New engine regs for 2021
Discussion
Otispunkmeyer said:
Doink said:
Ferrari threaten to quit F1 (so whats new) over the engine rules, I'd say off you go then, more money in the pot for the smaller teams, I certainly don't watch F1 because of Ferrari, I watch in the hope of getting good close racing, bit of rubbing and the odd crash, hope LM stand their ground and do what's best for their brand not Ferraris, like Horner said 'here's the rules, here's the entry form, if you don't like it go and do Formula E'
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-11-02...
Was about to come and post this.... I agree, call their bluff. Let them walk. Certainly not the reason I follow the sport. I wonder also, who or how many others would be up for taking their place if Ferrari did flounce. I suspect there are some who see Ferrari's special treatment and think, nah, not gonna bother. But if they were cut to size or disappeared all together?https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-11-02...
Otispunkmeyer said:
Was about to come and post this.... I agree, call their bluff. Let them walk. Certainly not the reason I follow the sport. I wonder also, who or how many others would be up for taking their place if Ferrari did flounce. I suspect there are some who see Ferrari's special treatment and think, nah, not gonna bother. But if they were cut to size or disappeared all together?
If any of the already low number of potentially competitive teams left it would be a major issue.
There's precious little competition at the front of the grid as it is.
Bonefish Blues said:
Otispunkmeyer said:
Doink said:
Ferrari threaten to quit F1 (so whats new) over the engine rules, I'd say off you go then, more money in the pot for the smaller teams, I certainly don't watch F1 because of Ferrari, I watch in the hope of getting good close racing, bit of rubbing and the odd crash, hope LM stand their ground and do what's best for their brand not Ferraris, like Horner said 'here's the rules, here's the entry form, if you don't like it go and do Formula E'
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-11-02...
Was about to come and post this.... I agree, call their bluff. Let them walk. Certainly not the reason I follow the sport. I wonder also, who or how many others would be up for taking their place if Ferrari did flounce. I suspect there are some who see Ferrari's special treatment and think, nah, not gonna bother. But if they were cut to size or disappeared all together?https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-11-02...
C Lee Farquar said:
It will be interesting to see how LM get on negotiating with Marchionne.
He strikes me as a man accustomed to getting his own way.
Marchionne is a corporate business man with his eye on the bottom line.He strikes me as a man accustomed to getting his own way.
Ferrari don't need F1 anymore, the brand is massive on its own and will hit the $1 billion profit mark this year. From a commercial perspective F1 has done its job, it wont affect the brand if they ditched F1 now, but their profits would go up significantly.
If Liberty change the money split to a fairer system, Ferrari F1 are likely to lose $100 million, Marchionne will dump the team when that happens.
Does F1 need Ferrari? Of course not, it survived many well established and supported teams disappearing and could in fact gain from them leaving if the teams get a fairer share and the costs are lowered. The current regime is stopping new teams or manufacturers entering, it has to change or F1 will die.
F1 has been through decades of Ferrari being uncompetitive, before Shuey it was in the doldrums, if they disappeared no one who wants entertaining sport would notice if the racing is good.
They did indeed thegreenhell, which is why they are happy with the current situation and I guess they expected / hoped to get a good 10 years out of the fundamental approach and investment. They won’t want to start again so early in the life of these units,
I suspect even Honda wouldn’t want to start again at this point in their development cycle.
My prediction is that the current PU suppliers will get their way and the whole RB/Aston Martin thing has to limp along for another 5 or more years before a new and more simple PU is introduced.
I suspect even Honda wouldn’t want to start again at this point in their development cycle.
My prediction is that the current PU suppliers will get their way and the whole RB/Aston Martin thing has to limp along for another 5 or more years before a new and more simple PU is introduced.
C Lee Farquar said:
It will be interesting to see how LM get on negotiating with Marchionne.
He strikes me as a man accustomed to getting his own way.
Not to mention a natty line in knitwear; he has the casual pullover-over-the-shoulders look nailed. Mind you, he's going to be negotiating with a man whose moustache makes General Melchett look like a rank amateur.He strikes me as a man accustomed to getting his own way.
Jsf arguing that Ferrari would be more profitable witnout f1.
I'm not so sure. They vet more back from fom than any other. I believe 1/2 their huge budget is covered there. Malbro flaunt the rules and sponsor them via the back door. If you then add in the sales of merhandise directly caused by f1 presence, and the advertising / free coverage they get free by being there, I reckon f1 for Ferrari is near cost neutral.
I'm not so sure. They vet more back from fom than any other. I believe 1/2 their huge budget is covered there. Malbro flaunt the rules and sponsor them via the back door. If you then add in the sales of merhandise directly caused by f1 presence, and the advertising / free coverage they get free by being there, I reckon f1 for Ferrari is near cost neutral.
jsf said:
Marchionne is a corporate business man with his eye on the bottom line.
