Flemke - Is this your McLaren?
Discussion
flemke said:
Driving Ambition (which coincidentally features an A-pillar mirrored F1 on the cover) is now on my Xmas list. Amazon and Play selling it for around £40-odd and Virgin are still asking £60
The Motorbooks & Chaters web sites both say £60 and Mill House doesn't recognise the name. Cheers anyhow!
I just googled and found the same. I guess its amazon at "Forty Two bloody quid" as my lovely fiancee put it! 
Once again Flemke, can I just reiterate what a pleasure it is to read about your car and dream for a couple of seconds that I could roll it out of my garage.
You are a lucky man.
Cheers,
Steve.
P.S. I LIKE the gold split rims!
>> Edited by Fat Audi 80 on Thursday 8th December 22:39
Once again Flemke, can I just reiterate what a pleasure it is to read about your car and dream for a couple of seconds that I could roll it out of my garage.
You are a lucky man.
Cheers,
Steve.
P.S. I LIKE the gold split rims!
>> Edited by Fat Audi 80 on Thursday 8th December 22:39
thekirbyfake said:It surprises me that both still claim to have them in stock, but only at the inflated price.
The Motorbooks & Chaters web sites both say £60 and Mill House doesn't recognise the name. Cheers anyhow!
If I have the time tomorrow I'll call them directly and ask them the story.
aasc said:
Flemke,
I know I should RTFM but are the origins of the engine two M3 engines mated together or does it originate elsewhere or was it entirely bespoke?
thanks,
The McLaren F1 engine has the BMW designation S70/2
This is a relative (loosely) of the S70 engine
The M8 prototype (only 1 exists) engine has the code of S70/1, it is a 6.0L 550odd bhp V12 engine that was cancelled due to their being no market for the car (the 8 series was a sales flop) and it was this engine that was subsequently developed into the powerplant for the McLaren F1. Obviously Roche knew it was sitting around or maybe under development and that it would fit the bill to power the F1. When the M8 was cancelled then BMW would have been only to happy to try and offset some of the development costs by selling a better version to McLaren.
The Full List of the S70 engine family is as follows.
S70 5576 ccm DOHC 24V 850CSi 1992
S70/1 6000 ccm(approx.) QOHC 48V(?) M8 prototype 1990
S70/2 6064 ccm QOHC 48V McLaren F1 1993
S70/3 6064 ccm QOHC 48V McLaren F1LM 1996
Go back further to the ordinary 850i/750i V12 models and the engine is an M70 (5.0L) or M73 for the later model 5.4L version. The M designation means it's an ordinary BMW motor whereas the S designation means an //M engine (the exception being the M88, the orignal //M engine if you will).
This engine was developed in turn from the M20 SOHC six of 2.5L capacity, originally seen in the 1971 3.0Si models but probably better known for powering various 525i's and the E30 325i. It has also been available in other capacities in other models such as the E21 323i.
Essentially the M70 engine is two M20 2.5L engine joined together, the capacity and compression ratio is pretty much the same and it still retains individual computers to run each bank so that if one bank goes down the other will still run. Similar to the way Porsche did their V8 for the 928 from a couple of 944 engine I think (I could be completely wrong on that one though, dont know Porsche engines as well as BMW).
So I believe the two 325i engines joined together is what you are thinking of when you say two M3 engines, it's just been mixed up through second hand information as often happens.
I doubt whether there is any components that an M20 and an S70/2 have in common, I doubt whether even an S70 and an S70/2 share much in common apart from a designation.
Driving Ambition is an awesome book. I bought mine a while back. Remember just drooling over the images. The detail is extraordinary and you just know that EVERY nut and bolt was fitted for a reason and it was the perfect nut or bolt for that job.
DEFINITELY recommend anyone vaguely interested in cars to buy the book.
DEFINITELY recommend anyone vaguely interested in cars to buy the book.
flemke said:
The Motorbooks & Chaters web sites both say £60 and Mill House doesn't recognise the name. Cheers anyhow!
If I have the time tomorrow I'll call them directly and ask them the story.
Flemke.
I have seen a silver McLaren F1 down here in Hampshire a few times, but always whilst I am driving. The last time I saw it was going West on the A27 at Chichester. Because of the central barrier, I could not make out the registration number, but it looked like a very short number. Any ideas, who is the lucky chap.
Have also seen Rowan Atkinson's F1 on the M27 near Cosham and an orange F1 GTR near Chichester. The plate was either F1 MAC or F1 GTR, or something very similar.
Do you happen to know what happened to the F1 which crashed and caught fire in Essex, a few years back?
My nephew recently started a job at McLaren in Portsmouth and says that it is an unspoken rule in the factory, that nobody asks questions about the F1. Is this true?
360boy said:
Do you happen to know what happened to the F1 which crashed and caught fire in Essex, a few years back?
?
I guess you are talking about this one? http://archive.thisisessex.co.uk/1999/03/25/223274.h
There was a PH thread about it a while back IIRC
I had the great pleasure of buying my copy of Driving Ambition from the McLaren Showroom on Park Lane when it was still open. I have a McLaren receit to go with the book which I think is quite special. Also there was no mark up so it was £40!
Flemke, although it may seem a little impertinent, I would be interested to know what you think of F1 values, especially now the Veyron is out? Although they are rather different beasts, there are only a limited number of people with both the interest and the funds to buy these cars - have you or your fellow owners found F1 prices to be affected? Did you expect the market to appreciate so much since you bought your car? And do you think your modifications will adversely affect it's value? I appreciate that 99% of F1 transactions are done in private, but that only makes guaging the market harder, and to have an informed opinion would be most interesting.
Flemke, although it may seem a little impertinent, I would be interested to know what you think of F1 values, especially now the Veyron is out? Although they are rather different beasts, there are only a limited number of people with both the interest and the funds to buy these cars - have you or your fellow owners found F1 prices to be affected? Did you expect the market to appreciate so much since you bought your car? And do you think your modifications will adversely affect it's value? I appreciate that 99% of F1 transactions are done in private, but that only makes guaging the market harder, and to have an informed opinion would be most interesting.
360boy said:I don't know about that, but then McLaren did stop making the car 7 years ago, so it's not surprising it doesn't come up in conversation that often.
My nephew recently started a job at McLaren in Portsmouth and says that it is an unspoken rule in the factory, that nobody asks questions about the F1. Is this true?
Things are probably different down in Portsmouth but the few guys still working exclusively on the F1 (servicing etc) are always happy to field questions. Most of the other people weren't working at the company back in the F1 days.
rico said:
Driving Ambition is an awesome book. I bought mine a while back. Remember just drooling over the images. The detail is extraordinary and you just know that EVERY nut and bolt was fitted for a reason and it was the perfect nut or bolt for that job.
DEFINITELY recommend anyone vaguely interested in cars to buy the book.
I did not have the chance today to contact the bookshops. They may still have the discounted copies of Driving Ambition.
Alternatively, McLaren have new, shrink-wrapped copies of the book that are for sale at £42 each.
360boy said:
Flemke.
I have seen a silver McLaren F1 down here in Hampshire a few times, but always whilst I am driving. The last time I saw it was going West on the A27 at Chichester. Because of the central barrier, I could not make out the registration number, but it looked like a very short number. Any ideas, who is the lucky chap.
Have also seen Rowan Atkinson's F1 on the M27 near Cosham and an orange F1 GTR near Chichester. The plate was either F1 MAC or F1 GTR, or something very similar.
Do you happen to know what happened to the F1 which crashed and caught fire in Essex, a few years back?
My nephew recently started a job at McLaren in Portsmouth and says that it is an unspoken rule in the factory, that nobody asks questions about the F1. Is this true?
I can think of more than one car that fits your description and lives in southern England. Sorry, but I would rather not speculate about names - privacy sometimes is priceless.
I have no idea what happened to the remains of the Dawes car. You can be sure that they were not re-used on another F1. I presume that they were crushed (further crushed, that is) anonymously, although it's possible I suppose that when the coroner was finished with the bits, the owner's family held onto them.
I don't know about conversations at the Portsmouth factory relating to the F1.
Obviously at the part of McLaren that deals with the F1 (road car, not racing team) there are all sorts of conversations. The people there are totally confidential about the identities of the owners - to the point where it can be awkward to talk about owners who they know are good friends of yours. They don't go into a lot of depth about their suppliers. Historical topics relating to the car's development are sometimes left vague also.
At the Formula One factory there seem to be no inhibitions at all about discussing the F1. Most of the present team were not at McL. during the road car project. Many of the other race team folks who were at McL. at the time may have made a small contribution to the project, but almost none of them have any direct experience with it. I have discussed F1 matters with a number of the guys at the race team and invited them to have a look at the car or be my passenger. They all seem to have an enthusiastic pride about it.
>> Edited by flemke on Friday 9th December 18:06
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