Max Verstappen
Discussion
honda_exige said:
NRS said:
If you think that’s casually placed there and not very deliberately done I’ve got some magic beans to sell you, 
He’s even got it perfectly aligned for his head height.
The location is casual even if the intention isn't. He’s even got it perfectly aligned for his head height.
Edited by NRS on Saturday 25th March 13:16
Kinda similar to where I keep my Time Attack trophy ha.
honda_exige said:
NRS said:
If you think that’s casually placed there and not very deliberately done I’ve got some magic beans to sell you,
He’s even got it perfectly aligned for his head height.
The location is casual even if the intention isn't. He’s even got it perfectly aligned for his head height.
Edited by NRS on Saturday 25th March 13:16
Kinda similar to where I keep my Time Attack trophy ha.
Max Verstappen starts a clothing brand called 'Max 1'.
Nike: No.
https://www.planetf1.com/news/nike-max-verstappen-...
Nike: No.
https://www.planetf1.com/news/nike-max-verstappen-...
ajprice said:
Max Verstappen starts a clothing brand called 'Max 1'.
Nike: No.
https://www.planetf1.com/news/nike-max-verstappen-...
This is stupid, it is literally his name...Nike: No.
https://www.planetf1.com/news/nike-max-verstappen-...
Siao said:
ajprice said:
Max Verstappen starts a clothing brand called 'Max 1'.
Nike: No.
https://www.planetf1.com/news/nike-max-verstappen-...
This is stupid, it is literally his name...Nike: No.
https://www.planetf1.com/news/nike-max-verstappen-...
Edited by HustleRussell on Monday 27th March 14:39
HustleRussell said:
Siao said:
ajprice said:
Max Verstappen starts a clothing brand called 'Max 1'.
Nike: No.
https://www.planetf1.com/news/nike-max-verstappen-...
This is stupid, it is literally his name...Nike: No.
https://www.planetf1.com/news/nike-max-verstappen-...
Edited by HustleRussell on Monday 27th March 14:39
Verstappen will almost certainly match Senna's win record at the next race and exceed it at the race after that unless he has a mechanical issue or a collision.
How do we feel about this? My view is that he's clearly a very fast driver, but I find it difficult to see him alongside Senna. I think most of the reason for this is that Senna went to McLaren and took on the established best in the business, Alain Prost. Likewise, Prost had to deal with Senna. Hamilton took on - and get the better of - Alonso, (as a rookie), as well as Rosberg and Button. Mansell had Prost and Piquet to deal with.
Verstappen has yet to be paired with a truly top-level driver. He had Ricciardo, who ultimately was a long way from an all-time great, and that matchup was by no means a walkover. What he has now with the 2023 Red Bull and Perez as a teammate I see rather like what Mansell had in 1992, that is to say, a completely dominant car and a solid but journeyman teammate.
When Verstappen has been under a lot of pressure he has shown himself to be rather prone to choking. At the end of 2021, his driving was becoming outright dangerous. He has also had a significant amount of collisions and was a concern for the other drivers right from when he arrived in the sport because he had a tendency to move around in braking zones, which is a huge no-no.
So, PH, where do you see MV's level in the big scheme of things?
How do we feel about this? My view is that he's clearly a very fast driver, but I find it difficult to see him alongside Senna. I think most of the reason for this is that Senna went to McLaren and took on the established best in the business, Alain Prost. Likewise, Prost had to deal with Senna. Hamilton took on - and get the better of - Alonso, (as a rookie), as well as Rosberg and Button. Mansell had Prost and Piquet to deal with.
Verstappen has yet to be paired with a truly top-level driver. He had Ricciardo, who ultimately was a long way from an all-time great, and that matchup was by no means a walkover. What he has now with the 2023 Red Bull and Perez as a teammate I see rather like what Mansell had in 1992, that is to say, a completely dominant car and a solid but journeyman teammate.
When Verstappen has been under a lot of pressure he has shown himself to be rather prone to choking. At the end of 2021, his driving was becoming outright dangerous. He has also had a significant amount of collisions and was a concern for the other drivers right from when he arrived in the sport because he had a tendency to move around in braking zones, which is a huge no-no.
