Official 2019 Chinese Grand Prix Thread ***SPOILERS***
Discussion
Vaud said:
I think technically they are very impressive. Visually and aurally I think they can still do more to impress. Difficult balance.
We have a grid with no pay drivers, so there is more competence and fewer crashes. We have no new teams joining and failing, so no cars being lapped 5 times.
The gap from front to back is pretty tight, and yet we have little overtaking.
I love the sport, but more work to be done.
Drivers are skilled, so you could say that they don't let themselves overtaken as easily as 20 30 years ago when some drivers looked like real amateurs. We have a grid with no pay drivers, so there is more competence and fewer crashes. We have no new teams joining and failing, so no cars being lapped 5 times.
The gap from front to back is pretty tight, and yet we have little overtaking.
I love the sport, but more work to be done.
Still more overtaking these days than we ever had before. Problem is that we want a big show every weekend now.
E34-3.2 said:
Drivers are skilled, so you could say that they don't let themselves overtaken as easily as 20 30 years ago when some drivers looked like real amateurs.
Still more overtaking these days than we ever had before. Problem is that we want a big show every weekend now.
It's not a popular view but if fans want the best show every weekend, stop going to tracks like Albert Park and Monaco where overtaking is all but impossible, the Tilkedromes get criticised for having no soul or whatever but they all now produce the best racing. Still more overtaking these days than we ever had before. Problem is that we want a big show every weekend now.
I know Monaco will never go off the calendar, personally I like it as an event, but it's not the cars or drivers that are the main issue.
Personally I'd tweak the DRS rule and make it usable twice on a lap as it is now, but the drivers can choose where to use it.
I seem to recall some great races in China over the last few years. I'm actually quite a fan of this circuit as far as newer circuits go. Last year's race was a belter and I seem to remember Perez having a superb drive here way back in his Sauber years too. My memories of inidividual races (and seasons for that matter) these days is terrible but a lot of stand out memories from this circuit in particular.
Seeing as everybody seems to have written Vettel off after Bahrain, I'm going to stick up for underdog and say he's going to bounce back at this one, with Hamilton finishing second in a Ferrari sandwich. Regardless, very much looking forward to this one.
Seeing as everybody seems to have written Vettel off after Bahrain, I'm going to stick up for underdog and say he's going to bounce back at this one, with Hamilton finishing second in a Ferrari sandwich. Regardless, very much looking forward to this one.
DanielSan said:
E34-3.2 said:
Drivers are skilled, so you could say that they don't let themselves overtaken as easily as 20 30 years ago when some drivers looked like real amateurs.
Still more overtaking these days than we ever had before. Problem is that we want a big show every weekend now.
It's not a popular view but if fans want the best show every weekend, stop going to tracks like Albert Park and Monaco where overtaking is all but impossible, the Tilkedromes get criticised for having no soul or whatever but they all now produce the best racing. Still more overtaking these days than we ever had before. Problem is that we want a big show every weekend now.
I know Monaco will never go off the calendar, personally I like it as an event, but it's not the cars or drivers that are the main issue.
Personally I'd tweak the DRS rule and make it usable twice on a lap as it is now, but the drivers can choose where to use it.
slipstream 1985 said:
Agreed about Monaco but it wouldn't cost alot for a small change to the track to make an overtaking place.
No so sure, I run a lot around Monaco and I can't really see how they could make that race a better one. Only interesting thing I have seen is that the "new race" could be running on that new extended part of Monaco on water. Still, very narrow...
E34-3.2 said:
slipstream 1985 said:
Agreed about Monaco but it wouldn't cost alot for a small change to the track to make an overtaking place.
No so sure, I run a lot around Monaco and I can't really see how they could make that race a better one. Only interesting thing I have seen is that the "new race" could be running on that new extended part of Monaco on water. Still, very narrow...
To be honest, you can't really get anything done for 'not a lot' in Monaco. The town centre cost per square metre of property is around £60,000 I think. If the property happened to be track side, double it. How many square metres are we going to need for this new overtaking place? Then you have the fact that many folk really won't want the historic layout of the track, or their town, buggered about with.
Eric Mc said:
Indeycars aren't designed to compete with F1. They are designed to compete with other Indycars.
The fact that F1 might be quicker and have more technical gimmicks packed into them and have the biggest head count and the biggest budgets in motorsport does not impress me one jot. Indeed, it's almost criminal that so much effort and money is put into a product that fails to impress on most occasions.
Never in the field of motor racing has so much effort been put into something that impresses so little.
Even if you don't care a jot about the racing or technology, it's still money moving, employment and training for a lot of people... So just given that so many F1 teams are in the UK, it's a good thing for GB Plc right? The fact that F1 might be quicker and have more technical gimmicks packed into them and have the biggest head count and the biggest budgets in motorsport does not impress me one jot. Indeed, it's almost criminal that so much effort and money is put into a product that fails to impress on most occasions.
Never in the field of motor racing has so much effort been put into something that impresses so little.
slipstream 1985 said:
build in a tighter hairpin type turn here https://www.google.com/maps/place/Monaco/@43.73556...
