Kubica back in an F1 car

[anonymous-user]

Vaud said:

rallycross said:

MissChief said:

In fairness to Damon Williams have a record of doing this. Mansell and Villeneuve both got the boot too.

Indeed they do, proof that the people running the show at Williams were wkers.

They got rid of Villeneuve, so they aren’t all bad. Now rentamouth.

Mansell was great but had peaked in F1. Hill was right place, right time, journeyman.

Frank was smart.

Villeneuve left Williams, he wasn't booted out. He left because Patrick Head didn't want to develop the car the way Villeneuve wanted, so he followed the money to BAR.

I would expect Williams regretted sending Damon packing, he was far better than people gave him credit. The problem for Damon was he didn't perform in 95, I think had they waited longer into 96 he would have been retained, but they had already gone for Frentzen.

It easy to forget Damon pushed Schumacher hard, despite his relative lack of experience at the time. A journeyman doesn't win a WC or push Schumacher into mistakes, or beat Prost. He was far more than that, he was also a damn good test driver, which mattered back then.

[tight fart]

Did any lap times leak on the Kubica or Dir?

[Vaud]

jsf said:

Villeneuve left Williams, he wasn't booted out. He left because Patrick Head didn't want to develop the car the way Villeneuve wanted, so he followed the money to BAR.

I would expect Williams regretted sending Damon packing, he was far better than people gave him credit. The problem for Damon was he didn't perform in 95, I think had they waited longer into 96 he would have been retained, but they had already gone for Frentzen.

It easy to forget Damon pushed Schumacher hard, despite his relative lack of experience at the time. A journeyman doesn't win a WC or push Schumacher into mistakes, or beat Prost. He was far more than that, he was also a damn good test driver, which mattered back then.

Fair points, I may be mistaken.

[AndStilliRise]

Vaud said:

jsf said:

Villeneuve left Williams, he wasn't booted out. He left because Patrick Head didn't want to develop the car the way Villeneuve wanted, so he followed the money to BAR.

I would expect Williams regretted sending Damon packing, he was far better than people gave him credit. The problem for Damon was he didn't perform in 95, I think had they waited longer into 96 he would have been retained, but they had already gone for Frentzen.

It easy to forget Damon pushed Schumacher hard, despite his relative lack of experience at the time. A journeyman doesn't win a WC or push Schumacher into mistakes, or beat Prost. He was far more than that, he was also a damn good test driver, which mattered back then.

Fair points, I may be mistaken.

I agree. He was damn fast and more than I or others have him credit for. Anyone who could go wheel to wheel with MS was either fast or stupid. DH was fast, JPM was stupid.

FW & PH are usually quick to dispense drivers in the belief that the car is good enough however proved time and time again a good driver can make a huge contribution to the team, morale and development of the car.

[rubystone]

Vaud said:

At the time they were the right decisions.

Frank thought HFF was the second coming. He was wrong there.

[AndStilliRise]

rubystone said:

Vaud said:

At the time they were the right decisions.

Frank thought HFF was the second coming. He was wrong there.

Mark Webber was interesting. Williams had given him a decent salary and the following year FW said we want to cut that by half, MW not having any other alternatives said he would think about it. MW returned and said OK and then FW said actually it was half of the half, so in turn paying him a 0.25% of his current salay. MW went off in a huff to Red Bull.

http://www.crash.net/f1/news/159819/1/impressed-wi...

[Vaud]

AndStilliRise said:

Mark Webber was interesting. Williams had given him a decent salary and the following year FW said we want to cut that by half, MW not having any other alternatives said he would think about it. MW returned and said OK and then FW said actually it was half of the half, so in turn paying him a 0.25% of his current salay. MW went off in a huff to Red Bull.

http://www.crash.net/f1/news/159819/1/impressed-wi...

I didn't know that story. Thanks for sharing.

[FourWheelDrift]

Kvyat added to list of Williams possibles for 2018 - http://www.crash.net/f1/news/886600/1/kvyat-joins-...

[Vaud]

FourWheelDrift said:

Kvyat added to list of Williams possibles for 2018 - http://www.crash.net/f1/news/886600/1/kvyat-joins-...

I don’t think he’d be a bad option. He’s no Alonso but his last race was pretty strong and he has solid experience.

[Frimley111R]

For me it just doesn't make sense not to keep Massa. He is faster than Stroll and you don't ditch your fastest driver, simple as.

(I appreciate that Williams have ignored this in the past!)

[anonymous-user]

Massa is well past his best, they need someone quick in that car.

[London424]

Frimley111R said:

For me it just doesn't make sense not to keep Massa. He is faster than Stroll and you don't ditch your fastest driver, simple as.

(I appreciate that Williams have ignored this in the past!)

Stroll has more points than Massa.

[rubystone]

Vaud said:

I don’t think he’d be a bad option. He’s no Alonso but his last race was pretty strong and he has solid experience.

He’s a very quick driver but his confidence has taken a knock. I’m sure he’d get the Williams further up the grid than Massa.

[HustleRussell]

London424 said:

Frimley111R said:

For me it just doesn't make sense not to keep Massa. He is faster than Stroll and you don't ditch your fastest driver, simple as.

(I appreciate that Williams have ignored this in the past!)

Stroll has more points than Massa.

Due largely to lady luck

[AndStilliRise]

HustleRussell said:

London424 said:

Frimley111R said:

For me it just doesn't make sense not to keep Massa. He is faster than Stroll and you don't ditch your fastest driver, simple as.

(I appreciate that Williams have ignored this in the past!)

Stroll has more points than Massa.

Due largely to lady luck

I agree.

[London424]

HustleRussell said:

London424 said:

Frimley111R said:

For me it just doesn't make sense not to keep Massa. He is faster than Stroll and you don't ditch your fastest driver, simple as.

(I appreciate that Williams have ignored this in the past!)

Stroll has more points than Massa.

Due largely to lady luck

I’m sure he’s completely fluked all of his points.

[HustleRussell]

London424 said:

HustleRussell said:

London424 said:

Frimley111R said:

For me it just doesn't make sense not to keep Massa. He is faster than Stroll and you don't ditch your fastest driver, simple as.

(I appreciate that Williams have ignored this in the past!)

Stroll has more points than Massa.

Due largely to lady luck

I’m sure he’s completely fluked all of his points.

I didn't say that. Stroll's podium in Baku, for instance, would've been Massa's were it not for a random suspension failure. Instead Massa retired. Stroll has come on leaps and bounds but he is not better than Massa yet.

[AndStilliRise]

HustleRussell said:

London424 said:

HustleRussell said:

London424 said:

Frimley111R said:

For me it just doesn't make sense not to keep Massa. He is faster than Stroll and you don't ditch your fastest driver, simple as.

(I appreciate that Williams have ignored this in the past!)

Stroll has more points than Massa.

Due largely to lady luck

I’m sure he’s completely fluked all of his points.

I didn't say that. Stroll's podium in Baku, for instance, would've been Massa's were it not for a random suspension failure. Instead Massa retired. Stroll has come on leaps and bounds but he is not better than Massa yet.

The difference is that Massa is a pole postion & race winner, which will always be more than a category above a rookie.

[Norfolkit]

AndStilliRise said:

HustleRussell said:

London424 said:

HustleRussell said:

London424 said:

Frimley111R said:

For me it just doesn't make sense not to keep Massa. He is faster than Stroll and you don't ditch your fastest driver, simple as.

(I appreciate that Williams have ignored this in the past!)

Stroll has more points than Massa.

Due largely to lady luck

I’m sure he’s completely fluked all of his points.

I didn't say that. Stroll's podium in Baku, for instance, would've been Massa's were it not for a random suspension failure. Instead Massa retired. Stroll has come on leaps and bounds but he is not better than Massa yet.

The difference is that Massa is a pole postion & race winner, which will always be more than a category above a rookie.

Might be more accurate to say "former pole position and race winner", he hasn't been doing much of either recently. Last pole Austria 2014, last win (surprisingly, surprised me anyway) was the "is that Glock going slowly, it's Glock" Brazilian race of 2008.

[Dr Z]

Norfolkit said:

Might be more accurate to say "former pole position and race winner", he hasn't been doing much of either recently. Last pole Austria 2014, last win (surprisingly, surprised me anyway) was the "is that Glock going slowly, it's Glock" Brazilian race of 2008.

How about 2010 German GP? Truly deserved to win that one.

'Fernando is faster than you, do you understand?'

'Sorry'