Body modification & MOT

[electronpusher]

Assuming I got a van (not yet), I would want to cut some holes & weld stuff underneath. I can't weld toffee yet, but I can learn.

What kind of things might provoke MOT problems?

Its obvious enough that if I mess with brakes, axles etc. then I can fail a vanilla MOT. What's the safe envelope?

Also I don't want to make a vehicle so weird that a standard MOT isn't enough. I know the SVA is a big hassle. What's the watershed on that one?

These are the daydreams of a van camper conversion job, way after it was trendy. Ponderings of how to get six foot headroom inside part of a box which goes under 6'6" carpark barriers, with a strange unwillingness to fit a pop-top. There might be enough space down below but I don't want to completely Flintstone it!

[shovelheadrob]

Simple maths, 6'6" - 6' = 6'. That doesn't allow for any insulation or floor coverings, if it's for a shower you need a drain. 6 inches isn't enough for ground clearance. This isn't going to happen.

[LargeRed]

shovelheadrob said:

Simple maths, 6'6" - 6' = 6'. That doesn't allow for any insulation or floor coverings, if it's for a shower you need a drain. 6 inches isn't enough for ground clearance. This isn't going to happen.

6'6" - 6' only leaves 6" ..... not 6' ......i thought you said simple maths !

[electronpusher]

shovelheadrob said:

Simple maths, 6'6" - 6' = 6'. [...] This isn't going to happen.

Units aside, your maths on those numbers is right but the advice isn't helping me. I'm looking for ideas and options for where I can make space, which is otherwise wasted or not useful.

I need to know what's possible and then take my tape measure to it. The rules I'm working to so far go something like,

• It has to be safe to drive, and pass the MOT
• Always got to be careful of water ingress and rust
• Secure against theft & vandalism. Either by being strong or looking so boring that people ignore it.
• Any kit under-slung is at risk of hitting the ground on rough terrain or severe parking fail, and greater risk of freezing
• Therefore any under-slung kit should be cheaper stuff like storage, not the fancy kit like heaters or batteries.
• I don't fancy a pop-top, they look like a liability in some ways. I'm considering a pop-bottom or some klingons.

Yes, a shower is one reason to pop-bottom and I agree that space would be (at very best) rather tight.
Wheel chair access is another reason and would have its own problems.

I know there are other ways but I'm ... eccentric? stubborn? Probably willing to risk some time and money. These are the sort of ideas that hang around until I look at the right thing, then they can turn into something real. Until then I need more info about what's going to cause problems.

[LargeRed]

VW once built a a special van called a Razor Back.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8rHBelSB_lg

Special lowering floor option.

.

[shovelheadrob]

shovelheadrob said:

Simple maths, 6'6" - 6' = 6'. That doesn't allow for any insulation or floor coverings, if it's for a shower you need a drain. 6 inches isn't enough for ground clearance. This isn't going to happen.

I'll let auto correct take the credit for that.......

[shovelheadrob]

Don't forget that you need some sort of insulation top & bottom, a pop top is probably the better way to go.

[brman]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Is that just a guess or do you have experience to back that up?

I really no nothing about the subject but I would have thought that, as long as you stay outside prescribed areas (30cm from suspension etc?) and don't make anything obviously dangerous (eg sharp edges) then the MOT man is probably out of his depth and will not fail it.
I am happy to be proved wrong though....

[CubanPete]

Brake lines, exhaust run under a van. Will be a lot less hassle to cut a hole in the roof and fit a pop top kit.

Or something close height wise and fit air ride?

[electronpusher]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Thanks. I see this

https://specialised-shipping.co.uk/iva-conversion-testing said:

An IVA (Individual Vehicle Approval) test, which used to be called an SVA (Single Vehicle Approval) test ... a legal requirement set by the Department of Transport ... to ensure your vehicle's design (not condition) complies with all current UK regulations [... IVA ] Test Certificate submitted with the application to the DVLA when first registering the car or motorcycle in the UK.

that is for imports = before they are registered here. But now I realise any modifications I make to a 2nd hand (i.e. registered) van would affect the insurance - they will ask "has it been modified?".

OK, so IVA is the keyword. https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-approval isn't helping me much so far, but it does sound like (e.g.) a tail lift is a "radical alteration" requiring an IVA. But it also sounds like a change of internal fittings could be reason for a Voluntary IVA.

Would it be fair to say that it's a big grey area, and the bigger the change the more likely it's going to be trouble (probably a "you weren't insured after all" weasel if I try to claim) later?

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Cool! There is lots of space "up" but it does have a cost sometimes.

Sounds like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bristol_Lodekka . Possibly the regs have changed since then.

[smokey mow]

brman said:

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Is that just a guess or do you have experience to back that up?

I really no nothing about the subject but I would have thought that, as long as you stay outside prescribed areas (30cm from suspension etc?) and don't make anything obviously dangerous (eg sharp edges) then the MOT man is probably out of his depth and will not fail it.
I am happy to be proved wrong though....

There’s no prescribed areas, dimensions or safe zones, any cutting and modification to a monocoque will potentially put you into IVA territory.

[DWDarkWheels]

As BRMAN says, any modification of the structure prompts the need for IVA.

Cutting out a large section of roof for a pop-top is also a modification of the structure. I know that's not what you were proposing but I've always wondered how converters including pros get away with it.

Regarding height you'll spend little time standing, so headroom isn't such an issue, unless I've misunderstood. I'm over 6ft so arranged the bed lengthways in our self-build.

Adding a tail-lift shouldn't invoke IVA surely : none of the monocoque is being removed?

Edited by DWDarkWheels on Monday 22 June 21:08

[Jonboy_t]

For what it’s worth, I can’t see you coming up with something that the everyday conversion companies haven’t already. If there was a way to fit a 6 foot shower in a 5 foot van, it’d be commonplace already. As a 6’4” fatty, anything that would make life more comfortable in a van would be welcome, but if the massive budgets of the bigger chaps can’t design something roadworthy and workable that fits the bill, it’s pretty likely it can’t be done.

You’d need to think about the future value of whatever you’re doing it to as well. I wouldn’t want to buy a van that any old Herbert had welded a newly invented part to!

Sorry if that sounds negative or defeatist, it’s not intended as such, just my thoughts!