So, PH, where do you see MV's level in the big scheme of things?
paulguitar said:
Verstappen will almost certainly match Senna's win record at the next race and exceed it at the race after that unless he has a mechanical issue or a collision.
How do we feel about this? My view is that he's clearly a very fast driver, but I find it difficult to see him alongside Senna. I think most of the reason for this is that Senna went to McLaren and took on the established best in the business, Alain Prost. Likewise, Prost had to deal with Senna. Hamilton took on - and get the better of - Alonso, (as a rookie), as well as Rosberg and Button. Mansell had Prost and Piquet to deal with.
Verstappen has yet to be paired with a truly top-level driver. He had Ricciardo, who ultimately was a long way from an all-time great, and that matchup was by no means a walkover. What he has now with the 2023 Red Bull and Perez as a teammate I see rather like what Mansell had in 1992, that is to say, a completely dominant car and a solid but journeyman teammate.
When Verstappen has been under a lot of pressure he has shown himself to be rather prone to choking. At the end of 2021, his driving was becoming outright dangerous. He has also had a significant amount of collisions and was a concern for the other drivers right from when he arrived in the sport because he had a tendency to move around in braking zones, which is a huge no-no.
So, PH, where do you see MV's level in the big scheme of things?
I was no fan of Senna's back when he was racing for championships: his ruthless approach to winning reminds me of Verstappen in ways I struggle with, I don't see it as necessary to be the best. However, once he got the monkey off his back, I warmed to him, & some of his race performances were stella. Verstappens pole at Monaco was reminiscent, but the only positive one that springs to mind. I'm hoping that, in time, my opinion of him will also mellow, but the stats won't do that for me, I suspect. It'll perhaps arrive when we see how he performs as his star wains, which Sennas didn't get the chance to.How do we feel about this? My view is that he's clearly a very fast driver, but I find it difficult to see him alongside Senna. I think most of the reason for this is that Senna went to McLaren and took on the established best in the business, Alain Prost. Likewise, Prost had to deal with Senna. Hamilton took on - and get the better of - Alonso, (as a rookie), as well as Rosberg and Button. Mansell had Prost and Piquet to deal with.
Verstappen has yet to be paired with a truly top-level driver. He had Ricciardo, who ultimately was a long way from an all-time great, and that matchup was by no means a walkover. What he has now with the 2023 Red Bull and Perez as a teammate I see rather like what Mansell had in 1992, that is to say, a completely dominant car and a solid but journeyman teammate.
When Verstappen has been under a lot of pressure he has shown himself to be rather prone to choking. At the end of 2021, his driving was becoming outright dangerous. He has also had a significant amount of collisions and was a concern for the other drivers right from when he arrived in the sport because he had a tendency to move around in braking zones, which is a huge no-no.
So, PH, where do you see MV's level in the big scheme of things?
paulguitar said:
Verstappen will almost certainly match Senna's win record at the next race and exceed it at the race after that unless he has a mechanical issue or a collision.
How do we feel about this? My view is that he's clearly a very fast driver, but I find it difficult to see him alongside Senna. I think most of the reason for this is that Senna went to McLaren and took on the established best in the business, Alain Prost. Likewise, Prost had to deal with Senna. Hamilton took on - and get the better of - Alonso, (as a rookie), as well as Rosberg and Button. Mansell had Prost and Piquet to deal with.
Verstappen has yet to be paired with a truly top-level driver. He had Ricciardo, who ultimately was a long way from an all-time great, and that matchup was by no means a walkover. What he has now with the 2023 Red Bull and Perez as a teammate I see rather like what Mansell had in 1992, that is to say, a completely dominant car and a solid but journeyman teammate.
When Verstappen has been under a lot of pressure he has shown himself to be rather prone to choking. At the end of 2021, his driving was becoming outright dangerous. He has also had a significant amount of collisions and was a concern for the other drivers right from when he arrived in the sport because he had a tendency to move around in braking zones, which is a huge no-no.
