Italy Loses FTA F1 Coverage
Discussion
https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/133973/italy-fre....
This will IMO be a killer blow to F1. Italy has the largest fan-base for F1 in the whole of Europe and probably has more F1 followers per-head of population than any other country in the world.
This will IMO be a killer blow to F1. Italy has the largest fan-base for F1 in the whole of Europe and probably has more F1 followers per-head of population than any other country in the world.
CooperS said:
Is that not the same as us in the UK.
Yes and no...CooperS said:
I think it's a terrible move on the part of F1. But if they want to be greedy and take in SKY money now more fool them.
Sky's UK exclusive deal was a parting shot from Bernie which he probably knew was financial short-termism but long term bad for the sport. We can speculate on his motives (IMO he was thinking only of inflating the value of Delta Topco in preparation for its imminent sale by CVC to persons unkown at that point, which ultimately was his job. Irony then that a company with its own distribution channels - Liberty Global - ends up buying a sport that has signed exclusive deals with rival distribution channels, but hey-ho.....)This is different - this is a failure by new owners Liberty and Italian national TV station RAI to agree to a deal for a partial coverage package as Sky Italia's arrangements are not exclusive the way Sky UK's is from 2019. Liberty have cut their noses off to spite their face as they wanted more cash for the highlights deal.
It might be that this is the way they think they will leverage the streaming service they keep touting but have yet to deliver on.
From a personal point of view I am pissed off as I have access to Italian terrestrial channels in the UK courtesy of my entitlement to a TiVuSat card. RAI coverage was good for filling in some of the blanks in CH4 coverage as they didn't show all the same races live. I'm currently investigating TNTSAT/Fransat as only desperation will make me watch RTL (and Sky will never knowingly receive a penny from me).
Edited by r11co on Saturday 20th January 11:38
r11co said:
Sky's UK deal was a 'parting shot' from Bernie which he probably knew was financial short-termism but long term bad for the sport. We can speculate on his motives.
It was to stop BT getting the rights. BT had F1 at the very top of their 'want' list, and were prepared to get it at any cost. Bernie realised that 750000 Sky viewers was better than 10000 BT viewers, and so did the new deal way before the current one is due to expire.As part of the contract, Sky have to provide a FTA package of highlights of all races, and FTA live coverage of the British Grand Prix. However, there is no clear definition of what is meant by FTA, as Sky could put the highlights on Pick TV (which they own) which is available on Sky, Virgin Media, Freeview and Freesat but not, as far as I can see, BT. There is no requirement for a traditional terrestrial channel to get the highlights, but that’s not to say it won’t happen.
It sucks, I know, but that’s the position we are in. I just hope that those with the Sky Legacy HD pack are still able to receive the F1 channel when the new contract comes in to effect next year.
2 sMoKiN bArReLs said:
A lot of people in Italy get free to air Austrian or RTL which show all the races. (not just the 9 that they are losing)
In the northern regions perhaps, but the vast majority don't.Anyway, stop press - I heard mutterings today that Mediaset (Silvio Berlusconi's TV company) are in negotiations to take over the FTA rights package. His channels are the Italian equivalent of ITV/Ch4/Ch5 to the national RAI/BBC licence-fee funded channels so there's hope yet.
Gaz. said:
If their fan base is so incredible, why has Monza struggled to achieve 50% capacity for at least the last six seasons?
For the same reason they probably won't have Sky - too expensive for themOh - not forgetting Ferrari not dominating
Edited by MartG on Saturday 20th January 19:32
Teppic said:
It was to stop BT getting the rights. BT had F1 at the very top of their 'want' list, and were prepared to get it at any cost. Bernie realised that 750000 Sky viewers was better than 10000 BT viewers, and so did the new deal way before the current one is due to expire.
But surely if the money for the rights is agreed up-front then it doesn't matter how many viewers the rights-holder can attract. 
r11co said:
Teppic said:
It was to stop BT getting the rights. BT had F1 at the very top of their 'want' list, and were prepared to get it at any cost. Bernie realised that 750000 Sky viewers was better than 10000 BT viewers, and so did the new deal way before the current one is due to expire.
But surely if the money for the rights is agreed up-front then it doesn't matter how many viewers the rights-holder can attract. I guess 750,000 instead of 10,000 equals 740,000 less moaners?
Teppic said:
r11co said:
Sky's UK deal was a 'parting shot' from Bernie which he probably knew was financial short-termism but long term bad for the sport. We can speculate on his motives.
It was to stop BT getting the rights. BT had F1 at the very top of their 'want' list, and were prepared to get it at any cost. Bernie realised that 750000 Sky viewers was better than 10000 BT viewers, and so did the new deal way before the current one is due to expire.As part of the contract, Sky have to provide a FTA package of highlights of all races, and FTA live coverage of the British Grand Prix. However, there is no clear definition of what is meant by FTA, as Sky could put the highlights on Pick TV (which they own) which is available on Sky, Virgin Media, Freeview and Freesat but not, as far as I can see, BT. There is no requirement for a traditional terrestrial channel to get the highlights, but that’s not to say it won’t happen.
