Leclerc, Vettel & Ferrari 2019
Discussion
HustleRussell said:
TobyTR said:
Sa Calobra said:
It shows how little faith they have in the other new/current drivers.
That's depressing for me. There is no one that is a real talent. Just rich kids.
That's peak PistonHeads guff. That's depressing for me. There is no one that is a real talent. Just rich kids.
OFORBES said:
You raise an interesting point
Not really. People love to bash the sport but these criticisms are badly misplaced in the context of the current grid. Pretty much all the drivers bring sponsorship in some form, that doesn’t detract from the fact that the depth of talent throughout the grid is about the greatest it’s ever been. TobyTR said:
Sa Calobra said:
It shows how little faith they have in the other new/current drivers.
That's depressing for me. There is no one that is a real talent. Just rich kids.
No real talent? Leclerc won GP3 and F2 in his rookie seasons - did you not watch any of those races or him in the Sauber this year?That's depressing for me. There is no one that is a real talent. Just rich kids.
That's peak PistonHeads guff. Tell the Ferrari top-bods that Leclerc has no real talent...
It's an interesting discussion.
FWIW, with Russell, Norris & Albon joining the grid and Gasly and LeClerc moving to top teams, I believe we have a good spread of talent.
Now that Sirotkin has gone, it's only really Stroll who you look at and think he's obviously paying his way.
There's no one in the lower series' who I would say has blatantly missed out due to lack of funds.
Sa Calobra said:
There is no one that is a real talent. Just rich kids.
Muzzer79 said:
Does a rich kid beating other rich kids in GP3 and F2 make him talented?
So much bitterness! Since when are talent and wealth mutually exclusive? In my opinion they are often positively linked, especially in the context of motor racing where having the money gets you more seat time into more races in more advanced series, earlier.
People love to bash Stroll because he is perceived to have bought his F1 opportunity but he won F3 Euro with Prema just as Mick Schumacher has just done, as Esteban Ocon did, as Lando Norris did...
There is a clear path of ascension to F1, clearer than ever before- nobody who reaches F1 has done so just by paying their way. You have to become one of the best racing drivers in the world.
Thats true, you cant just rock up with billions and get a seat, you have to have amounted a certain number of points etc to have a super license so everyone has to have some form of talent...
It's just interesting sat here trying to think of a handful of drivers who have got to F1 without a lot of money, like the old days
It's just interesting sat here trying to think of a handful of drivers who have got to F1 without a lot of money, like the old days
I believe the three Frenchmen are from humble beginnings, especially Ocon... but you have to be aware that any kid who gets to sit in a kart probably isn't living on the breadline. Motorsport must have the highest cost of entry point of any sport bar a few, equestrian?
All the drivers are freaks. What kind of kid can convince their parents to spend that kind of money on karting when they've not long since stopped wetting the bed? and what parent is going to risk their home and livelihood on the million to one chance it'll ever come to anything, unless the parent is involved with motor racing already, or is at least very comfortable financially.
All the drivers are freaks. What kind of kid can convince their parents to spend that kind of money on karting when they've not long since stopped wetting the bed? and what parent is going to risk their home and livelihood on the million to one chance it'll ever come to anything, unless the parent is involved with motor racing already, or is at least very comfortable financially.
OFORBES said:
trying to think of a handful of drivers who have got to F1 without a lot of money, like the old days
The idea that it was easier to get into F1 without a lot of money in 'the old days' is a myth. The fact is directly contrary to the point you are making, it was absolutely possible from the birth of Grand Prix racing up until it's mass commercialisation, for a wealthy person to literally buy a car or team and enter races.
Edited by HustleRussell on Tuesday 4th December 10:57
HustleRussell said:
I believe the three Frenchmen are from humble beginnings, especially Ocon... but you have to be aware that any kid who gets to sit in a kart probably isn't living on the breadline. Motorsport must have the highest cost of entry point of any sport bar a few, equestrian?
All the drivers are freaks. What kind of kid can convince their parents to spend that kind of money on karting when they've not long since stopped wetting the bed? and what parent is going to risk their home and livelihood on the million to one chance it'll ever come to anything, unless the parent is involved with motor racing already, or is at least very comfortable financially.
In Ocon’s interview on beyond the grid, he talks about his humble upbringing. Including his family living in a van converted to a motor home for a few years while travelling Europe driving karts.All the drivers are freaks. What kind of kid can convince their parents to spend that kind of money on karting when they've not long since stopped wetting the bed? and what parent is going to risk their home and livelihood on the million to one chance it'll ever come to anything, unless the parent is involved with motor racing already, or is at least very comfortable financially.
The Moose said:
In Ocon’s interview on beyond the grid, he talks about his humble upbringing. Including his family living in a van converted to a motor home for a few years while travelling Europe driving karts.
I don't think there's anything particularly humble about being wealthy enough to travel around Europe in a motorhome for a few years, and to be able to race karts while you're doing it.HardtopManual said:
I don't think there's anything particularly humble about being wealthy enough to travel around Europe in a motorhome for a few years, and to be able to race karts while you're doing it.
Not even if they sold the family home to pay for it?“All the top drivers were in teams but we had a small truck, the same one my father worked with. At one point my father sold our house and we were living in a caravan. After the races I was sleeping in front of the school in the caravan, to go to school in the morning.”
https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/archive/article...
Edited by thegreenhell on Tuesday 4th December 13:02
OFORBES said:
Thats true, you cant just rock up with billions and get a seat, you have to have amounted a certain number of points etc to have a super license so everyone has to have some form of talent...
It's just interesting sat here trying to think of a handful of drivers who have got to F1 without a lot of money, like the old days
Stroll has billions. Not sure about talent though.It's just interesting sat here trying to think of a handful of drivers who have got to F1 without a lot of money, like the old days
Sadly the routes available for determined talent re-mortgaging their house ala Mansell are over.
HardtopManual said:
The Moose said:
In Ocon’s interview on beyond the grid, he talks about his humble upbringing. Including his family living in a van converted to a motor home for a few years while travelling Europe driving karts.
I don't think there's anything particularly humble about being wealthy enough to travel around Europe in a motorhome for a few years, and to be able to race karts while you're doing it.You’ve obviously not been to any high level Kart races and seen the £200K motor homes for little Johnny ?
HustleRussell said:
Sa Calobra said:
There is no one that is a real talent. Just rich kids.
Muzzer79 said:
Does a rich kid beating other rich kids in GP3 and F2 make him talented?
So much bitterness! Since when are talent and wealth mutually exclusive? In my opinion they are often positively linked, especially in the context of motor racing where having the money gets you more seat time into more races in more advanced series, earlier.
People love to bash Stroll because he is perceived to have bought his F1 opportunity but he won F3 Euro with Prema just as Mick Schumacher has just done, as Esteban Ocon did, as Lando Norris did...
There is a clear path of ascension to F1, clearer than ever before- nobody who reaches F1 has done so just by paying their way. You have to become one of the best racing drivers in the world.
Ferrari gives a 'rich kid' a four-year deal and apparently he has no talent and is where he is because he's beaten other rich kids. Welcome to PistonHeads... Anyone who doesn't recognise Leclerc's talent is blind, frankly.
When I think of privileged rich kids who have bought their way into F1 over more talented drivers, I think of Max Chilton (he who finished GP2 4th in the championship).
To be fair, any driver who wins the GP2/F2 Championship deserves a shot in F1, even Jolyon Palmer deserved a season in F1 to show everyone what he was made of.
People forget Senna came from an extremely(!) wealthy family. The only modern-day successful F1 drivers who come from humble families are Schumacher, Alonso, Hamilton and Vettel - not a bad list... even Ricciardo comes from a wealthy family, but is he only there because of family money? Of course not.
Mick Schumacher is a Ferrari Academy driver now https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/46881708
Leclerc and Schumacher in the 2020 Ferrari, or put Schumacher in the Sauber first if Giovanazzi gets kicked or Kimi gets bored?
Leclerc and Schumacher in the 2020 Ferrari, or put Schumacher in the Sauber first if Giovanazzi gets kicked or Kimi gets bored?
LaurasOtherHalf said:
They're going to have to pull their finger out at some point that lot, he's being managed by Michael's old manager and she refuses to comment on Mick's new appointment. WTF?
I just don't get the secrecy thing at all.
I get that they want privacy and that is their rights as a family but the secrecy is too much.I just don't get the secrecy thing at all.
Michael Schumacher is known all around the World so giving some updates by the family would be better than this second-hand information which is being leaked.
Is it really a good example to others that someone who has had a life-changing accident should be hidden away and everything kept secret?
Refusing to comment on Mick's appointment is just crazy.
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