Are Haas embarrassed about Rich Energy?

Are Haas embarrassed about Rich Energy?

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Discussion

JonChalk

Original Poster:

1,491 posts

49 months

Friday 1st March
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Their website always talks about themselves as the Haas F1 team.

Their twitter handle is still @HaasF1team.

Their Facebook page is still Haas F1 team.

Despite their legal entry being Rich Energy Haas F1 team.

Williams have gone the whole hog with ROKIT; changed the lot, talk about themselves as "ROKiT Williams", etc.

Is the shine coming off already?

Megaflow

6,663 posts

164 months

Friday 1st March
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I strongly suspect, dispose what Rich Energy are telling the world, that they have barely given them enough money to put the name on the car, to quote Days of Thunder, certainly not enough to name the team after it.

Sixpackpert

3,752 posts

153 months

Friday 1st March
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It saves them having to change it back to HaasF1 when the inevitable split happens.

Arklight

793 posts

128 months

Friday 1st March
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There is something very odd about the whole Rich energy setup, Haas say they have done their due diligence but it just doesn't add up when you look at their accounts.

Unless the UK side of things is being used for some creative accounting for other businesses/persons then they don't have the funds to be sponsoring all of the things they claim to be.

That and the fact there only appears to be around 3 cans of the stuff in existence (doing the PR rounds).

They have taken the testimonials page down off of the Rich Energy website now, but when it was there they where all from pokey little shops that if you actually enquire have no knowledge of the company.

But stranger things have happened and it may be all legit......

C Lee Farquar

2,347 posts

155 months

Saturday 2nd March
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Arklight said:
But stranger things have happened and it may be all legit......
At first I was nodding my head, but then wondered if the tales of fraud from the past are any stranger than Rich Energy! I'm probably more interested in how this plays out than how their car performs.

At least Haas can afford any shortfall.
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skwdenyer

6,669 posts

179 months

Saturday 2nd March
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I tend to think this really might be a "build it and they will come" strategy (or straight punt if you like) - get the brand out there in the belief that it will build sales. Perhaps encourage prospective customers to ask for it, in turn building "demand" and hence sales into retail.

They've just signed a distribution partner: https://www.foodmanufacture.co.uk/Article/2019/02/...

Will be interested to see how it pans out.

tigerkoi

2,588 posts

137 months

Saturday 2nd March
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skwdenyer said:
I tend to think this really might be a "build it and they will come" strategy (or straight punt if you like) - get the brand out there in the belief that it will build sales. Perhaps encourage prospective customers to ask for it, in turn building "demand" and hence sales into retail.

They've just signed a distribution partner: https://www.foodmanufacture.co.uk/Article/2019/02/...

Will be interested to see how it pans out.
I agree that that seems like the likely approach, but that means it’s just so much easier to dismantle them as serious when they do follow such a ‘model’.

New things or products have been marketed without a fully formed business operation from the beginning of time. I think what switches off people about the Rokits and Rich Energy’s of this world are they look like complete chancers if they can’t even afford to have crates of the stuff to hand out or working model phone examples to give out on trial to a select audience. Nail some pre-orders and working commitments with which to propel any brand.

If they can’t even afford to do that, but would rather create a buzz over something they can’t yet prove to be able to provide...it says a lot about the image is everything, instagram’d world we live in today.

As for Walkers Logistics, I wouldn’t be surprised if the ‘signing’ is little more than an MoU. I’d be interested if Philip Walker and co have actually taken money for delivering something that hasn’t seen circulation yet. Rich Energy would start looking like the real deal if they announced that they’d won a deal to get their drinks into all NISAs or 7-Elevens or something.

Let’s see as you say, how it pans out!


ukaskew

4,726 posts

160 months

Sunday 3rd March
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I think Rokit are at least being a bit more honest about where they are in the market.

Rich Energy say they've made 90m cans and are in 6000 UK outlets. Hard to disprove the first claim but the second is near impossible without them being in at least two major supermarkets, which they clearly aren't.