It sucks, I know, but that’s the position we are in. I just hope that those with the Sky Legacy HD pack are still able to receive the F1 channel when the new contract comes in to effect next year.
And Sky's Pick channel is right there in my BT epg.
Didn't BT and Sky recently announce a reciprocal deal whereby they'd make each other's content available on their own platforms (presumably for an extra fee)? I think this was due to come into effect next year, but I don't know if it includes all content or just specific channels or sports.
thegreenhell said:
Didn't BT and Sky recently announce a reciprocal deal whereby they'd make each other's content available on their own platforms (presumably for an extra fee)? I think this was due to come into effect next year, but I don't know if it includes all content or just specific channels or sports.
Yep... we've buried the hatched with Sky... Under the deal, Sky will gain access to BT Sport content, including Premier League, Champions League and Europa League football, which it can offer through a single Sky subscription.
Meanwhile BT set-top boxes will make Sky's Now TV service - which includes Sky Atlantic, Sky One, Sky Living, Sky Sports and Sky Cinema - available to its customers. BT will sell Now TV on Sky's behalf
BT gets more out of the deal as Sky has more content but they now share the common enemy of Prime and Netflix. It's looking like Amazon and possibly Netflix like might bid for the upcoming football rights. Collaborating seems to be the way forward. Re fees, I don't know and obviously if I did I couldn't say.
r11co said:
I really don't think it will.Marketing and TV has changed enormously and the need for FTA is simply not as important as it once was.
From a marketing perspective, absolute numbers are not as important as the type of people watching. If you have say, 10 million people watching on FTA TV, that's all very well but if you are only targeting 10% of that audience then it's somewhat pointless. The sort of brands that are being attracted to F1 are those that target typical users of subscription TV rather than mass-market brands.
Subscription TV enables advertisers and sponsors to more accurately target their market so if anything, it becomes a more attractive proposition.
Football has been broadcast on restrictive viewing platforms for years (including IIRC in Italy) and you can't say it's done the sport any harm.
The only downside is that there are quite a few people who for whatever reason choose not to subscribe to a service and rely only on FTA. So for F1 fans of this ilk, it is unfortunate.
HighwayStar said:
Yep... we've buried the hatched with Sky...
Under the deal, Sky will gain access to BT Sport content, including Premier League, Champions League and Europa League football, which it can offer through a single Sky subscription.
Meanwhile BT set-top boxes will make Sky's Now TV service - which includes Sky Atlantic, Sky One, Sky Living, Sky Sports and Sky Cinema - available to its customers. BT will sell Now TV on Sky's behalf
BT gets more out of the deal as Sky has more content but they now share the common enemy of Prime and Netflix. It's looking like Amazon and possibly Netflix like might bid for the upcoming football rights. Collaborating seems to be the way forward. Re fees, I don't know and obviously if I did I couldn't say.
This has only been done because of the threat from Amazon and Facebook on bidding for live sports!Under the deal, Sky will gain access to BT Sport content, including Premier League, Champions League and Europa League football, which it can offer through a single Sky subscription.
Meanwhile BT set-top boxes will make Sky's Now TV service - which includes Sky Atlantic, Sky One, Sky Living, Sky Sports and Sky Cinema - available to its customers. BT will sell Now TV on Sky's behalf
BT gets more out of the deal as Sky has more content but they now share the common enemy of Prime and Netflix. It's looking like Amazon and possibly Netflix like might bid for the upcoming football rights. Collaborating seems to be the way forward. Re fees, I don't know and obviously if I did I couldn't say.
A205GTI said:
HighwayStar said:
Yep... we've buried the hatched with Sky...
Under the deal, Sky will gain access to BT Sport content, including Premier League, Champions League and Europa League football, which it can offer through a single Sky subscription.
Meanwhile BT set-top boxes will make Sky's Now TV service - which includes Sky Atlantic, Sky One, Sky Living, Sky Sports and Sky Cinema - available to its customers. BT will sell Now TV on Sky's behalf
BT gets more out of the deal as Sky has more content but they now share the common enemy of Prime and Netflix. It's looking like Amazon and possibly Netflix like might bid for the upcoming football rights. Collaborating seems to be the way forward. Re fees, I don't know and obviously if I did I couldn't say.
This has only been done because of the threat from Amazon and Facebook on bidding for live sports!Under the deal, Sky will gain access to BT Sport content, including Premier League, Champions League and Europa League football, which it can offer through a single Sky subscription.