So, PH, where do you see MV's level in the big scheme of things?
I think he is an extremely fast and competent driver. He is not a top racer. He lacks the maturity and self control to ever be considered one of the greats. How do we feel about this? My view is that he's clearly a very fast driver, but I find it difficult to see him alongside Senna. I think most of the reason for this is that Senna went to McLaren and took on the established best in the business, Alain Prost. Likewise, Prost had to deal with Senna. Hamilton took on - and get the better of - Alonso, (as a rookie), as well as Rosberg and Button. Mansell had Prost and Piquet to deal with.
Verstappen has yet to be paired with a truly top-level driver. He had Ricciardo, who ultimately was a long way from an all-time great, and that matchup was by no means a walkover. What he has now with the 2023 Red Bull and Perez as a teammate I see rather like what Mansell had in 1992, that is to say, a completely dominant car and a solid but journeyman teammate.
When Verstappen has been under a lot of pressure he has shown himself to be rather prone to choking. At the end of 2021, his driving was becoming outright dangerous. He has also had a significant amount of collisions and was a concern for the other drivers right from when he arrived in the sport because he had a tendency to move around in braking zones, which is a huge no-no.
So, PH, where do you see MV's level in the big scheme of things?
When everything is going his way and he has a superior car, he can perform impressive, faultless displays. When put under any sort of real pressure he will lose his cool, I had hoped he had matured over the last couple of seasons of dominance as the way he was behaving towards the end of 21 could have easily ended in someone being seriously hurt or killed. Sadly though it looks to have been the lack of pressure leading to more sensible driving rather than any sort of epiphany.
That plus Redbull are a particularly unlikeable team, and the toxicity they portray rubs off on the drivers.
paulguitar said:
Verstappen will almost certainly match Senna's win record at the next race and exceed it at the race after that unless he has a mechanical issue or a collision.
How do we feel about this? My view is that he's clearly a very fast driver, but I find it difficult to see him alongside Senna. I think most of the reason for this is that Senna went to McLaren and took on the established best in the business, Alain Prost. Likewise, Prost had to deal with Senna. Hamilton took on - and get the better of - Alonso, (as a rookie), as well as Rosberg and Button. Mansell had Prost and Piquet to deal with.
Verstappen has yet to be paired with a truly top-level driver. He had Ricciardo, who ultimately was a long way from an all-time great, and that matchup was by no means a walkover. What he has now with the 2023 Red Bull and Perez as a teammate I see rather like what Mansell had in 1992, that is to say, a completely dominant car and a solid but journeyman teammate.
When Verstappen has been under a lot of pressure he has shown himself to be rather prone to choking. At the end of 2021, his driving was becoming outright dangerous. He has also had a significant amount of collisions and was a concern for the other drivers right from when he arrived in the sport because he had a tendency to move around in braking zones, which is a huge no-no.
So, PH, where do you see MV's level in the big scheme of things?
Results are results, you can only beat your peers. 3 (or 4) Grand Chelms now too.. young, quick enough over one lap, methodical accurate race pace, his standing will only grow over the coming years.How do we feel about this? My view is that he's clearly a very fast driver, but I find it difficult to see him alongside Senna. I think most of the reason for this is that Senna went to McLaren and took on the established best in the business, Alain Prost. Likewise, Prost had to deal with Senna. Hamilton took on - and get the better of - Alonso, (as a rookie), as well as Rosberg and Button. Mansell had Prost and Piquet to deal with.
Verstappen has yet to be paired with a truly top-level driver. He had Ricciardo, who ultimately was a long way from an all-time great, and that matchup was by no means a walkover. What he has now with the 2023 Red Bull and Perez as a teammate I see rather like what Mansell had in 1992, that is to say, a completely dominant car and a solid but journeyman teammate.
When Verstappen has been under a lot of pressure he has shown himself to be rather prone to choking. At the end of 2021, his driving was becoming outright dangerous. He has also had a significant amount of collisions and was a concern for the other drivers right from when he arrived in the sport because he had a tendency to move around in braking zones, which is a huge no-no.
So, PH, where do you see MV's level in the big scheme of things?
His current team mate is the 3rd most experienced driver on the grid.
I think a lot of the traits you mention, have also been seen by other WDC winners, everyone has a flaw.
Heres my outlook..
& in no particular order..
Turbo Hybrid top 2 (might well be joint 1st by 2026)
Post 2006 Top 4, (add in Seb & Nando)
Modern Era Top 10 (add in Schu, Prost, Senna, Mika, Prime Kimi, Piquet)
All time, Difficult to measure back to the 50/60/70
Ive been watching since the mid 80's he would have held is own in any era with the names mentioned above.
TriumphStag3.0V8 said:
I think he is an extremely fast and competent driver. He is not a top racer. He lacks the maturity and self control to ever be considered one of the greats.
When everything is going his way and he has a superior car, he can perform impressive, faultless displays. When put under any sort of real pressure he will lose his cool, I had hoped he had matured over the last couple of seasons of dominance as the way he was behaving towards the end of 21 could have easily ended in someone being seriously hurt or killed. Sadly though it looks to have been the lack of pressure leading to more sensible driving rather than any sort of epiphany.
That plus Redbull are a particularly unlikeable team, and the toxicity they portray rubs off on the drivers.
Agreed.When everything is going his way and he has a superior car, he can perform impressive, faultless displays. When put under any sort of real pressure he will lose his cool, I had hoped he had matured over the last couple of seasons of dominance as the way he was behaving towards the end of 21 could have easily ended in someone being seriously hurt or killed. Sadly though it looks to have been the lack of pressure leading to more sensible driving rather than any sort of epiphany.
That plus Redbull are a particularly unlikeable team, and the toxicity they portray rubs off on the drivers.
TriumphStag3.0V8 said:
I think he is an extremely fast and competent driver. He is not a top racer. He lacks the maturity and self control to ever be considered one of the greats.
When everything is going his way and he has a superior car, he can perform impressive, faultless displays. When put under any sort of real pressure he will lose his cool, I had hoped he had matured over the last couple of seasons of dominance as the way he was behaving towards the end of 21 could have easily ended in someone being seriously hurt or killed. Sadly though it looks to have been the lack of pressure leading to more sensible driving rather than any sort of epiphany.
That plus Redbull are a particularly unlikeable team, and the toxicity they portray rubs off on the drivers.
Almost exactly my thoughts. When everything is going his way and he has a superior car, he can perform impressive, faultless displays. When put under any sort of real pressure he will lose his cool, I had hoped he had matured over the last couple of seasons of dominance as the way he was behaving towards the end of 21 could have easily ended in someone being seriously hurt or killed. Sadly though it looks to have been the lack of pressure leading to more sensible driving rather than any sort of epiphany.
That plus Redbull are a particularly unlikeable team, and the toxicity they portray rubs off on the drivers.
The only thing I would say is he can take the pressure of winning, not crashing in the lead etc (in the main, we've seen the odd error in quali but those are few and far between) - so he is clearly damn competent at driving. But if under pressure from another driver racing him, then it seems to fall apart a bit. And if it is Hamilton, a lot....
wpa1975 said:
TriumphStag3.0V8 said:
I think he is an extremely fast and competent driver. He is not a top racer. He lacks the maturity and self control to ever be considered one of the greats.
When everything is going his way and he has a superior car, he can perform impressive, faultless displays. When put under any sort of real pressure he will lose his cool, I had hoped he had matured over the last couple of seasons of dominance as the way he was behaving towards the end of 21 could have easily ended in someone being seriously hurt or killed. Sadly though it looks to have been the lack of pressure leading to more sensible driving rather than any sort of epiphany.
That plus Redbull are a particularly unlikeable team, and the toxicity they portray rubs off on the drivers.
Agreed.When everything is going his way and he has a superior car, he can perform impressive, faultless displays. When put under any sort of real pressure he will lose his cool, I had hoped he had matured over the last couple of seasons of dominance as the way he was behaving towards the end of 21 could have easily ended in someone being seriously hurt or killed. Sadly though it looks to have been the lack of pressure leading to more sensible driving rather than any sort of epiphany.
That plus Redbull are a particularly unlikeable team, and the toxicity they portray rubs off on the drivers.
TriumphStag3.0V8 said:
I think he is an extremely fast and competent driver. He is not a top racer. He lacks the maturity and self control to ever be considered one of the greats.
When everything is going his way and he has a superior car, he can perform impressive, faultless displays. When put under any sort of real pressure he will lose his cool, I had hoped he had matured over the last couple of seasons of dominance as the way he was behaving towards the end of 21 could have easily ended in someone being seriously hurt or killed. Sadly though it looks to have been the lack of pressure leading to more sensible driving rather than any sort of epiphany.
That plus Redbull are a particularly unlikeable team, and the toxicity they portray rubs off on the drivers.
I think that one post has very well summed up this 100 page thread. When everything is going his way and he has a superior car, he can perform impressive, faultless displays. When put under any sort of real pressure he will lose his cool, I had hoped he had matured over the last couple of seasons of dominance as the way he was behaving towards the end of 21 could have easily ended in someone being seriously hurt or killed. Sadly though it looks to have been the lack of pressure leading to more sensible driving rather than any sort of epiphany.
That plus Redbull are a particularly unlikeable team, and the toxicity they portray rubs off on the drivers.
He does have talent, that isn't in doubt, I find the way he acts like a petulant kid the problem combined with a team that is disliked. I also thought Verstappen Snr's reaction when Perez last won very telling, he refused to congratulate.
TriumphStag3.0V8 said:
I think he is an extremely fast and competent driver. He is not a top racer. He lacks the maturity and self control to ever be considered one of the greats.
When everything is going his way and he has a superior car, he can perform impressive, faultless displays. When put under any sort of real pressure he will lose his cool, I had hoped he had matured over the last couple of seasons of dominance as the way he was behaving towards the end of 21 could have easily ended in someone being seriously hurt or killed. Sadly though it looks to have been the lack of pressure leading to more sensible driving rather than any sort of epiphany.
That plus Redbull are a particularly unlikeable team, and the toxicity they portray rubs off on the drivers.
Totally agree - it’s the Vettel Effect all over again.When everything is going his way and he has a superior car, he can perform impressive, faultless displays. When put under any sort of real pressure he will lose his cool, I had hoped he had matured over the last couple of seasons of dominance as the way he was behaving towards the end of 21 could have easily ended in someone being seriously hurt or killed. Sadly though it looks to have been the lack of pressure leading to more sensible driving rather than any sort of epiphany.
That plus Redbull are a particularly unlikeable team, and the toxicity they portray rubs off on the drivers.
When Seb was at Red Bull he was in his element and peerless when things went his way. But I could never warm to him.. there was always something fundamentally unlikeable about him, and I don’t just mean ‘The Finger’. Remember all the questions at the time about just how good he was at overtaking and the other doubts about his race craft?
Once he’d moved to Ferrari (and certainly when he was at Aston) he seemed to gradually turn into a decent bloke, the sort you’d happily have a pint with.
Whether or not the same transformation will happen to Max, well, only time will tell. Perhaps if he gets away from the clutches of Red Bull he’ll turn into a nicer character and a more rounded, fairer driver. But at the moment he comes across as a thuggish entitled brat. Some of this is not wholly his fault: being surrounded by the influence of his father (’A Verstappen can never lose’
) and the enabling of his behaviour by Horner etc. is not a healthy environment. As much as I dislike RB, they do seem to excel at providing their chosen driver with a car perfectly tailored to their driving style. That does also seem to have the side effect of flattering the talent of that driver though. Do people now (and in the future) consider Vettel to be an all time great, or just a very good driver who was in the right place at the right time? Will Verstappen be considered in the same way?
It'll certainly be interesting to see how this all plays out over the next few seasons.
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