The Official Japanese GP thread 2013

[Matt_N]

mollytherocker said:

e21Mark said:

Am I right in thinking that Webbers DRS failed hence he was unable to pass Grosjean at the earlier opportunity? I still don't see why he was brought in with so few laps left? Especially given the times he was putting in and how long the tyres had been lasting. It didn't help matters when Christian Horner evaded answering the question.

Did Marks DRS fail? I didnt here about that?

Don't think it failed as it seemed to work again later on but the 2nd or 3rd time he was in Grosjean's DRS zone it didn't open.

[e21Mark]

I can recall it being remarked upon for years, when a specific set of tyres didn't work as well as the set before, or how the expected performance had inexplicably varied from one set to another. Obviously the FIA ask for particular characteristics to be engineered within the tyre, but they can only do so much. Even in lesser formula, after a few laps tyres would grow in diameter (centrifugal force) but no 2 tyres would be the same. Throw in the variable, of how each manufactures car uses its tyres, and there's only so much tyre manufacturers can do.

[rubystone]

e21Mark said:

Am I right in thinking that Webbers DRS failed .

No.

[RichB]

vonuber said:

e21Mark said:

Webber said he could have finished the race on 2 stops and was surprised when the team called him in for a third. He asked ''are you guys sure?'' to which they said yes. It's pretty clear who Red Bull wanted to win.

"The race today was pretty good, but I'd have liked one more step on the podium but there were different strategies going on," said Webber. "I'm pretty happy with second but you always want a bit more. I got the best from what I could today. "In the end we went to a three-stop but we we got back to where we were."

Webber did indeed question the three stop strategy so are you disagreeing with that or simply pointing out that when interviewed on the podium he was more sanguine?

[e21Mark]

RichB said:

vonuber said:

e21Mark said:

Webber said he could have finished the race on 2 stops and was surprised when the team called him in for a third. He asked ''are you guys sure?'' to which they said yes. It's pretty clear who Red Bull wanted to win.

"The race today was pretty good, but I'd have liked one more step on the podium but there were different strategies going on," said Webber. "I'm pretty happy with second but you always want a bit more. I got the best from what I could today. "In the end we went to a three-stop but we we got back to where we were."

Webber did indeed question the three stop strategy so are you disagreeing with that or simply pointing out that when interviewed on the podium he was more sanguine?

I'm not disagreeing. I think he lost any chance of victory due to that decision.

[IainT]

Durzel said:

Imo the fact it took Webber forever and a day to pass Grosjean, when Vettel got the job done pretty much the first time he was in the DRS zone speaks volumes.

I was massively impressed with Grosjean's defending against Webber.

[RichB]

e21Mark said:

I'm not disagreeing. I think he lost any chance of victory due to that decision.

I agree it was the next reply to your post I was confused by

[nsa]

I've not read the full thread, but did anybody else see Eddie Jordan on BBC F1 Forum show predict Hulkenburg to Force India next year? He seemed pretty sure.

He made an early call about Hamilton moving to Mercedes last year: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/19489930

Edit: EJ on YoutubeL: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9xT7l7uju4

Edited by nsa on Monday 14th October 11:11

[MiniMan64]

nsa said:

I've not read the full thread, but did anybody else see Eddie Jordan on BBC F1 Forum show predict Hulkenburg to Force India next year? He seemed pretty sure.

He made an early call about Hamilton moving to Mercedes last year: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/19489930

That would seem to be a sideways or even backward step given the bigger things many are predicting for him.

[A Scotsman]

nsa said:

I've not read the full thread, but did anybody else see Eddie Jordan on BBC F1 Forum show predict Hulkenburg to Force India next year? He seemed pretty sure.

He made an early call about Hamilton moving to Mercedes last year: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/19489930

Well I would be very surprised if Di Resta gets another season.

[Chrisgr31]

Earlier in the the thread someone said that due to the tyres the cars cannot carry a full fuel load to finish the race.

This isn't correct is it? The reality is that teams know that the car will not be running flat out for the entire race and therefore they don't put that amount of fuel in, indeed they actually design the fuel tank on the basis that they will never run flat out lights to flag so its not big enough to take the fuel to do that.

The result is that in a race that is particularly fast, has no safety car period etc they can be short of fuel at the end or run out. They would do this irrespective of the tyres.

[Tyre Smoke]

oyster said:

This conspiracy crap is the most boring thing about Formula 1 right now.

The racing is actually fun. The bitterness from those who can't see greatness in a driver is truly astonishing.

All the stuff you're talking about is conjecture - made up.


You must have a really low opinion of Mark Webber if you think he is in an inferior car and not saying anything about it.

The racing is the most boring it has been for years. Drivers and teams are simply managing tyres and fuel. It is no longer about who has the fastest car and is the best driver. Save engines, save gearboxes, save tyres, save fuel. They'll be running electric cars or hybrids soon - look at endurance racing.

[andy_s]

Tyre Smoke said:

The racing is the most boring it has been for years. Drivers and teams are simply managing tyres and fuel. It is no longer about who has the fastest car and is the best driver. Save engines, save gearboxes, save tyres, save fuel. They'll be running electric cars or hybrids soon - look at endurance racing.

T'was ever thus. They always manage fuel and tyres. It's just the effect is now magnified and has a whiff of artificiality about it, but in essence, it's much the same it's always been in terms of managing the car.

What would be wrong with hybrid or electric F1 cars anyway?

[valais]

Tyre Smoke said:

The racing is the most boring it has been for years. Drivers and teams are simply managing tyres and fuel. It is no longer about who has the fastest car and is the best driver. Save engines, save gearboxes, save tyres, save fuel. They'll be running electric cars or hybrids soon - look at endurance racing.

Fuel, car and engine saving has been dominant for decades. As have tyres. It's just a different kind of problem right now.

[Durzel]

nsa said:

I've not read the full thread, but did anybody else see Eddie Jordan on BBC F1 Forum show predict Hulkenburg to Force India next year? He seemed pretty sure.

He made an early call about Hamilton moving to Mercedes last year: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/19489930

Edit: EJ on YoutubeL: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9xT7l7uju4

Edited by nsa on Monday 14th October 11:11

Lotus seems like the logical choice for Hulkenberg. Or McLaren. FI would imo be a sidegrade at best.

I wouldn't be surprised at this point if McLaren went for him. Perez has been unremarkable, and McLaren are clearly on a bit of a charge to redeem themselves. Snapping up that RBR aero guy sends a pretty strong message that they aren't going to stand still. Plus McLaren will obviously have been developing a 2014 car with Button in mind, who is also one of the taller people in F1.

[scrwright]

What was with the official timing for Massa & Button? It has Massa 9 seconds behind Button yet they finished less than a metre apart? (or was that bad editing on behalf of the beeb?)

Jenson Button McLaren +01:20.821
Felipe Massa Ferrari +01:29.263

[motorizer]

scrwright said:

What was with the official timing for Massa & Button? It has Massa 9 seconds behind Button yet they finished less than a metre apart? (or was that bad editing on behalf of the beeb?)

Jenson Button McLaren +01:20.821
Felipe Massa Ferrari +01:29.263

I'd assumed that was a replay from a lap earlier....

[scrwright]

after the race they commented it was the last lap & a dive for the line

[Durzel]

Think the Beeb (and Coulthard & EJ) got confused by the FIA replay. They even showed a static image of the difference in them crossing the line, as if it was a photo finish. Unless I'm going crazy I can't see how it could've been the last lap when the timings show them 9+ seconds apart.

[VolvoT5]

Durzel said:

Lotus seems like the logical choice for Hulkenberg. Or McLaren. FI would imo be a sidegrade at best.

I wouldn't be surprised at this point if McLaren went for him. Perez has been unremarkable, and McLaren are clearly on a bit of a charge to redeem themselves. Snapping up that RBR aero guy sends a pretty strong message that they aren't going to stand still. Plus McLaren will obviously have been developing a 2014 car with Button in mind, who is also one of the taller people in F1.

Is Lotus really that good of a seat to have though? Their star designer / tech guy has been pinched by Ferrari and they have money issues. Kimi had a very good thing at Lotus (clear no1 status, full team support, no pressure to do media or PR, a team mate he was comfortably beating) and yet he has jumped ship to Ferrari who treated him poorly last time and to go up against Alonso, basically putting himself in a situation where he could end up as clear #2............ he must have some pretty strong concerns about the future of Lotus to make such a risky move?

TBH if Sauber carry on the improvements they have shown over the last couple of races then it wouldn't be such a bad idea to stay put? Going back to FI would definitely be a sideways move at best possibly even a backwards step.

Edited by VolvoT5 on Monday 14th October 13:02