hit something. It bent the rim, and punctured the tyre.
That is how it happened, so you know that now, and so do we. It wasn't a blowout.
Depending on the load, it may well have been like that for miles.
I would go further, and suggest that hitting something like a brick, and the tyre not blowing out, just deflating, would be very difficult to notice.
As you are not compelled to do an end of day walk round, I would also suggest that it would have been unlikely to spot without, and if the trailer was empty, even more so.
As pointed out, an unloaded trailer will carry a punctured tyre for a long way.

Some more info for you:
That wheel hit whatever it was that caused the damage at speed. You would not ding the rim like that shunting in the yard, or clipping a kerb. It would be much more likely to stop the rig, or climb over the object.

It would be useful to know which axle it was, because if it was the rear, the only other way to tt it like that, would be to reverse at high speed into something? I'm presuming it wasn't?

My take on it, is you've hit something which has dinged the rim, and the tyre has remained relatively intact, because you were unloaded/not heavy. returning to the yard, and not walking round, you were unaware of it.

Sorry if I'm being unhelpful........


Edit to add:
Looking at the photo again, it is difficult to tell, but it might be the N/S front axle on the trailer? If so, it would be possible to ding the rim like that on a kerb, but you'd have to be doing 20mph plus, and there is absolutely no way you wouldn't notice, as it would nearly turn the trailer over!

Further edit to add:
Looking at your profile, if it was a step frame, like the one in your profile pic, it would be almost impossible to reverse into something without the trailer hitting it before the wheel?

Edited by philthy on Sunday 29th July 14:19

[Cock Womble 7]

philthy said:

I'm trying to help.

I know mate. Sorry to snap, I'm just a bit wound up at the moment.

Right, the damaged tyre/wheel was the N/S/F on one of these trailers:



The trailer was lightly loaded at the time, with just a few bits on the "swan neck" - but not even enough to make the lift axle drop.

So you're saying it's entirely possible that I drove over something that punctured the tyre and dented the rim and didn't notice? That's quite comforting.

When I came off the M1 and was coming up the A45, I did hear a "dull thud", which I put down to the stuff on the back moving slightly. It certainly wasn't a sound I would associate with a tyre going like that.

I checked my mirrors to make sure nothing was hanging out of the curtains, took it easy for the rest of the way (under 2 miles) and opened the curtains very carefully when I tipped - just in case anything had shifted. It hadn't; the load was still all strapped in and secure. I didn't need to fully open the curtain, so didn't walk back as far as the rear axles.

So, perhaps, my "dull thud" was the tyre hitting something?

philthy said:

Sorry if I'm being unhelpful....

You're not. Quite the opposite. Thank you.

[4key]

Thought that we were talking about supersingles not those stupid little things, that changes everything. Very easy to destroy them clipping anything at speed and theyll go all day long with no air in them, the wheel next to it will hold all of the weight. You would never notice that without looking for it.

[philthy]

4key said:

Thought that we were talking about supersingles not those stupid little things, that changes everything. Very easy to destroy them clipping anything at speed and theyll go all day long with no air in them, the wheel next to it will hold all of the weight. You would never notice that without looking for it.

This
The photo was very deceptive, I thought we were looking at some serious whack on a 22.5.

Quite simply, you have hit something at the side of the motorway.
It has dinged the rim, and split the tyre. Being lightly loaded, it hasn't destroyed the tyre, just punctured it.
Frankly, I would be very surprised if you had noticed, barring seeing the object disappear under the wheel.

As for not reporting, without doing a walk around, nobody would notice that.
If it was such a glaring defect, how come nobody spotted it as you came into the yard, and reversed into the bay?
How can you report, what you do not know about?
If you want to add some weight to this, get a camera, and go and have a look at the other trailers in the yard, and photograph any dings/nicks in them.
When they ask you "do you really expect us to believe that you could do this amount of damage and not notice", produce the pictures.

[Cock Womble 7]

philthy said:

How can you report, what you do not know about?

This is my point exactly.

And if they can't prove "reasonable belief" that I intentionally didn't report it...

They're dragging up my previous "incident" record - which I'll admit is a bit poor. But the very fact that I have an incident record clearly shows that I report everything.

Why would I not report something like this (if I'd noticed it)?

[philthy]

Cock Womble 7 said:

And if they can't prove "reasonable belief" that I intentionally didn't report it...

IANAL, but to safely dismiss you, they would have to prove that you knew about it, and didn't report it.

Will somebody remind me how you go about proving somebody knows something? If it was unreasonable that you hadn't noticed, it would be difficult, but after hearing the whole story, it isn't even reasonable to expect that?

[Humper]

Why would you not report it? Going by the type of co you seem to work for the next driver will report it straightaway, tbh sometimes my checks are a bit lax, but nobody but me drives my wagon, but even on my worst day i'm not going to miss that!
And if i ever pick up a trailer i'm very picky, as i reckon any driver is cos if you miss owt it's your arse on the line.
As was said, hard for them to prove what they think you know.

[Cock Womble 7]

Thanks for all the advice chaps.

My ex girlfriend is a top bod in HR and she's been brilliant with advice on that side of things. All in all, I think I've got plenty of ammunition to put up a good case for the defence.

Wish me luck.

[philthy]

I don't think you'll need it, but good luck anyway

[Cock Womble 7]

Final Written Warning.

I'm back in bloody work tomorrow!

[4key]

Think that its time to start looking for another job. One of my main requirements is having a transport manger that is on my side, if im constantly having to explain things/my actions/the reason why their planning all went tits up, then i dont want to work there. If theyre digging you out about stuff like that, unfortunately your days are numbered anyway and their just going through the motions.

Now give us a giggle and tell us about your previous incident record

[Cock Womble 7]

4key said:

Think that its time to start looking for another job. One of my main requirements is having a transport manger that is on my side, if im constantly having to explain things/my actions/the reason why their planning all went tits up, then i dont want to work there. If theyre digging you out about stuff like that, unfortunately your days are numbered anyway and their just going through the motions.

Well, his argument was that having heard the "dull thud" and attributing that to the load shifting, and then checking the load and finding it all safe and secure, I should have thought "So, if it wasn't the load, where did that dull thud come from?" and checked the entire vehicle.

Fair point.

4key said:

Now give us a giggle and tell us about your previous incident record

OK, if you insist.

Date	Location	Details	Damage	Liable
04/01/2011	Twickenham	Alleged hit third party. Driver unaware.	None.	Liability on balance of probability
12/02/2011	Bushey, Herts	Whilst avoiding an over-hanging tree, hit a van on the other side of the road.	Scrape along N/S rear of van.	Liable.
23/02/2011	Warrington	Third party backed into cab.	O/S mirror cracked and dent to O/S cab.	Non-liable
04/06/2011	London	Took N/S wing mirror off parked Mercedes when turning left.	Broken mirror and scrape down the side of the car.	Liable.
12/06/2011	Errol, Scotland	A large American car coming the other way caused me to pull over to the left and the mirror collided with a tree.	N/S convex mirror broken.	Liable.
12/08/2011	Errol, Scotland	Broke convex mirror on a tree (yes, the same one).	N/S convex mirror broken.	Liable.
17/08/2011	A51 between Colwich and Hixon	Hit a railway bridge.	Corner cap knocked off trailer.	Driver not liable - RailTrack proven to have incorrect sign on the bridge.
16/09/2011	Burntwood	Caught trailer mud-guard on kerb.	Mud-guard ripped off.	Liable.
25/10/2011	Northampton	Reversing under a trailer and caught the handle.	Damaged handle on fifth wheel.	Liable.
29/10/2011	Northampton	Reversing under a trailer and hit the O/S wind deflector.	Damage to O/S wind deflector.	Liable.
04/11/2011	Ashby-de-la-Zouch	Turning in delivery area, pulled out electrical Suzie.	Suzie broken.	Liable.
07/11/2011	Northampton	Collided with another trailer when leaving a loading bay.	Damaged trim on trailer.	Liable.
17/07/2012	Northampton	Wheel and tyre damage caused by a strike.	Tyre punctured and wheel dented.	TBA.

[Flawless Victory]

Jesus H. bloody christ!!!