See below. Once you have allow for the run-off, and the plant required to retrieve cars from that run-off, there isn't really any space left. I also think slowing the cars down more there, would reduce some of the thrill of watching them speed up the following hill back to Casino. What is your theory as to how it would help overtaking? Just because they would have to brake harder for the tighter hairpin?A still from this 360 video here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-YR-MQHrWew (put it into 0.25x speed and using the 360 you can view the barriers and position of both cranes around the current corner layout)
Also, out of date but an above view of how wide the
slipstream 1985 said:
tht wouldn't cost alot and would work fine enough. you defend too hard and ehy have a chance to ge you ont he switchback. Doesnt lose the chracter of the circuit but adds a passing place.
It is impossible to build a road where you have done your drawing without shutting done the car park.
LaurasOtherHalf said:
Think outside the box for Monaco...
Saturday, award 1-20 points for qualifying. 1 for last, 20 for pole.
Sunday, reverse grid. Award 1-20 points for the result, 1 for last, 20 for first.
That would be extremely entertaining! Of course the far faster cars at the back really could manage a lot of overtaking, even at Monaco. I think however they generally like to stick the fastest cars at the front to improve the chances of safety and cars surving the race. At Monaco in particular, it would be a massacre if they put them at the back.. Saturday, award 1-20 points for qualifying. 1 for last, 20 for pole.
Sunday, reverse grid. Award 1-20 points for the result, 1 for last, 20 for first.
Williams would support you idea at least. Points for last and last? Yes please.
Eric Mc said:
Indeycars aren't designed to compete with F1. They are designed to compete with other Indycars.
The fact that F1 might be quicker and have more technical gimmicks packed into them and have the biggest head count and the biggest budgets in motorsport does not impress me one jot. Indeed, it's almost criminal that so much effort and money is put into a product that fails to impress on most occasions.
Never in the field of motor racing has so much effort been put into something that impresses so little.
Indie is a spec series, you cant compare it to F1, if you dont understand this Eric then I suggest your opinions of criminal waste in F1 really dont hold any merit.The fact that F1 might be quicker and have more technical gimmicks packed into them and have the biggest head count and the biggest budgets in motorsport does not impress me one jot. Indeed, it's almost criminal that so much effort and money is put into a product that fails to impress on most occasions.
Never in the field of motor racing has so much effort been put into something that impresses so little.
F1 fails to impress you, so watch something else, its clearly impresses many, many others. The thing with F1 is that you have to really understand the sport to get the most from it, thats part of the enjoyment for me, its a geek sport really, and i love it.
E34-3.2 said:
slipstream 1985 said:
tht wouldn't cost alot and would work fine enough. you defend too hard and ehy have a chance to ge you ont he switchback. Doesnt lose the chracter of the circuit but adds a passing place.
It is impossible to build a road where you have done your drawing without shutting done the car park.
Also no room allowed for run off at all. Or cranes/plant. The elevation changes would make the camber of that hairpin insane too.
Bring the cars any closer together there and contact is highly likely at some point which would lead to a huge race delay as they would be stranded on a tight part of the track.
I think if you were stood in that space with a can of paint to mark out your new layout, you would soon realise it isn't going to work as you have shown. The organisers will have looked at all parts of the layout for small worthwhile improvements over the years. I think in fact the corner there is actually now more relaxed than it used to be (hard to tell for sure).
For all the big budgets, if F1 cars did not have a huge DRS, there would be no overtaking - DRS is about as crude as race technology gets.
From a huge worldwide audience, I would be surprised if 10% have a great understanding of the technology involved in F1. Another problem is that a 2% difference in performance front-to-back means that cars at the back completely lose touch with faster cars in front - so there is a potential for cars to not even be on the same piece of tarmac. The very worst kind of a procession.
This year’s regs seem to have bunched-up the midfield so that the race looks exciting and shows what potential there is in reigning-in the big budget teams a little.
Liberty, drivers, former stars like Prost and great engineers like Forghieri, all seem to realise that F1 has gone down a cul-de-sac and needs to return to relying more on mechanical grip so that the huge skills of the current drivers can be displayed and enliven fading audiences.
From a huge worldwide audience, I would be surprised if 10% have a great understanding of the technology involved in F1. Another problem is that a 2% difference in performance front-to-back means that cars at the back completely lose touch with faster cars in front - so there is a potential for cars to not even be on the same piece of tarmac. The very worst kind of a procession.
This year’s regs seem to have bunched-up the midfield so that the race looks exciting and shows what potential there is in reigning-in the big budget teams a little.
Liberty, drivers, former stars like Prost and great engineers like Forghieri, all seem to realise that F1 has gone down a cul-de-sac and needs to return to relying more on mechanical grip so that the huge skills of the current drivers can be displayed and enliven fading audiences.
LaurasOtherHalf said:
Think outside the box for Monaco...
The problem with Monaco is that the cars are now too wide and too fast for the track. It's not the track's fault, and there really is no practical way to alter the track to improve things in that regard. The only sensible solution is to get them to race motorbikes for this one event.Gassing Station | Formula 1 | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff