New engine regs for 2021
Discussion
rdjohn said:
Megaflow said:
I suspect if has got very limited use for road cars. The problems with developing a motor that runs at 125k plus rpm, at temperatures like that near a turbo charger are significant. Then to make it durable and reliable enough ramp that up some more. But the real killer is to make it work, durably and reliably at a cost that is actually beneficial to the end user is reduced fuel consumption, is almost impossible.
It might be useful in a many years time, if oil gets really expensive if it starts to run out. But by then BEV’s will dominate and it will be consider old hat.
If it was ever going to happen, we would have seen something by now. A truck charging it's battery for KERS assistance up hill, or a small car with its turbo kept spinning off load.It might be useful in a many years time, if oil gets really expensive if it starts to run out. But by then BEV’s will dominate and it will be consider old hat.
It was a great idea, but will get consigned to history as a gap between what is desirable and what is doable, at an affordable cost.
AMuS reports that apparently now all engine manufacturers except Honda want to keep the MGU-H per the strategy meeting a few days ago. It is speculated that this is to dissuade other manufacturers from entering the sport in 2021 so the current manufacturers play in the arena by themselves. They consider Porsche as a big threat as the entities involved in the sport won't be able to put as much development effort into the new engine as a manufacturer not currently playing.
janesmith1950 said:
The idea is that different compounds means teams will have different performance at different time.
Oh, yeah, and when did that actually happen?If you,look at any race analysis, you will see that only the 3 top teams can extract decent performance, for the rest, fighting degradation is the normal order of the day.
Look at Austria. https://www.jamesallenonf1.com/wp-content/uploads/...
coppice said:
The manufacturers can and should f
k off as they are the problem and not the solution. The sooner we ditch them and get back to relatively affordable, simpler and noiser engines (not effing 'power units' FFS ) made by specialists the better.
And then F1 becomes just another open wheel series and probably slower than some. It's the money and glamour that makes modern F1 what it is and gives it it's appeal to the masses. You need big bucks and big manufacturers for that. k off as they are the problem and not the solution. The sooner we ditch them and get back to relatively affordable, simpler and noiser engines (not effing 'power units' FFS ) made by specialists the better. Kraken said:
And then F1 becomes just another open wheel series and probably slower than some. It's the money and glamour that makes modern F1 what it is and gives it it's appeal to the masses. You need big bucks and big manufacturers for that.
No you don't.They haven't learnt a thing. Last time we had this kind of power plant race that left the smaller teams behind was the 1980's turbo era, without a factory engine and major motor company behind you, you were nowhere.
We lost most of the factory teams when the GFC hit, F1 doesn't need them, so long as the F1 brand is there and hyping up the show, there is more than enough money to splash around for a resurgence of smaller teams with affordable engines. Its easy to forget we had 4 years of dominance from a drinks manufacturer without a factory engine deal prior to the current engines.
Kraken said:
And then F1 becomes just another open wheel series and probably slower than some. It's the money and glamour that makes modern F1 what it is and gives it it's appeal to the masses. You need big bucks and big manufacturers for that.
1 Money and 'glamour 'does make F1 what it is. That is the problem..2 Appealing to the masses is also the problem - it was far better before the average civilian started watching , and assuming that F1 WAS motorsport. Yeah , of course I'm an elitist ..
3 You do not need big manufacturers to make big power engines . There are bunches of blokes in sheds who can get as much bhp from the same size engine as F1's insanely complex power units. Hart was making bigger power F1 engines .30 odd years ago
3 F1 has not always been the fastest series - sports , Can Am , F5000, Indy and even F2 cars have been as quick or quicker than F1 on occasion
coppice said:
1 Money and 'glamour 'does make F1 what it is. That is the problem..
2 Appealing to the masses is also the problem - it was far better before the average civilian started watching , and assuming that F1 WAS motorsport. Yeah , of course I'm an elitist ..
3 You do not need big manufacturers to make big power engines . There are bunches of blokes in sheds who can get as much bhp from the same size engine as F1's insanely complex power units. Hart was making bigger power F1 engines .30 odd years ago
3 F1 has not always been the fastest series - sports , Can Am , F5000, Indy and even F2 cars have been as quick or quicker than F1 on occasion
Plenty of other series around to watch that don't have the money and glamour. They have tiny audiences for a reason.2 Appealing to the masses is also the problem - it was far better before the average civilian started watching , and assuming that F1 WAS motorsport. Yeah , of course I'm an elitist ..
3 You do not need big manufacturers to make big power engines . There are bunches of blokes in sheds who can get as much bhp from the same size engine as F1's insanely complex power units. Hart was making bigger power F1 engines .30 odd years ago
3 F1 has not always been the fastest series - sports , Can Am , F5000, Indy and even F2 cars have been as quick or quicker than F1 on occasion
When did Hart make an engine that put over 1000bhp at the same weight, size, driveability and reliability as a modern F1 unit? There's more to an engine than just pure horsepower.
Outright speed and lap times are not the same thing and, of course, as with the engines ancient history is pretty irrelevant to the modern world.
Current noises coming from LM are that they may delay the introduction of the new regs, whatever they will be. They've already gone well past the deadline the manufacturers gave to have sufficient time to prepare for the changes, and they still haven't agreed what those changes will be.
Kraken said:
Plenty of other series around to watch that don't have the money and glamour. They have tiny audiences for a reason.
When did Hart make an engine that put over 1000bhp at the same weight, size, driveability and reliability as a modern F1 unit? There's more to an engine than just pure horsepower.
Outright speed and lap times are not the same thing and, of course, as with the engines ancient history is pretty irrelevant to the modern world.
I don't want an audience the size F1 now has thanks -big audience means media and manufacturer(as oppose to race car teams ) end up dictating what they cal the brand. If you don't learn from history you repeat its mistakes and , as for Hart , of course its 80s engines weren't as reliable and driveable as today's . But why is that a good thing - I far preferred a few grenading engines than the meaningless charade of a driver being penalised because his engine blew up after 5 races....And as for bhp - yeah a Hart would have struggled to get much over 800 I guess in period, but y'know, you get my drift? When did Hart make an engine that put over 1000bhp at the same weight, size, driveability and reliability as a modern F1 unit? There's more to an engine than just pure horsepower.
Outright speed and lap times are not the same thing and, of course, as with the engines ancient history is pretty irrelevant to the modern world.
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