The Official F1 2020 silly season *contains speculation*
Discussion
ELUSIVEJIM said:
InductionRoar said:
If Ocon beats Ricciardo over the course of a season in "equal machinery" it will be down to reliability issues IMO.
I agree. I honestly think Ricciardo has taken over from Alonso at bad team moves.
Hopefully, the car improves but I think he has landed in the crap.
he need to make some real money at some point
next move will be for car
I think Red Bull pushed Ricciardo out... unintentionally.
Even if they were providing equal machinery, it was clear that Red Bull saw Max as their next star. It was in the way Christian spoke about both drivers, and Daniel got the same impression confirmed, in his mind, by the reaction to Baku.
Then there's the question of whether he really could keep beating Max in equal machinery. It's not uncommon for a fast driver to get more consistent with experience. It seems (to me) far less common for an experienced, consistent driver to get any faster.
Between the two, they seemed equal, but Max's advantage was speed and Daniel's is experience and consistency. For me, over time, it was a war Max was more likely to win.
If Dan stayed at Red Bull, and got beaten by Max this year for whatever reason (he'd probably suspect favouritism) then his future stock goes down.
Now, in the Renault, he's not getting the results but his reputation, and value, isn't at the same risk it would be if he'd stayed at Red Bull.
I think moving was the right thing, but Renault wasn't the right team... not that he had much choice. Perhaps there was no right team, but he's kept the door open.
Even if they were providing equal machinery, it was clear that Red Bull saw Max as their next star. It was in the way Christian spoke about both drivers, and Daniel got the same impression confirmed, in his mind, by the reaction to Baku.
Then there's the question of whether he really could keep beating Max in equal machinery. It's not uncommon for a fast driver to get more consistent with experience. It seems (to me) far less common for an experienced, consistent driver to get any faster.
Between the two, they seemed equal, but Max's advantage was speed and Daniel's is experience and consistency. For me, over time, it was a war Max was more likely to win.
If Dan stayed at Red Bull, and got beaten by Max this year for whatever reason (he'd probably suspect favouritism) then his future stock goes down.
Now, in the Renault, he's not getting the results but his reputation, and value, isn't at the same risk it would be if he'd stayed at Red Bull.
I think moving was the right thing, but Renault wasn't the right team... not that he had much choice. Perhaps there was no right team, but he's kept the door open.
swisstoni said:
Seeing Verstappen saddled with some quick upstart kid with no respect for a teammate would be a lot of fun.
I think it's Hamilton who needs that upstart kid in the second Mercedes.Verstappen would do nicely
You could say that is what Vettel has with LeClerc at Ferrari.
HustleRussell said:
sparta6 said:
KevinCamaroSS said:
sparta6 said:
Alonso could already be on 8 x WDC's if Lewis had stayed loyal to McLaren.
How do you come up with that idea?But Mercedes made the right strategy call with Lewis especially as they also wanted to reposition its street car marketing.
Witness Alonso out in the cold...
But we all know how well Alonso can hustle a subpar car, and the 2013 Merc was second in the WCC.
Vettel would likely have had a much tougher year.
Norfolkit said:
TheDeuce said:
He's good enough and hardly compares to Gasly that RB recently dropped.
Just look at bottas's points and stats this season. There is no reason to believe any of the available drivers would do any better so why change what is working very well already?
Also worth noting that bottas's wheel to wheel discipline when racing Lewis is superb. That alone must be worth a lot to those on the pit wall, who I assume are somewhat clenched each time it happens..
The future, Bottas is 30 next week, he's not the team leader for the future.Just look at bottas's points and stats this season. There is no reason to believe any of the available drivers would do any better so why change what is working very well already?
Also worth noting that bottas's wheel to wheel discipline when racing Lewis is superb. That alone must be worth a lot to those on the pit wall, who I assume are somewhat clenched each time it happens..
As it is, if they carry on as they have been doing, with Lewis winning this years (basically job done just about) and then next years, then they will be known for probably quite some time as the most successful team in F1 - their team records, along with Lewis's driver records will be the new standard against which all others will be compared. That is hugely valuable for their brand, and it's a value that would last and last even if they stopped competing in F1.
I would argue that securing that goal is more valuable than worrying too much about 2021 and beyond. For any other team, I would agree that the future is as important as the present - but it IS different for Mercedes right now. They're so close to achieving greatness and making real history. They get one chance at leading Lewis to a record equalling 7th WDC, and a succesive 7th WCC for the team. That would be spectacular, and if they don't secure it next season they could realistically need to wait a couple of decades to build up the same run of success and have another go at the same target - no one really knows how things will go post 2021, but we all know they have a chance to smash records next season. That is why I don't think they will, or should rock the boat.
If it ain't broken...
sparta6 said:
HustleRussell said:
sparta6 said:
KevinCamaroSS said:
sparta6 said:
Alonso could already be on 8 x WDC's if Lewis had stayed loyal to McLaren.
How do you come up with that idea?But Mercedes made the right strategy call with Lewis especially as they also wanted to reposition its street car marketing.
Witness Alonso out in the cold...
But we all know how well Alonso can hustle a subpar car, and the 2013 Merc was second in the WCC.
Vettel would likely have had a much tougher year.
ELUSIVEJIM said:
Marko said:
"Until this season, Pierre had good racing and qualifying pace, and no problems with overtaking. But this year, he showed none of those qualities".
Ouch. Sounds like RB are done with him, unless he has a stellar turn around in this second half of the season. ELUSIVEJIM said:
Kick a kid when he is down.
https://www.wheels24.co.za/FormulaOne/gasly-issues...
Thought this was interesting
"No one knows who will be Verstappen's teammate next year, so Albon has the opportunity to perform and develop without any pressure in these nine races."
Will Red Bull look outside their own stable for 2020 is Albon doesn't perform?
No pressure..!? Basically: "be amazing or you only have 9 races with us".https://www.wheels24.co.za/FormulaOne/gasly-issues...
Thought this was interesting
"No one knows who will be Verstappen's teammate next year, so Albon has the opportunity to perform and develop without any pressure in these nine races."
Will Red Bull look outside their own stable for 2020 is Albon doesn't perform?
HustleRussell said:
That was some race for Alonso.How he got that car back in that state was mighty impressive.
TheDeuce said:
ELUSIVEJIM said:
Kick a kid when he is down.
https://www.wheels24.co.za/FormulaOne/gasly-issues...
Thought this was interesting
"No one knows who will be Verstappen's teammate next year, so Albon has the opportunity to perform and develop without any pressure in these nine races."
Will Red Bull look outside their own stable for 2020 is Albon doesn't perform?
No pressure..!? Basically: "be amazing or you only have 9 races with us".https://www.wheels24.co.za/FormulaOne/gasly-issues...
Thought this was interesting
"No one knows who will be Verstappen's teammate next year, so Albon has the opportunity to perform and develop without any pressure in these nine races."
Will Red Bull look outside their own stable for 2020 is Albon doesn't perform?
Exactly.
I can't see Albon being any better than Gasly. IMO it's a three-way fight for two seats at Toro Rosso in 2020.
Perhaps Kvyat should start speaking to his contacts at Ferrari and see if Alfa want someone to replace Giovinazzi.
ELUSIVEJIM said:
Exactly.
I can't see Albon being any better than Gasly. IMO it's a three-way fight for two seats at Toro Rosso in 2020.
Perhaps Kvyat should start speaking to his contacts at Ferrari and see if Alfa want someone to replace Giovinazzi.
Kimi & Kvyat - quality line up. I’m sure Kimi would be more than happy if Kvyat hooks him with some of that Russian Vodka
ELUSIVEJIM said:
TheDeuce said:
ELUSIVEJIM said:
Kick a kid when he is down.
https://www.wheels24.co.za/FormulaOne/gasly-issues...
Thought this was interesting
"No one knows who will be Verstappen's teammate next year, so Albon has the opportunity to perform and develop without any pressure in these nine races."
Will Red Bull look outside their own stable for 2020 is Albon doesn't perform?
No pressure..!? Basically: "be amazing or you only have 9 races with us".https://www.wheels24.co.za/FormulaOne/gasly-issues...
Thought this was interesting
"No one knows who will be Verstappen's teammate next year, so Albon has the opportunity to perform and develop without any pressure in these nine races."
Will Red Bull look outside their own stable for 2020 is Albon doesn't perform?
Exactly.
I can't see Albon being any better than Gasly. IMO it's a three-way fight for two seats at Toro Rosso in 2020.
Perhaps Kvyat should start speaking to his contacts at Ferrari and see if Alfa want someone to replace Giovinazzi.
From what seems to be mentioned in certain places Gasly's attitude has been a major problem, and a big reason he hasn't done that well.
Steamer said:
That’s an interesting one. Gio - nice lad but not really setting the world on fire.
Kimi & Kvyat - quality line up. I’m sure Kimi would be more than happy if Kvyat hooks him with some of that Russian Vodka
doesn't really work with alfa being a ferrari feeder team though, unless ferrari see something they like in kvyat.Kimi & Kvyat - quality line up. I’m sure Kimi would be more than happy if Kvyat hooks him with some of that Russian Vodka
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