F1 2021 concept car image leaked

[aelord]

Wheel shrouds, great big halos, driver sunk ever deeper out of sight...why don't they admit the direction is to closed wheels and cockpits and be done?

[skinny]

Looks massive

[DoubleD]

Evangelion said:

Still got bloody stupid wings on, therefore of no interest to me whatsoever.

So you think that F1 should go back to 60s technology? Maybe they should all be front engined as well?

[Fire99]

DoubleD said:

Evangelion said:

Still got bloody stupid wings on, therefore of no interest to me whatsoever.

So you think that F1 should go back to 60s technology? Maybe they should all be front engined as well?

The man is entitled to his opinion..

I have to say from a personal flavour, the late 80's was the 'sweet spot' for complexity of aero..

[ZX10R NIN]

I have to say they look amazing.

[abzmike]

LaurasOtherHalf said:

It’s hardly a leak when all 3 concepts are on f1’s own website!

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.2021-a-...

Apparently it was all going to announced Friday in Singapore, but Brawn was making a presentation to a bunch of engineering students the day before, showed the concepts and they all took their phones out and snapped them. He realised he’d been rumbled.

[Oilchange]

[quote=Doink
Rubbish, the teams will race what they're told to race as defined by the rules, also remember its only Pirelli now that aren't adverse to making 13" tyres as they're making them currently, no other manufacturer wants to get involved with 13" tyres, they're a thing of the past, we need to move with the times
[/quote]

It's what I think. OK?

It might not happen of course but my thoughts aren't rubbish, thanks.

[blueST]

What I find a bit odd, is that where the concepts are rendered onto a track, it seems to be US style oval. That must have been a deliberate choice and I wonder whether we should read anything into that.

[blueST]

Gaz. said:

Neutrality perhaps?

Common set of rules with Indycar so that the Indy 500 can be a World Championship Event again! I hope.

[RacerMike]

Never understand this. They did a similar thing for the current cars....the fact is, the car design student at Uni they employ to do these things knows absolutely nothing about aerodynamics, so the concept images bear about as much relation to the cars we’ll see in 2021 as a banana with wheels on does! Ultimately, they’re going to look exactly like they do now, but with slightly different wing profiles.

The 18” wheel thing is a bit of a moot point. The only actual reason for the shift is so the tyre manufactures can hang some degree of marketing off it. They don’t like the fact that they can’t try and claim their latest 18-19” tyre is basically exactly like an F1 tyre, as the general public rightly point out that F1 wheels are 13” so can’t possobly be the same. The claim that ‘it allows them to transfer technology’ is exactly that: a claim. The reality is, there’s basically nothing they’ll learn. Road tyres have completely different requirements, and almost all of the design and development work is done using subjective assessment and old rules of thumb.

[Evangelion]

geeks said:

Evangelion said:

If track limits were enforced the way i think they should be, then they wouldn't be allowed to hit the kerbs.

Not true at all I am afraid, kerbs are part of the track!

Which would be fine, but these days cars frequently leave the circuit entirely without penalty!



(I don't care what anybody says, I still think the circuit should be the tarmac part - full stop.)

[Kraken]

So why bother having kerbs at all then? Even in the UK where the MSA run events have far stricter track limits than FIA events the kerbs are still used as they are part of the track.

The problem with F1 and a lot of other FIA motorsport is that they try to bring in "gaining an advantage" into it. Drivers don't go wide consistently unless there is an advantage.

On the main subject Liberty can win really can they? People moan that there is no info about 2021 around so they release some and people moan and want to go back 50 years instead. They should just get on with it. F1 works best when there is a dictator rather than a committee.

[Evangelion]

Kraken said:

... F1 works best when there is a dictator rather than a committee.

As do a lot of things, it's just that we can never agree on who's going to be the dictator!

[DoubleD]

RacerMike said:

Never understand this. They did a similar thing for the current cars....the fact is, the car design student at Uni they employ to do these things knows absolutely nothing about aerodynamics, so the concept images bear about as much relation to the cars we’ll see in 2021 as a banana with wheels on does! Ultimately, they’re going to look exactly like they do now, but with slightly different wing profiles.

The 18” wheel thing is a bit of a moot point. The only actual reason for the shift is so the tyre manufactures can hang some degree of marketing off it. They don’t like the fact that they can’t try and claim their latest 18-19” tyre is basically exactly like an F1 tyre, as the general public rightly point out that F1 wheels are 13” so can’t possobly be the same. The claim that ‘it allows them to transfer technology’ is exactly that: a claim. The reality is, there’s basically nothing they’ll learn. Road tyres have completely different requirements, and almost all of the design and development work is done using subjective assessment and old rules of thumb.

Well yeah obviously. But where is the benefit for the brand if they cant link it to their actual products?

[RacerMike]

DoubleD said:

Well yeah obviously. But where is the benefit for the brand if they cant link it to their actual products?

Do people really buy tyres because of F1 though? Those who would be swayed by such shallow marketing, would likely stick a set of Runways or GiTi’s on when they found out the Pirelli was 500% more expensive, and those who wouldn’t, tend to be people who are informed and as such buy tyres based on their actual performance, and as such aren’t going to buy the connection.

The real money in tyres is in the approved OEM ones which is why manufacturers fight over getting fitted as standard to cars.

[kambites]

RacerMike said:

Do people really buy tyres because of F1 though? Those who would be swayed by such shallow marketing, would likely stick a set of Runways or GiTi’s on when they found out the Pirelli was 500% more expensive...

I'm not convinced there's any correlation between succeptability to advertising and wealth/willingness to spend. They wouldn't spend millions on making F1 tyres if they didn't think it was going to allow them to sell more of their road-car tyres.

[ploz]

Fire99 said:

The man is entitled to his opinion..

I have to say from a personal flavour, the late 80's was the 'sweet spot' for complexity of aero..

I don't think we get rid of the aerodynamics totally, but ground effect is less susceptible to turbulence than wings - so a shift of the balance of the aerodynamic design from the body (and wings) to the floor could result in closer racing and cleaner looking cars - a la 80s!

[havoc]

ploz said:

I don't think we get rid of the aerodynamics totally, but ground effect is less susceptible to turbulence than wings - so a shift of the balance of the aerodynamic design from the body (and wings) to the floor could result in closer racing and cleaner looking cars - a la 80s!

The risk is that ground effect is far more susceptible to kerbs - take a kerb too aggressively, dump half of your G-E downforce, and all of a sudden you're rather quickly taking a visit to the wrong part of the corner...probably backwards (as you'd expect the front of the car to rely more on wings and the rear more on G-E).


I'm not sure what the answer is, but a limit on max downforce (at preset speeds) might be the best solution:-
- removes the turbulence issue
- increases the involvement of driver skill - with the massive G-E cars of the early-90s I get the impression it was about balls as much as feel/skill.
- (hopefully) makes the cars cleaner-looking and more attractive

[Evangelion]

A flat bottomed car with no wings would sort out the men from the boys.

The only advantage to having downforce is when no-one else has. Once everyone has it, they're all equal again, except the cars are just too fast and no-one can overtake each other.

[Nampahc Niloc]

kambites said:

RacerMike said:

Do people really buy tyres because of F1 though? Those who would be swayed by such shallow marketing, would likely stick a set of Runways or GiTi’s on when they found out the Pirelli was 500% more expensive...

I'm not convinced there's any correlation between succeptability to advertising and wealth/willingness to spend. They wouldn't spend millions on making F1 tyres if they didn't think it was going to allow them to sell more of their road-car tyres.

I expect it’s more about brand recognition. That’s the most important aspect of advertising. Actually providing any proof of quality is way down the list.