The Official 2017 Azerbaijan Grand Prix Thread **Spoilers**
Discussion
I think the biggest issue here is Vettel's complete refusal to admit he's in the wrong. Not the first time either. Who remember's when he collided with Mark Webber and then stood at the side of the track shaking his fist at him. In car footage clearly showed the he changed line (just like yesterday), and yet somehow it was all Webber's fault. Whilst the collision(s) were at low speed yesterday, it was still dangerous, and he should have been DQ'ed. Wonder what would have happened if he'd broken Lewis's suspension ??? I pretty much guarantee they'd have DQ'ed him then. He's a disgrace, and needs bringing to heel before one of his petulant episodes results in a nasty crash.
robbom3 said:
I think the biggest issue here is Vettel's complete refusal to admit he's in the wrong. Not the first time either. Who remember's when he collided with Mark Webber and then stood at the side of the track shaking his fist at him. In car footage clearly showed the he changed line (just like yesterday), and yet somehow it was all Webber's fault. Whilst the collision(s) were at low speed yesterday, it was still dangerous, and he should have been DQ'ed. Wonder what would have happened if he'd broken Lewis's suspension ??? I pretty much guarantee they'd have DQ'ed him then. He's a disgrace, and needs bringing to heel before one of his petulant episodes results in a nasty crash.
This and many other similar posts in this thread show the difference between a racer and fans commentating from the sofa.Don't get me wrong, Vettel was wrong in what he did.
However, what we saw yesterday was another demonstration of the old saying "You're not anymore a racing driver if when you see a gap you don't go for it". After the restart Vettel knew he had to stay as close as possible to the back of Hamilton's car if he wanted a chance to attack on the next straight. Hamilton was at the front and had the right to dictate the pace, however he should have accelerated a bit out of the corner, knowing that he had about 15 cars behind him accelerating and swerving before the corner and out of it in order to maintain the tire temp. Again, this is not an excuse for Vettel. But the moment he had backed of an maintained a 3-4 car length distance between them, he would have relinquished any chance of attack, and he wouldn't have been a race car driver anymore. And this is valid for any form of sport, be it karting, BTCC, F1....hell, even bike racing!
Forgive me as I've been a bit busy since the race, but is there a chance that the move was not deliberate? From the onboard I have seen he was gesticulating wildly so is there a chance it was accidental in that he caught the wheel with his hand has he put it in or pulled it out of the cockpit? Maybe this and the slow speed is why the punishment was more lenient than might have been expected.
The telemetry shows Hamilton did not unduly slow or alter the pressure on the brake pedal so the stewards know there was no brake test, but I think the other factors maybe why the punishment is seen to befit the crime by them.
The telemetry shows Hamilton did not unduly slow or alter the pressure on the brake pedal so the stewards know there was no brake test, but I think the other factors maybe why the punishment is seen to befit the crime by them.
Munter said:
BoRED S2upid said:
I think if he had damaged hamiltons car and affected his race Vetel would have been disqualified <snip>
Do we know that the shove up the back didn't damage the back of Hamilton's "headrest"?Munter said:
BoRED S2upid said:
I think if he had damaged hamiltons car and affected his race Vetel would have been disqualified <snip>
Do we know that the shove up the back didn't damage the back of Hamilton's "headrest"?Enricogto said:
This and many other similar posts in this thread show the difference between a racer and fans commentating from the sofa.
Don't get me wrong, Vettel was wrong in what he did.
However, what we saw yesterday was another demonstration of the old saying "You're not anymore a racing driver if when you see a gap you don't go for it". After the restart Vettel knew he had to stay as close as possible to the back of Hamilton's car if he wanted a chance to attack on the next straight. Hamilton was at the front and had the right to dictate the pace, however he should have accelerated a bit out of the corner, knowing that he had about 15 cars behind him accelerating and swerving before the corner and out of it in order to maintain the tire temp. Again, this is not an excuse for Vettel. But the moment he had backed of an maintained a 3-4 car length distance between them, he would have relinquished any chance of attack, and he wouldn't have been a race car driver anymore. And this is valid for any form of sport, be it karting, BTCC, F1....hell, even bike racing!
No. "You're not anymore a racing driver if when you see a gap you don't go for it" was a quote from Senna. He was a great driver, but also hot headed and prone to doing stupid stuff. That was a stupid quote he used to try and justify why he had so many accidents.Don't get me wrong, Vettel was wrong in what he did.
However, what we saw yesterday was another demonstration of the old saying "You're not anymore a racing driver if when you see a gap you don't go for it". After the restart Vettel knew he had to stay as close as possible to the back of Hamilton's car if he wanted a chance to attack on the next straight. Hamilton was at the front and had the right to dictate the pace, however he should have accelerated a bit out of the corner, knowing that he had about 15 cars behind him accelerating and swerving before the corner and out of it in order to maintain the tire temp. Again, this is not an excuse for Vettel. But the moment he had backed of an maintained a 3-4 car length distance between them, he would have relinquished any chance of attack, and he wouldn't have been a race car driver anymore. And this is valid for any form of sport, be it karting, BTCC, F1....hell, even bike racing!
Why should Hamilton have accelerated, because you think he should have? Vettel made an assumption that Lewis would floor it and he got it wrong. It really is that simple.
Edited by VladD on Monday 26th June 10:28
Munter said:
BoRED S2upid said:
I think if he had damaged hamiltons car and affected his race Vetel would have been disqualified <snip>
Do we know that the shove up the back didn't damage the back of Hamilton's "headrest"?It was being patched up during the Red Flag period. (Under close scrutiny from Ferrari 'observers' I noticed).
Hamilton seemed to lack ultimate pace after that, to me.
HARTLEYHARE1 said:
If I did rate Lewis as uk citizen and reasonable driver who actually cares about his home country and its people I'm sure I would feel some degree of agreement with today's incident but as Lewis is neither a nice guy , a uk citizen when it suits and only winning due to another great F1 driver building the Mercedes team before his arrival then I'm buying vettel his first beer for making his day
Everyone get over it
Would that be the same "another great F1 driver" who calls Switzerland home?Everyone get over it
Enricogto said:
This and many other similar posts in this thread show the difference between a racer and fans commentating from the sofa...However, what we saw yesterday was another demonstration of the old saying "You're not anymore a racing driver if when you see a gap you don't go for it".
For that incident fair enough, I don't think anyone has an issue with the 10 second penalty for that. Careless but a genuine accident, it was in neither drivers interest for that to happen.The issue, and you don't need to be a racer to comment on this, was him intentionally driving up alongside Hamilton and then driving into him. A serious case of red mist (and not the first time from Vettel, it has to be said) of the likes that you simply shouldn't see in safety conscious F1 these days. The fact that it essentially went unpunished is a very bizarre message to be coming out of F1.
That second incident, and that alone in isolation from the first one, is what they should have thrown the book at him for.
Well, that was an entertaining race, made good TV IMO.
Well done to Daniel and young Stroll, nothing like a good result to boost confidence. Also, excellent comeback by Bottas.
Someone bumping another up the arse under safety car had to happen sometime, it’s been very close several times before. I understand Vettel’s anger in thinking he had been brake tested whether true or not and also driving alongside gesticulating.
The contact though was bloody stupid, he must feel a right tit today.
Well done to Daniel and young Stroll, nothing like a good result to boost confidence. Also, excellent comeback by Bottas.
Someone bumping another up the arse under safety car had to happen sometime, it’s been very close several times before. I understand Vettel’s anger in thinking he had been brake tested whether true or not and also driving alongside gesticulating.
The contact though was bloody stupid, he must feel a right tit today.
ukaskew said:
Indeed, especially as the actual reason for Vettel's 10 second penalty was 'potentially dangerous' driving.
I'd love to know what constitutes actual honest-to-goodness dangerous driving.
For a start why bother racing your opponent, just crash into him on the warm up, cant be considered dangerous now, we have a rulingI'd love to know what constitutes actual honest-to-goodness dangerous driving.
Adrian W said:
ukaskew said:
Indeed, especially as the actual reason for Vettel's 10 second penalty was 'potentially dangerous' driving.
I'd love to know what constitutes actual honest-to-goodness dangerous driving.
For a start why bother racing your opponent, just crash into him on the warm up, cant be considered dangerous now, we have a rulingI'd love to know what constitutes actual honest-to-goodness dangerous driving.
Breaking news: It's all over the internet that Lewis has suggested that he and Vettel sort their differences out with a man-on-man confrontation. Fisticuffs behind the pitlane, it's hammertime Lewis 
You couldn't make it up, the media always tell the truth, don't they?....Oh, wait....
You couldn't make it up, the media always tell the truth, don't they?....Oh, wait....
kambites said:
The really daft thing about Vettel's complaints about being "brake tested" are that according to the stewards, Hamilton's inputs were exactly the same as on the other SC restarts so Vettel had already seen him do exactly the same thing before.
At the point where Seb had just got out of the car, he may have been erroneously under the impression that Lewis had brake tested him. Those interviews were conducted while he still had that impression.It will be interesting to hear him interviewed now he has seen as much as we have seen from the telemetry and officials.
GuitarTech said:
Breaking news: It's all over the internet that Lewis has suggested that he and Vettel sort their differences out with a man-on-man confrontation. Fisticuffs behind the pitlane, it's hammertime Lewis
You couldn't make it up, the media always tell the truth, don't they?....Oh, wait....
He said it on the Live C4 coverage.You couldn't make it up, the media always tell the truth, don't they?....Oh, wait....
SeeFive said:
At the point where Seb had just got out of the car, he may have been erroneously under the impression that Lewis had brake tested him. Those interviews were conducted while he still had that impression.
It will be interesting to hear him interviewed now he has seen as much as we have seen from the telemetry and officials.
Indeed. His conduct from this point onward will be interesting. I expect Ferrari PR will be having a word with him too.It will be interesting to hear him interviewed now he has seen as much as we have seen from the telemetry and officials.
Munter said:
GuitarTech said:
Breaking news: It's all over the internet that Lewis has suggested that he and Vettel sort their differences out with a man-on-man confrontation. Fisticuffs behind the pitlane, it's hammertime Lewis
You couldn't make it up, the media always tell the truth, don't they?....Oh, wait....
He said it on the Live C4 coverage.You couldn't make it up, the media always tell the truth, don't they?....Oh, wait....
Munter said:
GuitarTech said:
Breaking news: It's all over the internet that Lewis has suggested that he and Vettel sort their differences out with a man-on-man confrontation. Fisticuffs behind the pitlane, it's hammertime Lewis
You couldn't make it up, the media always tell the truth, don't they?....Oh, wait....
He said it on the Live C4 coverage.You couldn't make it up, the media always tell the truth, don't they?....Oh, wait....
Gassing Station | Formula 1 | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff