Triple crown. Is the F1 part a Monaco win or a WDC?

[CanAm]

Graham Hill is the only holder so far, so no. And as all three events are very close on the calendar, with Indy and Le Mans having longer qualifying sessions, it's very unlikely. Plus F1drivers not being allowed to race elsewhere within 24 hours (if this is still a current rule).

[56Lotus]

Kraken said:

56Lotus said:

Pop over to Autosport TNF where this is also being discussed by those who first came up with the term and it is quite clearly WDC, Le Mans and Indy 500.

Monaco was never part of it

HTH

Jon

Makes absolutely no sense to be that combination. When Graham Hill did it was clear that it was for the three races.

Why does it make no sense? Why was it clear that GH did it for the three races? Did you actually read the TNF thread?

Jon

[coppice]

I contributed to the TNF thread and like nearly everybody else who was ancient enough to be around at the time Graham Hill was racing , I had always believed that the status derived from the world championship, and not Monaco alone .

The far more interesting point is that after a long period when many F1 fans knew virtually nothing , and cared even less , about other motor sport disciplines , there now seems to be an awareness that there is more to racing life than the next GP .

[thegreenhell]

The concept of the Triple Crown of Motorsport is entirely unofficial, so it can be whatever you want it to be. There is no right or wrong answer.

[Kraken]

56Lotus said:

Why does it make no sense? Why was it clear that GH did it for the three races? Did you actually read the TNF thread?

Jon

Because in no other sport where there are various names and kudos attached to similar feats does one part feature a championship win alongside individual events. Damon Hill says it's for the three events and that's good enough for me.

I wouldn't go to an Autosport forum if you paid me. Been there, done that. Think this place is bad for trolls and people with massive egos...

[Halmyre]

Kraken said:

56Lotus said:

Why does it make no sense? Why was it clear that GH did it for the three races? Did you actually read the TNF thread?

Jon

Because in no other sport where there are various names and kudos attached to similar feats does one part feature a championship win alongside individual events. Damon Hill says it's for the three events and that's good enough for me.

I wouldn't go to an Autosport forum if you paid me. Been there, done that. Think this place is bad for trolls and people with massive egos...

TNF isn't too bad. Racing Comments must be what you're thinking of. Sadly, the Senna/Schumacher fan-handbaggery is starting to creep into TNF.

[ArnageWRC]

coppice said:

The far more interesting point is that after a long period when many F1 fans knew virtually nothing , and cared even less , about other motor sport disciplines, there now seems to be an awareness that there is more to racing life than the next GP.

Good point - and hopefully that extends to the mainstream media.....F1 is not the be all and end all of motorsport.

I want to see more drivers in all disciplines trying out other series - it adds something seeing drivers out of their comfort zone.

[thegreenhell]

ArnageWRC said:

coppice said:

The far more interesting point is that after a long period when many F1 fans knew virtually nothing , and cared even less , about other motor sport disciplines, there now seems to be an awareness that there is more to racing life than the next GP.

Good point - and hopefully that extends to the mainstream media.....F1 is not the be all and end all of motorsport.

I want to see more drivers in all disciplines trying out other series - it adds something seeing drivers out of their comfort zone.

This is in no small part due to the many years of Bernie and Max running the show, promoting F1 to the exclusion of all other forms of the sport, and even deliberately planning calendar clashes between F1 and other major races to prevent F1 drivers from wandering too far.

[coppice]

Absolutely- and that , in turn stemmed from a Faustian pact with the media and manufacturers to leverage every penny out of the people who ultimately pay for this gazillion quid circus- thee and me .

[SmoothCriminal]

I don't understand how it can be.

A seasons worth to be F1 WDC

But only le mans race
And Indy 500.

Surely it must be Monaco as the others are only one race.

[Halmyre]

SmoothCriminal said:

I don't understand how it can be.

A seasons worth to be F1 WDC

But only le mans race
And Indy 500.

Surely it must be Monaco as the others are only one race.

But why Monaco? Only the British and Italian Grands Prix have been held continuously since 1950, and the Italian GP was first held in 1921, eight years before Monaco.

[ukaskew]

coppice said:

until Alonso -uniquely - realised that motor sport was a broader church than Formula

Er, Hulk won Le Mans. The opportunities simply aren't there like they used to be unless you really push hard for it and presumably get a watertight contract/insurance policy, and even then there is a good chance you're going to have to miss an F1 race to do it.

Considering how few F1 drivers have a basically guaranteed F1 seat year on year I don't blame them for not pushing their luck by trying to get involved with other stuff.