The cans also say 'Made in Austria' on them, which is interesting given their apparent UK factory.

SpudLink

2,355 posts

131 months

Sunday 3rd March
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tigerkoi said:
Rich Energy would start looking like the real deal if they announced that they’d won a deal to get their drinks into all NISAs or 7-Elevens or something.

Let’s see as you say, how it pans out!
I’m as sceptical as anyone, but after all they’ve said about building a premium image, it would look odd for them to be using NISA or 7-Eleven to dump the product on the market.


tigerkoi

2,588 posts

137 months

Sunday 3rd March
quotequote all
SpudLink said:
tigerkoi said:
Rich Energy would start looking like the real deal if they announced that they’d won a deal to get their drinks into all NISAs or 7-Elevens or something.

Let’s see as you say, how it pans out!
I’m as sceptical as anyone, but after all they’ve said about building a premium image, it would look odd for them to be using NISA or 7-Eleven to dump the product on the market.
Can’t disagree with that.

Saying that though, I really can’t understand how in a world where we already have Monster and Red Bull and whatnot, where the USP is in a ‘premium’ energy drink? According to Wall St, Monster is the biggest energy drink in the US, and analysts reckon the segment provides the best growth potential of the lot - flying against the general downtrend in fizzy drink consumption. But it’s growth built on NASCAR, BMX and MMA sponsorships. Not really premium to my mind. Rich Energy might actually have a plan to secure some of that forecasted growth trend in the European market. But with so many companies out there offering a spectrum of stuff, with products on shelves, I struggle to see differentiation.

Unless they want to create a buzz and just get bought out by PepsiCo or someone.

The Moose

17,313 posts

148 months

Sunday 3rd March
quotequote all
tigerkoi said:
Can’t disagree with that.

Saying that though, I really can’t understand how in a world where we already have Monster and Red Bull and whatnot, where the USP is in a ‘premium’ energy drink? According to Wall St, Monster is the biggest energy drink in the US, and analysts reckon the segment provides the best growth potential of the lot - flying against the general downtrend in fizzy drink consumption. But it’s growth built on NASCAR, BMX and MMA sponsorships. Not really premium to my mind. Rich Energy might actually have a plan to secure some of that forecasted growth trend in the European market. But with so many companies out there offering a spectrum of stuff, with products on shelves, I struggle to see differentiation.

Unless they want to create a buzz and just get bought out by PepsiCo or someone.
The problem is that energy drinks in general are not a premium product. ‘Premium’ customers don’t buy energy drinks!

petop

1,582 posts

105 months

Sunday 3rd March
quotequote all
ukaskew said:
I think Rokit are at least being a bit more honest about where they are in the market.

Rich Energy say they've made 90m cans and are in 6000 UK outlets. Hard to disprove the first claim but the second is near impossible without them being in at least two major supermarkets, which they clearly aren't.

The cans also say 'Made in Austria' on them, which is interesting given their apparent UK factory.
You can buy the drink on Amazon (weird if you ask me buying that sort of thing on there but hey-ho) but if you look online it reminds me of those Forex sites that show screenshots of "awesome trades". In fact i bet if you looked on those sites, it wouldn't surprise me some Rich Energy cans in the screenshot!

JonChalk

Original Poster:

1,491 posts

49 months

Sunday 3rd March
quotequote all
petop said:
You can buy the drink on Amazon.....
50% pricier than Red Bull, give or take £30 vs £21 for 24 x 250ml

tigerkoi

2,588 posts

137 months

Sunday 3rd March
quotequote all
The Moose said:
tigerkoi said:
Can’t disagree with that.

Saying that though, I really can’t understand how in a world where we already have Monster and Red Bull and whatnot, where the USP is in a ‘premium’ energy drink? According to Wall St, Monster is the biggest energy drink in the US, and analysts reckon the segment provides the best growth potential of the lot - flying against the general downtrend in fizzy drink consumption. But it’s growth built on NASCAR, BMX and MMA sponsorships. Not really premium to my mind. Rich Energy might actually have a plan to secure some of that forecasted growth trend in the European market. But with so many companies out there offering a spectrum of stuff, with products on shelves, I struggle to see differentiation.

Unless they want to create a buzz and just get bought out by PepsiCo or someone.
The problem is that energy drinks in general are not a premium product. ‘Premium’ customers don’t buy energy drinks!
Exactly. I think you’re complementing my wider point: if you’re “premium” you’re worrying about a 25yo Yamazaki or your Berry Bros & Rudd investments, not a 90p can of A.N.Other energy drink a construction worker picks up in Aldi for their 6.30am pick-me-up biggrin

Kraken

782 posts

139 months

Sunday 3rd March
quotequote all
The Moose said:
The problem is that energy drinks in general are not a premium product. ‘Premium’ customers don’t buy energy drinks!
Why can't it be a premium product? There are premium brands of many other beverages.

tigerkoi

2,588 posts

137 months

Sunday 3rd March
quotequote all
Kraken said:
The Moose said:
The problem is that energy drinks in general are not a premium product. ‘Premium’ customers don’t buy energy drinks!
Why can't it be a premium product? There are premium brands of many other beverages.
Fair point, but in order for something to be premium, it needs more of a story.
Like a 25yo Yamazaki. Like it’s aged over a quart century, 12k bottles only made a year etc.

But in a game like energy drinks where you’re fiddling for the tiniest of margins per can, then it’s sort of hard to project that what you’re offering is anything more or less than what else is on the supermarket shelf. There’s almost zilch room at that cost point to create a ‘superior/premium’ offering. You can say you’re premium. But then you’ve got to explain why and people get that. Rich Energy say nothing about how or in what way there product is different.

rallycross

9,691 posts

176 months

Sunday 3rd March
quotequote all
petop said:
You can buy the drink on Amazon !
Good luck with that, but if you are daft enough to press PAY for item don't expect to receive anything anytime soon!

FourWheelDrift

76,164 posts

223 months

Sunday 3rd March
quotequote all
I think you'll get your Rich Energy drink about the same time you'll get your Rokit phone.

The Moose

17,313 posts

148 months

Sunday 3rd March
quotequote all
Kraken said:
The Moose said:
The problem is that energy drinks in general are not a premium product. ‘Premium’ customers don’t buy energy drinks!
Why can't it be a premium product? There are premium brands of many other beverages.
Because customers of premium products don’t generally buy energy drinks.

A previous poster has described the typical consumer of that type of product...and I agree.

RemarkLima

638 posts

151 months

Sunday 3rd March
quotequote all
The Moose said:
tigerkoi said:
Can’t disagree with that.

Saying that though, I really can’t understand how in a world where we already have Monster and Red Bull and whatnot, where the USP is in a ‘premium’ energy drink? According to Wall St, Monster is the biggest energy drink in the US, and analysts reckon the segment provides the best growth potential of the lot - flying against the general downtrend in fizzy drink consumption. But it’s growth built on NASCAR, BMX and MMA sponsorships. Not really premium to my mind. Rich Energy might actually have a plan to secure some of that forecasted growth trend in the European market. But with so many companies out there offering a spectrum of stuff, with products on shelves, I struggle to see differentiation.

Unless they want to create a buzz and just get bought out by PepsiCo or someone.
The problem is that energy drinks in general are not a premium product. ‘Premium’ customers don’t buy energy drinks!
I put energy drinks into the same category as cigarettes, basically not good for your, or wallet but good for a buzz and image... There's loafs of brands of cigarettes, from cheap to premium, weak to strong.

It'll probably end up the same market, before only being sold behind closed counters ;-)

Cigarettes were sold to all stratas of society, and the cost difference between a cheap and premium is pretty minimal - or at least used to be. So I think there is room for a premium one, but it'll not be night and day difference.

Edited by RemarkLima on Sunday 3rd March 23:01