Re: Peugeot: GTi is RIP
Discussion
Bourj said:
I have owned many 205's and now have an S1 Rallye, I think the S1 is a superior car, like a 205 without the drawbacks...
A gripper diff makes it even better...
What about a 205 rallye? A gripper diff makes it even better...
106 S1 ralley to XSI. AX sport to GT. 205 ralley to XS and all the PSA models between 1.3-1.4l, normally aspirated PSA cars and most notably not one called a GTI. IMO the best of the hot hatch crop.
The AX started off as the green choice before green was fashionable. Best MPG for the time hence why I think there is still hope for some new fun hot hatches if manufacturers go down this root.
I have driven the euro 205 rallye with the same engine as the 106, that was fantastic, but am I right in saying the UK one had the not quite so revvy 1.4 engine? The UK one didnt seem to have the same character, but it may just have been a bad example I drove.....
Edited by lankyarcher on Tuesday 10th November 11:53
Bourj said:
I have owned many 205's and now have an S1 Rallye, I think the S1 is a superior car, like a 205 without the drawbacks...
A gripper diff makes it even better...
What about a 205 rallye? A gripper diff makes it even better...
106 S1 ralley to XSI. AX sport to GT. 205 ralley to XS and all the PSA models between 1.3-1.4l, normally aspirated PSA cars and most notably not one called a GTI. IMO the best of the hot hatch crop.
The AX started off as the green choice before green was fashionable. Best MPG for the time hence why I think there is still hope for some new fun hot hatches if manufacturers go down this root.
The 'real' 205 rallye got an engine similar to the 106 rallye (though it was on carbs) but ran gti suspension
To be honest all Peugeot will do is rebrand their gti ranges as RC, matching what they have in the continent, so saving a tiny bit of money on badges while not getting whined at by the british for producing another s
t gti Many people praise the 205 GTI. In reality the best fun hot hatches were not the TOTR GTI versions. The ethos having a GTI badge has given the impression that car enthusiast preferred the GTI versions, it sounds better to have owned a GTI as apposed to an XSI, GT or XS. People also get the impression that the 1.9 was the best 205 GTI, when in reality the 1.6 was better balanced and given more driver involvement could be driven just as quickly if not quicker in most circumstances. That said the XS sub 50 mph would be as quick as either GTI. And this is where the GTI badge has fallen down. Its not about how fast its how quick, which results in most fun. How quickly you can get to the national speed limit how nippy through traffic? How quick off the line, so manufacturers just go for bigger numbers when they should be looking at lowering.
There’s nothing wrong with later pug badged GTI’s they are the result of the public wanting bigger and better and in reality they are more comfortable and practical and in some cases faster. They are not the result of drivers wanting fun. I suppose you are not meant to have fun on public roads anyway.
I cocked up my quote. I have only owned 2 205s unfortunately neither was a Rallye.
There’s nothing wrong with later pug badged GTI’s they are the result of the public wanting bigger and better and in reality they are more comfortable and practical and in some cases faster. They are not the result of drivers wanting fun. I suppose you are not meant to have fun on public roads anyway.
I cocked up my quote. I have only owned 2 205s unfortunately neither was a Rallye.
Bourj said:
Many people praise the 205 GTI. In reality the best fun hot hatches were not the TOTR GTI versions. The ethos having a GTI badge has given the impression that car enthusiast preferred the GTI versions, it sounds better to have owned a GTI as apposed to an XSI, GT or XS. People also get the impression that the 1.9 was the best 205 GTI, when in reality the 1.6 was better balanced and given more driver involvement could be driven just as quickly if not quicker in most circumstances. That said the XS sub 50 mph would be as quick as either GTI. And this is where the GTI badge has fallen down. Its not about how fast its how quick, which results in most fun. How quickly you can get to the national speed limit how nippy through traffic? How quick off the line, so manufacturers just go for bigger numbers when they should be looking at lowering.
There’s nothing wrong with later pug badged GTI’s they are the result of the public wanting bigger and better and in reality they are more comfortable and practical and in some cases faster. They are not the result of drivers wanting fun. I suppose you are not meant to have fun on public roads anyway.
I cocked up my quote. I have only owned 2 205s unfortunately neither was a Rallye.
I did graduate through the 205's... I had a 1.1 Junior, a 1.4 gt and a Dturbo prior to my succession of GTI's... And I 100% agree that the 1.6 was superior to the 1.9GTI, the 205 did not need disk brakes on the rear, and I always thought that my 1.6 was the better all round car, however it was even better when I transplanted a 1.9 into it, with the shorter ratio gearbox and drums on the back... I have to admit, I really am missing having a 205 of some description... It is 3 years and counting without one! Now, where are those classified ads.....There’s nothing wrong with later pug badged GTI’s they are the result of the public wanting bigger and better and in reality they are more comfortable and practical and in some cases faster. They are not the result of drivers wanting fun. I suppose you are not meant to have fun on public roads anyway.
I cocked up my quote. I have only owned 2 205s unfortunately neither was a Rallye.
Edited by lankyarcher on Tuesday 10th November 12:27
Edited by lankyarcher on Tuesday 10th November 12:28
Rather than dropping the badge, why not make a car worthy of it? Stick a tuning pack on the 207 THP motor to get it around 220bhp (if JCW can do it, so can you), get rid of some weight, give it a 6 speed 'box and relaunch. Maybe even lose a lot more weight and call it a Rallye?
I parked up next to someone at work a few weeks ago who was just getting out of their new 308. They complimented my car (205 GTI) and said "you know, your car (meaning all 205 GTIs) is the reason I like Peugeots. It's the reason I went for this over the Golf."
All I could say was "sorry".
I parked up next to someone at work a few weeks ago who was just getting out of their new 308. They complimented my car (205 GTI) and said "you know, your car (meaning all 205 GTIs) is the reason I like Peugeots. It's the reason I went for this over the Golf."
All I could say was "sorry".
I still pine for my 309gti - and would remind you all that at the time a lot people thought it was better than the seminal 205gti, a lot less likely to dump you backwards in a hedge - but Peugeot have really been off course for a long time now. It's such a shame, especially when Renault continue to lead the way in this part of the market.
I know Peugeot used to have a chassis guru, Jacques someone or other, I think he used to ensure small Pugs had more spent on their suspensions and chassis than their rivals. I suspect he has been pushed upstairs, so the cars have lost the magic.
I know Peugeot used to have a chassis guru, Jacques someone or other, I think he used to ensure small Pugs had more spent on their suspensions and chassis than their rivals. I suspect he has been pushed upstairs, so the cars have lost the magic.
doogz said:
lankyarcher said:
I think whoever used to work setting up chassis's for Peugeot, left and went to work for Renault after the 306 was developed.
Renaults now seem to have the magic that all Peugeot's used to have. Even the basic spec cars were great to drive, great steering and a fantatsic balance.
I have owned 5 x 205 GTI's, and now am the owner of a S1 106 Rallye, the magic is simply not there anymore, if I ever replace that car (which I doubt) I will be buying a Clio cup to replace it.
It's a travesty that Peugeots are so unspectacular these days.....
IMO my S1 106 rallye, albeit it one with a gti engine in, is infinitely more fun and involving to drive than my Clio 182 was.Renaults now seem to have the magic that all Peugeot's used to have. Even the basic spec cars were great to drive, great steering and a fantatsic balance.
I have owned 5 x 205 GTI's, and now am the owner of a S1 106 Rallye, the magic is simply not there anymore, if I ever replace that car (which I doubt) I will be buying a Clio cup to replace it.
It's a travesty that Peugeots are so unspectacular these days.....
That's hilarious; "For us, the GTi concept is dead..."
The Peugeot GTi concept has been dead for everyone else since you stopped making the 306 GTI-6 you numpties!
I'm so glad, we can all stop waiting for them to try and rekindle the magic, about time they just graciously admitted defeat to Renault and get on with churning out disgusting bug-eyed diesel barges. What is the point of Peugeot being in motorsport? To market what?
The Peugeot GTi concept has been dead for everyone else since you stopped making the 306 GTI-6 you numpties!
I'm so glad, we can all stop waiting for them to try and rekindle the magic, about time they just graciously admitted defeat to Renault and get on with churning out disgusting bug-eyed diesel barges. What is the point of Peugeot being in motorsport? To market what?
Edited by Steve Gunnis on Tuesday 10th November 13:18
Alternatively, Peugeot have realised that everytime they badge a car GTI, the press tears it apart when compared with the ever-present 205...
I would imagine they are keeping their powder dry until the internal investment is there and dare I say it, the 'green' focused public opinion blows back the other way - then they'll jump straight back on top of the heritage effect of the GTI badge.
Is this any different to Ford abandoning the XR and RS badges back in the nineties? The XR morphed into the ST but the RS came back a couple of years later (albeit as some ridiculous new acronym in place of Rallye Sport - Rapid Spec or some such pish). Vauxhall dumped the GTE name for the GSI in the name of lowering insurance premiums. That vanished a few years later too. Now VX is seen as as reasonable performance badge.
Who cares about the name anyway? As long as the car drives well it is all a bit irrelevant?
As long as we don't see a return to giving Special Editions white leather and naming them after Tennis Players, I'll stay happy
I would imagine they are keeping their powder dry until the internal investment is there and dare I say it, the 'green' focused public opinion blows back the other way - then they'll jump straight back on top of the heritage effect of the GTI badge.
Is this any different to Ford abandoning the XR and RS badges back in the nineties? The XR morphed into the ST but the RS came back a couple of years later (albeit as some ridiculous new acronym in place of Rallye Sport - Rapid Spec or some such pish). Vauxhall dumped the GTE name for the GSI in the name of lowering insurance premiums. That vanished a few years later too. Now VX is seen as as reasonable performance badge.
Who cares about the name anyway? As long as the car drives well it is all a bit irrelevant?
As long as we don't see a return to giving Special Editions white leather and naming them after Tennis Players, I'll stay happy
HereBeMonsters said:
doogz said:
lankyarcher said:
I think whoever used to work setting up chassis's for Peugeot, left and went to work for Renault after the 306 was developed.
Renaults now seem to have the magic that all Peugeot's used to have. Even the basic spec cars were great to drive, great steering and a fantatsic balance.
I have owned 5 x 205 GTI's, and now am the owner of a S1 106 Rallye, the magic is simply not there anymore, if I ever replace that car (which I doubt) I will be buying a Clio cup to replace it.
It's a travesty that Peugeots are so unspectacular these days.....
IMO my S1 106 rallye, albeit it one with a gti engine in, is infinitely more fun and involving to drive than my Clio 182 was.Renaults now seem to have the magic that all Peugeot's used to have. Even the basic spec cars were great to drive, great steering and a fantatsic balance.
I have owned 5 x 205 GTI's, and now am the owner of a S1 106 Rallye, the magic is simply not there anymore, if I ever replace that car (which I doubt) I will be buying a Clio cup to replace it.
It's a travesty that Peugeots are so unspectacular these days.....
I concur with the 16v S1 Rallye conversion, not my cup of tea, you can get almost as much power from the 1.3... Mine had a full conversion to roadspeed spec @ Skip Brown's.. it is 140bhp without the cat! So I reckon probably quicker than most 16v Rallye's, but from looking at the bills from when the conversion was done, the 16v is a much cheaper way to go if your engine goes pop...
Daveyraveygravey said:
I still pine for my 309gti - and would remind you all that at the time a lot people thought it was better than the seminal 205gti, a lot less likely to dump you backwards in a hedge - but Peugeot have really been off course for a long time now. It's such a shame, especially when Renault continue to lead the way in this part of the market.
.
I can agree as I've owned both, a 1.9 205 GTI and a 309 GTI. .
The 205 was great but the 309 was even better , but looked butt ugly !
The build quailty wasn't good though, and in some ways were the reason why they felt so light and chuckable. None of the endless airbags and gadgets of todays cars.
They did help the driver enjoy driving instead of caring about the latest ICE toys etc...thats if the person driving has an instrest tho'...most people don't !
A10ARF said:
Daveyraveygravey said:
I still pine for my 309gti - and would remind you all that at the time a lot people thought it was better than the seminal 205gti, a lot less likely to dump you backwards in a hedge - but Peugeot have really been off course for a long time now. It's such a shame, especially when Renault continue to lead the way in this part of the market.
.
I can agree as I've owned both, a 1.9 205 GTI and a 309 GTI. .
The 205 was great but the 309 was even better , but looked butt ugly !
The build quailty wasn't good though, and in some ways were the reason why they felt so light and chuckable. None of the endless airbags and gadgets of todays cars.
They did help the driver enjoy driving instead of caring about the latest ICE toys etc...thats if the person driving has an instrest tho'...most people don't !
essexplumber said:
Munter said:
okgo said:
306 was the last half decent one really wasn't it.
I don't think the 106 GTi was too bad was it. Or was that out before the 306?Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff