1st Test 2017

[Vocal Minority]

London424 said:

Full race sim by Merc this afternoon. Very impressive stuff.

Lap times looking solid, if not mesmerising. Around the middle of the process times were mid 26's reducing to 27s as the tyres left him.

Admittedly Ferrari haven't gone that far yet, but long run pace isn't so very different. And Red Bull haven't really stuck their head above the parapet yet.

It's impressive that they are putting full race distances in, I suppose that is the benefit of running 2 drivers each day. You can run 66 consecutive laps and still have the energy for a different test program

I honestly think people are crediting Mercedes with a lead based on reputation and not evidence. They'll clearly be right at the front, but I don't see anything - yet - to suggest there is definitely a significant gap. Aside from the assumption 'its Mercedes, innit?'

eta: final stint on soft tyres - generally low to mid 25s on presumably lower fuel

Allegedly it all looked a bit messy when loaded up with fuel - but that could easily be Bottas trying a bit too hard, still feeling his way in the new car etc

Edited by Vocal Minority on Tuesday 28th February 15:43

[FourWheelDrift]

Bottas whoopsy - https://twitter.com/F1/status/836609573553201152

[enjo]

FourWheelDrift said:

Bottas whoopsy - https://twitter.com/F1/status/836609573553201152

I think he did pretty well there in the end.

[JNW1]

Vocal Minority said:

It's impressive that they are putting full race distances in, I suppose that is the benefit of running 2 drivers each day. You can run 66 consecutive laps and still have the energy for a different test program.

It's also the benefit of having a reliable car; I suspect not many teams are capable of running cars for full race distances this early in the testing sessions regardless of the number of drivers!

Vocal Minority said:

I honestly think people are crediting Mercedes with a lead based on reputation and not evidence. They'll clearly be right at the front, but I don't see anything - yet - to suggest there is definitely a significant gap. Aside from the assumption 'its Mercedes, innit?'

I agree it's too early to say there's a significant gap - or even a gap - but Mercedes appear to be the first team able to run both full race distances and set competitive lap times; not saying none of the others will be able to match them but Merc have certainly put an early marker down!

[Crafty_]

tommunster10 said:

Only a mug would not read everything before making a crass comment. Carry on...

I've been saying this since Bottas left for Merc.... all Merc F1 need to do is give Williams a closer spec engine to theirs and they could be top 3 ahead of RBR...
All speculation, but it is my freedom to speculate, I don't work for anyone in F1 so I am free to say what i like pretty much.
We shall see, I can't wait personally to see Massa doing well in 2017, Stroll will struggle though.

Williams problem is not engine, as said previously the engine is the same spec.
Where they ight differ is the fuel used. Petronas develop the fuel for Merc especially for that engine and put a lot of effort in to making it as good as possible.
If Williams go to a different fuel manufacturer it could be that fuel isn't as good, thus less power. We're talking the thin end of the wedge here.

The bigger problem for Williams is their aero in recent years. A couple of years ago they had a car that was very slippery - fast at high speed tracks, not so good on high downforce tracks, because the car just didn't generate enough. Last year that changed a bit to just be a bit "meh" all round, probably because other teams were able to match their high speed low downforce setups but also have high downforce setups available when needed.

They don't need an Andy Cowell, they need a Costa/Newey for about 25% of their wage !

I think Red Bull are being underestimated here, I think they will put up a very strong fight against the Mercs. The Renault needs to hold together but other than that I think you'll see them genuinely fastest overall at races this year, the question is how many....

[Oi_Oi_Savaloy]

I think Force India will be ahead of Williams this year - just don't see them in the top 3. Merc, Ferrari, red bull, force india, toro rosso, williams, renault, mclaren, haas, sauber.

Mind you - judging by the pretty poor start for McL - they could be fighting sauber for the wooden spoon.

I just don't get the impression Honda has the power or reliability. At least sauber will have reliability (that's why they went with the 2016 engine right?)

[VolvoT5]

Reading some of the remarks from Autosport journalists today they are saying the Ferrari looks very composed and compliant... possibly a real contender?

[Vocal Minority]

Certainly keep an open mind on the fact prior to their first genuine long run showing

[angrymoby]

VolvoT5 said:

Reading some of the remarks from Autosport journalists today they are saying the Ferrari looks very composed and compliant... possibly a real contender?

As they were in '14 ...& '15 ...& 2016

& remember Merc didn't even top the time sheets of day 2 in those years either ...they were only 4th & roughly 1.5s off the pace setters- worryingly

[Teppic]

ELUSIVEJIM said:

Even at this very early stage it is looking like 2016 all over again.

For McLaren it's looking like 2015 all over again.

[MiniMan64]

Vocal Minority said:

McLaren are in bother certainly.

Ive never been a huge fan of Nando but I'm starting to feel sorry for him. And it's a shame for the sport that a top driver like him is going to spend another season trundling around at the back or sat in the garage.

[bobbo89]

Oi_Oi_Savaloy said:

I think Force India will be ahead of Williams this year - just don't see them in the top 3. Merc, Ferrari, red bull, force india, toro rosso, williams, renault, mclaren, haas, sauber.

I think Haas might do a fair bit better but other than that, that's pretty much how i see things panning out. Do hope i'm wrong though!

[anonymous-user]

FourWheelDrift said:

Bottas whoopsy - https://twitter.com/F1/status/836609573553201152

Strange spin. Must have been an issue with the car.

[Megaflow]

angrymoby said:

VolvoT5 said:

Reading some of the remarks from Autosport journalists today they are saying the Ferrari looks very composed and compliant... possibly a real contender?

As they were in '14 ...& '15 ...& 2016

& remember Merc didn't even top the time sheets of day 2 in those years either ...they were only 4th & roughly 1.5s off the pace setters- worryingly

IIRC the Ferrari had the four fastest laps of winter testing last year.

Mercedes modus operandi is well know in winter testing now, fill it with fuel and pound round.

Didn't they do the whole of winter testing with a minimum of half a tank of fuel or something?

[angrymoby]

Megaflow said:

angrymoby said:

VolvoT5 said:

Reading some of the remarks from Autosport journalists today they are saying the Ferrari looks very composed and compliant... possibly a real contender?

As they were in '14 ...& '15 ...& 2016

& remember Merc didn't even top the time sheets of day 2 in those years either ...they were only 4th & roughly 1.5s off the pace setters- worryingly

IIRC the Ferrari had the four fastest laps of winter testing last year.

Mercedes modus operandi is well know in winter testing now, fill it with fuel and pound round.

Didn't they do the whole of winter testing with a minimum of half a tank of fuel or something?

Something like that

& during the first 12 tests over the past 3 seasons (3x 4 days) Ferrari have topped the time sheets 7 times ...& been in the top 2, 10 out of 12! times

[VolvoT5]

I wasn't talking about the lap times but more the fact that a couple of usually reliable sources suggested the car looks well balanced and driveable. The 2014 Ferrari looked like a donkey from day 1. Having said that I will admit that the 2016 car did look promising at this sage.... but in fairness they should have won the opening race of 2016 in terms of pace... it only as the season progressed that things went rapidly downhill.

I'm looking for some hope here... McHonda already look to be in a mess and the Red Bull doesn't yet seem as impressive as we might have expected. At this stage Ferrari appear to have reliability and a drivable car which is something.

[bobbo89]

VolvoT5 said:

. At this stage Ferrari appear to have reliability and a drivable car which is something.

This is what I'm clutching on to. Fingers (;) crossed they've got a car that challenge the Merc's

[Vocal Minority]

Megaflow said:

angrymoby said:

VolvoT5 said:

Reading some of the remarks from Autosport journalists today they are saying the Ferrari looks very composed and compliant... possibly a real contender?

As they were in '14 ...& '15 ...& 2016

& remember Merc didn't even top the time sheets of day 2 in those years either ...they were only 4th & roughly 1.5s off the pace setters- worryingly

IIRC the Ferrari had the four fastest laps of winter testing last year.

Mercedes modus operandi is well know in winter testing now, fill it with fuel and pound round.

Didn't they do the whole of winter testing with a minimum of half a tank of fuel or something?

Ferrari set all those times in the last few years on soft tyres on v. short runs. It was fairly trans[aren't what they were up to.

It's why headline times aren't relevant. Ferrari have been churning out strong times on mediums on 13,14,15,16 lap runs. On the long race runs (Bottas did a full 66 lap race simulation) Mercedes looked fidgety on occasions, and was in the mid to low 25s towards the end.

Its fair to deduce Mercedes headline runs were lowish fuel.

[Oi_Oi_Savaloy]

bobbo89 said:

Oi_Oi_Savaloy said:

I think Force India will be ahead of Williams this year - just don't see them in the top 3. Merc, Ferrari, red bull, force india, toro rosso, williams, renault, mclaren, haas, sauber.

I think Haas might do a fair bit better but other than that, that's pretty much how i see things panning out. Do hope i'm wrong though!

I could see haas coming in above Renault perhaps (judging by the first two days) maybe (which would be outstanding imo) but over the long season think they'll end up either just in front or just behind mclaren. I put them behind to give mclaren the benefit of the doubt really. Mcl should have kept with Mercedes....imo of course

[Rich_W]

ELUSIVEJIM said:

FourWheelDrift said:

Bottas whoopsy - https://twitter.com/F1/status/836609573553201152

Strange spin. Must have been an issue with the car.

Turns out the unit fitted in the driver seat is sub optimal