Ferrari don't need F1 anymore, the brand is massive on its own and will hit the $1 billion profit mark this year. From a commercial perspective F1 has done its job, it wont affect the brand if they ditched F1 now, but their profits would go up significantly.
If Liberty change the money split to a fairer system, Ferrari F1 are likely to lose $100 million, Marchionne will dump the team when that happens.
Does F1 need Ferrari? Of course not, it survived many well established and supported teams disappearing and could in fact gain from them leaving if the teams get a fairer share and the costs are lowered. The current regime is stopping new teams or manufacturers entering, it has to change or F1 will die.
F1 has been through decades of Ferrari being uncompetitive, before Shuey it was in the doldrums, if they disappeared no one who wants entertaining sport would notice if the racing is good.
I’ve said before that when I visit my local Ferrari dealer, it isn’t exactly plastered with F1 kit or ads. As you say, they can manage without F1, especially in markets where the cars are bought totally for image purposes. But I’d imagine the markets would deep 6 the share price should they announce a withdrawal from F1.Ferrari don't need F1 anymore, the brand is massive on its own and will hit the $1 billion profit mark this year. From a commercial perspective F1 has done its job, it wont affect the brand if they ditched F1 now, but their profits would go up significantly.
If Liberty change the money split to a fairer system, Ferrari F1 are likely to lose $100 million, Marchionne will dump the team when that happens.
Does F1 need Ferrari? Of course not, it survived many well established and supported teams disappearing and could in fact gain from them leaving if the teams get a fairer share and the costs are lowered. The current regime is stopping new teams or manufacturers entering, it has to change or F1 will die.
F1 has been through decades of Ferrari being uncompetitive, before Shuey it was in the doldrums, if they disappeared no one who wants entertaining sport would notice if the racing is good.
fuelracer496 said:
Doink said:
And is woefully under powered for a 9.3 litre ha ha, it never ceases to amaze me how little the Americans know about engine design, give 9.3 litres to a European or Japanese designer and you'll get 10000hp
I managed to cobble this together, it's quite American in origin, and should make an honest 3200 horsepower and around 2500lbs/ft, from little over 400 cubic inches, with a cam in block, pushrods, OEM valvetrain geometry and a standard helix GMC based 6/71 blower and old-school mechanical fuel injection. I think that's alright for an engine design from the mid 1960's.
Can't beat the small of Nitro in the morning
Hungrymc said:
They did indeed thegreenhell, which is why they are happy with the current situation and I guess they expected / hoped to get a good 10 years out of the fundamental approach and investment. They won’t want to start again so early in the life of these units,
I suspect even Honda wouldn’t want to start again at this point in their development cycle.
My prediction is that the current PU suppliers will get their way and the whole RB/Aston Martin thing has to limp along for another 5 or more years before a new and more simple PU is introduced.
Won’t they have got 10 years out of the design by 2020?? I suspect even Honda wouldn’t want to start again at this point in their development cycle.
My prediction is that the current PU suppliers will get their way and the whole RB/Aston Martin thing has to limp along for another 5 or more years before a new and more simple PU is introduced.
The Moose said:
Hungrymc said:
They did indeed thegreenhell, which is why they are happy with the current situation and I guess they expected / hoped to get a good 10 years out of the fundamental approach and investment. They won’t want to start again so early in the life of these units,
I suspect even Honda wouldn’t want to start again at this point in their development cycle.
My prediction is that the current PU suppliers will get their way and the whole RB/Aston Martin thing has to limp along for another 5 or more years before a new and more simple PU is introduced.
Won’t they have got 10 years out of the design by 2020?? I suspect even Honda wouldn’t want to start again at this point in their development cycle.
My prediction is that the current PU suppliers will get their way and the whole RB/Aston Martin thing has to limp along for another 5 or more years before a new and more simple PU is introduced.
But it looks like a cost cap could be coming much sooner.
https://nesn.com/2017/11/leaked-details-reveal-f1s...
I bet Force India are very excited given their current thrashing of comparative fat cats like Williams and McLaren.
IMHO this is long overdue, let’s watch genuine racing on a level playing field rather than see $millions thrown at any minor problem.
https://nesn.com/2017/11/leaked-details-reveal-f1s...
I bet Force India are very excited given their current thrashing of comparative fat cats like Williams and McLaren.
IMHO this is long overdue, let’s watch genuine racing on a level playing field rather than see $millions thrown at any minor problem.
rdjohn said:
But it looks like a cost cap could be coming much sooner.
https://nesn.com/2017/11/leaked-details-reveal-f1s...
Ah, the elephant in the room has been identified. I'm almost certain that the proposed cost cap regulations are the reason for the latest tantrums by the Ferrari big man, rather than the change in engine regs.https://nesn.com/2017/11/leaked-details-reveal-f1s...
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