Meanwhile BT set-top boxes will make Sky's Now TV service - which includes Sky Atlantic, Sky One, Sky Living, Sky Sports and Sky Cinema - available to its customers. BT will sell Now TV on Sky's behalf
BT gets more out of the deal as Sky has more content but they now share the common enemy of Prime and Netflix. It's looking like Amazon and possibly Netflix like might bid for the upcoming football rights. Collaborating seems to be the way forward. Re fees, I don't know and obviously if I did I couldn't say.
StevieBee said:
Football has been broadcast on restrictive viewing platforms for years (including IIRC in Italy) and you can't say it's done the sport any harm.
The comparison with other sports, especially football, is a massive red herring as football has a much bigger target audience and considerably more of a product to offer.Subsciption F1 is exceptionally poor value by comparison just by numbers (20 or so races compared to literally tens of thousands of matches for the same money), and that is before you consider the bore-factor. This is why Liberty are hurrying to increase the number of races on the calendar and apply a load of sticking-plaster fixes to the spectacle because of the already impending switch to subsciption only that was rolling into view before they took over.
Bernie knew the value of FTA presence for F1 because it suited the product. Going back to the whole Sky exclusive deal I am still of the opinion that he knew it was a short-term value boost for CVC at the expense of the next owners (scorched earth).
r11co said:
StevieBee said:
Football has been broadcast on restrictive viewing platforms for years (including IIRC in Italy) and you can't say it's done the sport any harm.
The comparison with other sports, especially football, is a massive red herring as football has a much bigger target audience and considerably more of a product to offer.Subsciption F1 is exceptionally poor value by comparison just by numbers (20 or so races compared to literally tens of thousands of matches for the same money), and that is before you consider the bore-factor. This is why Liberty are hurrying to increase the number of races on the calendar and apply a load of sticking-plaster fixes to the spectacle because of the already impending switch to subsciption only that was rolling into view before they took over.
Bernie knew the value of FTA presence for F1 because it suited the product. Going back to the whole Sky exclusive deal I am still of the opinion that he knew it was a short-term value boost for CVC at the expense of the next owners (scorched earth).
As for value, I think this is really a subjective thing. If you are an occasional viewer then of course, a subscription doesn't really stack up. For me, it's the only sport I enjoy watching and am happy to pay to get the premium content (or - as it seems 'content') because I get great enjoyment from it.
It's also worth remembering that the BBC won the exclusive rights with the lowest bid. IIRC that was a 10 year deal that the BBC chose to withdraw from which lead to the Sky deal. Had they not done that, we'd still have FTA F1 on the BBC.
Personally, given the commercial nature of F1, I'm surprised that it's one of the last sports to come off FTA.
StevieBee said:
I think it does hold some comparison. Football fans will only generally watch games involving or affecting their teams. Admittedly the 'cost-per-view' is less compared to F1 but SkyF1 provides more F1 programming content than just the races. Their Legends of F1 series is excellent!
As for value, I think this is really a subjective thing. If you are an occasional viewer then of course, a subscription doesn't really stack up. For me, it's the only sport I enjoy watching and am happy to pay to get the premium content (or - as it seems 'content') because I get great enjoyment from it.
It's also worth remembering that the BBC won the exclusive rights with the lowest bid. IIRC that was a 10 year deal that the BBC chose to withdraw from which lead to the Sky deal. Had they not done that, we'd still have FTA F1 on the BBC.
Personally, given the commercial nature of F1, I'm surprised that it's one of the last sports to come off FTA.
With all due respect you are sounding like a shill. The fact that Sky provides additional F1 programming content is through necessity as otherwise about 95% of the airtime of their dedicated channel would be spent broadcasting a still logo. The additional content is filler because there is so little actual F1 content in comparison to football which has the option to show matches from other leagues or delayed replays of other matches in the same league so that fans can see the action of rival teams.As for value, I think this is really a subjective thing. If you are an occasional viewer then of course, a subscription doesn't really stack up. For me, it's the only sport I enjoy watching and am happy to pay to get the premium content (or - as it seems 'content') because I get great enjoyment from it.
It's also worth remembering that the BBC won the exclusive rights with the lowest bid. IIRC that was a 10 year deal that the BBC chose to withdraw from which lead to the Sky deal. Had they not done that, we'd still have FTA F1 on the BBC.
Personally, given the commercial nature of F1, I'm surprised that it's one of the last sports to come off FTA.
"It's also worth remembering that the BBC won the exclusive rights with the lowest bid." Exactly - that was because when Bernie was still in charge and not just fattening the cow for selling on he knew the value of eyes on the sport. Getting people loyal to football usually involves hooking them in at a young age and that is generally done through attendance at live matches and then the loyal youngster grows up and is willing to pay. F1 doesn't get that sort of initial exposure so the PPV exclusivity will only attract a reduced amount of existing fans like yourself who with the inevitability of time will dwindle in number.
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