[coppice]

Yes - and that was welcome news. But I think it's right to say that his win generated nothing like the coverage that Alonso did and that Ecclestone was mightily pissed off that one of his crew was freelancing elsewhere . And you only had to read some of the more rabid F1 fans' witterings that drivers racing at Indy or Le Mans 'diluted the brand' and similar tosh .

I grew up in the era when the top echelon of drivers raced anything - F1, F2, Can Am, Indy , Sports Prototypes etc and nobody raised an eyebrow that Stewart was racing a Can Am Lola , Hill was racing F2 at Thruxton, Gurney at Le Mans etc .

God knows there was lots wrong with some facets of the sport back then - the body count was dreadful - but its diversity and accessibility was a vast improvement on today's spec formulae (which is pretty close to what F1 has become) and paddocks closed off to civilians like me .


On the point re it being Monaco as it's a single race like the others , the logic is impeccable but that take on the triple crown simply wasn't there in period . Yes , Indy and Le Mans were single races but their impact , especially Le Mans , was just huge - far greater than now with much more mainstream press coverage. And mags like Motor and Autocar would devote several pages to Le Mans - and that was just for the test weekend ...

Edited by coppice on Friday 22 June 07:54

[Mellow Yellow]

ukaskew said:

Er, Hulk won Le Mans. The opportunities simply aren't there like they used to be unless you really push hard for it and presumably get a watertight contract/insurance policy, and even then there is a good chance you're going to have to miss an F1 race to do it.

Considering how few F1 drivers have a basically guaranteed F1 seat year on year I don't blame them for not pushing their luck by trying to get involved with other stuff.

Hartley won Le Mans too.

[The Moose]

Mellow Yellow said:

ukaskew said:

Er, Hulk won Le Mans. The opportunities simply aren't there like they used to be unless you really push hard for it and presumably get a watertight contract/insurance policy, and even then there is a good chance you're going to have to miss an F1 race to do it.

Considering how few F1 drivers have a basically guaranteed F1 seat year on year I don't blame them for not pushing their luck by trying to get involved with other stuff.

Hartley won Le Mans too.

He’s unlikely to win Monaco any time soon!

Edited by The Moose on Friday 22 June 14:51

[entropy]

coppice said:

I grew up in the era when the top echelon of drivers raced anything - F1, F2, Can Am, Indy , Sports Prototypes etc and nobody raised an eyebrow that Stewart was racing a Can Am Lola , Hill was racing F2 at Thruxton, Gurney at Le Mans etc .

God knows there was lots wrong with some facets of the sport back then - the body count was dreadful - but its diversity and accessibility was a vast improvement on today's spec formulae (which is pretty close to what F1 has become) and paddocks closed off to civilians like me .

Prize money wasn't as great for F1 championship races. That's why there used to be non-championship F1 races because the promoters offer better prize money and the same goes for racing in America and around the world. I came across an interview with someone that JYS only did Indy because of the money even though JYS wasn't keen oval racing.

Also there was far fewer F1 races so drivers needed to earn extra money in different categories. It's like endurance racers today doing IMSA, WEC, Blancpain, Formula E.

[99dndd]

Mellow Yellow said:

Hartley won Le Mans too.

He wasn't an F1 driver when he won, which was kind of the point.

I've always thought of the triple crown being Monaco, Indy and Le Mans. It'll be fun seeing Alonso going for it at Indy next year.

[StevieBee]

According to ACO in the Le Mans programme, the triple crown, whilst an informal 'thing' is regarding within the industry as the F1 WDC, Le Mans and the Indy 500.

I'd support this hypothesis as Monaco is prone to the odd 'lucky' win. Indy is special on account of its history as a single event, as is Le Mans.

I think a separate informal list could be to consider 'blue-ribbon' races. Monaco, Le Mans and Indy would certainly be included on this list. But what others?

Bathurst?
Pikes Peak?
Macau?

[KevinCamaroSS]

99dndd said:

He wasn't an F1 driver when he won, which was kind of the point.

Cannot agree with that, if Alonso goes to Indycar next year and wins the 500, he will have achieved the triple crown.

[coppice]

99dndd said:

He wasn't an F1 driver when he won, which was kind of the point.

I've always thought of the triple crown being Monaco, Indy and Le Mans. It'll be fun seeing Alonso going for it at Indy next year.

It isn't the point at all and never has been . If nothing else , and nothing personal at all , but your comment is good illustration of how absurdly F1 centric motor sport has now become . Agree about Alonso .