Sebastian Vettel
Discussion
ELUSIVEJIM said:
Stan the Bat said:
I'm interested to see how VB77 goes the rest of the year !
Might be a hot property at years end. ( or might not )
He has been impressive this year. The stubble has made a difference. Might be a hot property at years end. ( or might not )
Canada will be a big race. Needs a pole and to get into the first corner ahead of Hamilton. If Hamilton wins the demons in Botta's head might start to appear.
The Hamilton demons
VB has just shown how good the Mercedes is.
FourWheelDrift said:
What I see as Ferrari's options if Vettel retires.
Max Verstappen - expensive to grab from Red Bull, depends on how many retirements he gets this year too.
Kimi Raikkonen - taken back from Alfa Romeo to guide LeClerc
Mick Schumacher - unproven, Ferrari backed in F2 but they don't sign inexperienced drivers to their F1 team.
Ferrari reserve drivers: Pascal Wehrlein, Brendon Hartley, Antonio Fuoco, Davide Rigon, - No, No, No and No.
Verstappen as I say depends on what happens this year and how tight Red Bull hold on, Schumacher lacks experience especially to go alongside LeClerc, I can however see Raikkonen coming back for 1 more year with Schumacher parachuted into Alfa Romeo for the experience.
Kimi could be moved back into the Ferrari. We know he would score points on a regular basis and be a good number 2 for LeClerc moving forward.Max Verstappen - expensive to grab from Red Bull, depends on how many retirements he gets this year too.
Kimi Raikkonen - taken back from Alfa Romeo to guide LeClerc
Mick Schumacher - unproven, Ferrari backed in F2 but they don't sign inexperienced drivers to their F1 team.
Ferrari reserve drivers: Pascal Wehrlein, Brendon Hartley, Antonio Fuoco, Davide Rigon, - No, No, No and No.
Verstappen as I say depends on what happens this year and how tight Red Bull hold on, Schumacher lacks experience especially to go alongside LeClerc, I can however see Raikkonen coming back for 1 more year with Schumacher parachuted into Alfa Romeo for the experience.
Can't see Mick Schumacher. Just too soon and as you say inexperienced. Agree with none of the reserve drivers being promoted.
To be honest, if Vettel leaves at the end of 2019 Ferrari will be in a pickle.
Considering the above I would say the following
Max Verstappen
Daniel Ricciardo
Fernando Alonso.
Just can't think of another driver currently on the grid or in a lower series who would be a step forward from Vettel.
HustleRussell said:
What about Kvyat? Top team experience, spent 2018 with Ferrari, going well this season with no mistakes?
I would imagine that Red Bull would want to keep Kyvat at Toro Rosso as he has been doing a great job this season.Red Bull must be watching Gasly closely as we know how quickly a few bad races could seal his fate.
Would Kyvat be a big enough name to replace Vettel?
thegreenhell said:
No.
He's only got back in to Red Bull because they were short of other options for this year. He'll be dropped about three seconds after Dick Tantrum gets his superlicence.
Think you will be right mate. Albon has been pretty impressive this year. Kyvat will need to blow him away if he continues with the team.He's only got back in to Red Bull because they were short of other options for this year. He'll be dropped about three seconds after Dick Tantrum gets his superlicence.
Derek Smith said:
He's made too many mistakes this season. It belies his quality. Something has changed with him. Whilst suggesting it is having kids is a bit glib, it has my bet.
I think he'll behave loyally and responsibly and inform Ferrari if he does intend to leave. He's too much of a gentleman to do a Rosberg. Mind you, I think the vast majority of drivers are. We'll know if/when he does because his driving will improve.
Despite what Horner says, if MV is offered the spot he will take up the space. He'd be an idiot not to. They might go for VB of course, and I think it could be a good move for both, but I'm not sure he'll go for it. Leclerk will get his act together and that will be a challenge. At the moment he's free from directions.
I'll be sorry to see him go, but not overwhelmingly so, at least if he continues in his present behaviour.
Good post. I don't get all the hate for Vettel, yes in the car he can be a bit of an arse sometimes... can't they all, but out of it he is polite and funny. I think it will be a massive loss if he decides to call it quits, but you're right he's not at his best right now and it's not just down to not having the best car. If he decides to go then so be it, but I think Ferrari will be hard pushed to find anyone as good as him to put in the car. If I were them I would go for Ricciardo for a couple of seasons while LeClerc finds his feet.I think he'll behave loyally and responsibly and inform Ferrari if he does intend to leave. He's too much of a gentleman to do a Rosberg. Mind you, I think the vast majority of drivers are. We'll know if/when he does because his driving will improve.
Despite what Horner says, if MV is offered the spot he will take up the space. He'd be an idiot not to. They might go for VB of course, and I think it could be a good move for both, but I'm not sure he'll go for it. Leclerk will get his act together and that will be a challenge. At the moment he's free from directions.
I'll be sorry to see him go, but not overwhelmingly so, at least if he continues in his present behaviour.
REALIST123 said:
VB has just shown how good the Mercedes is.
Hamilton was saying recently how the cars need to be harder to drive and I think this is a key point. A good driver can get so much closer to a great driver right now, far more so than in times past. Teammates are generally far closer to each other and if they're not it's because one is out of his depth. Youngsters can come in and drive the cars very well almost straight away too... that rarely happened even 10 years ago. Not sure whether this is a good thing or a bad thing, but it's definitely the way it is right now.snowen250 said:
Why not Ocon?
Proven, probably out of a drive still next year, yes he's linked to merc, but probably cheaper to buy out of contract then somone like Max or Ricciardo...
Not a big enough name. He was also beaten by Perez in both 2017/18.Proven, probably out of a drive still next year, yes he's linked to merc, but probably cheaper to buy out of contract then somone like Max or Ricciardo...
Perez is a very solid driver but his stint at McLaren really has made him very unlikely to be taken on by one of the big teams.
The chances of Vettel retiring this year are very slim but I would be very surprised if he carried on after 2020.
EDLT said:
I'm fairly sure this whole rumour comes from a C4 interview that was shown on Sunday. He mentioned life after F1 and the C4 team implied he was thinking about retiring. The tabloids only got the scoop afterwards. 
I don't know why Hamilton, Bottas and Verstappen would be considered as Vettel replacements, Ferrari's mystical pull has been all but killed off by having three world champions incapable of winning another season for the last decade. The guys in top teams will want to stay where they are or move to Mercedes.
Not sure I agree about Ferrari losing their pull. They went many years without winning championships yet still managed to attract the biggest names. Unless they're plodding around the midfield or worse, they'll always have that allure and the biggest names will almost always want a stint there. I don't know why Hamilton, Bottas and Verstappen would be considered as Vettel replacements, Ferrari's mystical pull has been all but killed off by having three world champions incapable of winning another season for the last decade. The guys in top teams will want to stay where they are or move to Mercedes.In recent times they've attracted Mansell, Prost, Alesi, Berger, Raikonnen, some guy called Schumacher and a two time WDC known as Alonso. It is heavily rumoured Senna intended to sign for the red team before he retired. My memory may let me down, but I don't believe any of them jumped into the car at a time it was the previous seasons WDC winner or the dominant force at the front.
EDLT said:
"Recent times" in my mind would be within the period where the current crop of drivers were alive. The average age of the drivers is around 25 with all the future stars being 20-21, they are not going to be swayed by the career decisions of Nigel Mansell. All of the drivers want to be in the car that is the fastest now because current rules on development mean it's probably going to be the fastest next year too. It's even more important to be in the current best car when careers are apparently so short that old man Vettel is considering retirement at 31.
You're writing as of the last 20 years has been in a bubble.The competitive edge of drivers positioning for seats and the dominance of the car in their chances is no different now to the 80s and well before.
The fact is Ferrari have had much longer barren spells than now and still attract the top talent and always will. They have a unique place in motoring and F1, not to mention very, very deep pockets for salaries and car development.
Hamilton is nothing if not a romantic to the history of the F1 he followed as a kid. One that included Ferrari at the forefront of most drivers' minds and, in particular, Senna.
I'd put a decent wedge of money on him wearing scarlet before he's done with F1.
TheDeuce said:
Ok, how much?
Doesn't really matter. I have no reason to make up an opinion on the internet.On one side we have repeated, consistent history that shows us world champions tend to be attracted to Ferrari, irrespective of its current competitiveness and, in the other, people saying modern F1 and drivers are different and Ferrari will find it hard to attract them (unless their car is demonstrably at the front).
I'll stick to believing what I've seen over the past 40 years of F1 and others can believe whatever they want.
£5.
janesmith1950 said:
I have no reason to make up an opinion on the internet.
Isn't that what everyone does and what you just did? All opinions are made up based on your perceived knowledge.
You would have to be mental to move from Mercedes by choice in the current era
Ferrari isn't the draw you think it is, drivers go there because they think it's a better option that the one they currently have.
The main reason Schumacher went there was because they had the resources and finances to pay for a super team over a long period, had his current team been in that position he would have stayed put.
Durzel said:
Does Hamilton want to be in F1 in 3 years time though?
He has irons in some other fires, and if he's not being actively challenged to a sufficient degree in the circuit then it's mostly just the money that is probably the attraction.
Of course he might be happy to carry on as he has been for the past few years, but one wonders whether it really is fulfilling or not.
I think despite his protestations to the contrary he wants Schumacher's wins and championship records. It was noticeable how hard he worked to win the last 2 GPs of last season when he didn't need to and traditionally eases off once he's wrapped up the title. I think if he eclipses the wins and matches the DWCs he'll then think about what he wants to do next and it maybe retire or have a final go in the red team.He has irons in some other fires, and if he's not being actively challenged to a sufficient degree in the circuit then it's mostly just the money that is probably the attraction.
Of course he might be happy to carry on as he has been for the past few years, but one wonders whether it really is fulfilling or not.
cb1965 said:
I think despite his protestations to the contrary he wants Schumacher's wins and championship records. It was noticeable how hard he worked to win the last 2 GPs of last season when he didn't need to and traditionally eases off once he's wrapped up the title. I think if he eclipses the wins and matches the DWCs he'll then think about what he wants to do next and it maybe retire or have a final go in the red team.
Was it not the end of 2015 when Hamilton eased off and Rosberg then went onto win the final three races that season.Then in 2016, Rosberg went onto win the first four races which meant a 7-0 to Rosberg.
Perhaps this is still very fresh in his mind.
swisstoni said:
I don't think we can write things off that easily. Ferrari haven't gone that far down the pan.
It's a bit like saying Man City have next years PL sewn up. Quite possibly they have but there's just too many moving parts to say it's a done deal.
In Bahrain, the Ferrari looked amazing. 1-2 on the grid and then lead the race until the car issue.It's a bit like saying Man City have next years PL sewn up. Quite possibly they have but there's just too many moving parts to say it's a done deal.
So why was the car so good in Bahrain? Track temperature being higher or was it the fact the track had less slow corners?
Something made the Ferrari work which it hasn't done since.
The car was looking quite good in Baku as well but we all know what happened there.
Maybe Canada will suit the car better.
sparta6 said:
TheDeuce said:
Exactly. Their F1 budget is essentially limitless as it's clearly worth it for them, so long as they keep performing well at least. And of course, pending cost caps, however effective they may be.
In any case, the 350m (more like 400m now I think) is their revenue, only part of that comes from Mercedes.
To really put it into perspective, Mercedes (auto makers) spend about £10m per day on R&D, so 350-400m, less sponsorship revenue, is about what they spend on R&D in a single month. In truth the F1 budget is fairly insignificant to the group as a whole.
They are the Microsoft of F1In any case, the 350m (more like 400m now I think) is their revenue, only part of that comes from Mercedes.
To really put it into perspective, Mercedes (auto makers) spend about £10m per day on R&D, so 350-400m, less sponsorship revenue, is about what they spend on R&D in a single month. In truth the F1 budget is fairly insignificant to the group as a whole.
Edited by anonymous-user on Monday 3rd June 13:51
ChocolateFrog said:
Wouldn't be surprised if he's in the death throes of his career, making more mistakes than ever and it will be a minor miracle if he can turn this season round.
Frankly, he’d be warranted in giving up, it must be hard fighting with a rival in a superior car and the oddctine he manages to win a race its stolen from him. I doubt he makes many more mistakes than Hamilton would if Hamilton didn’t have that superior car, a compliant teammate and had to really race.
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