George Russell

George Russell

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Discussion

glazbagun

Original Poster:

10,141 posts

145 months

Sunday 17th November
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What do we think of his future?

I remember vandoorne arriving at an unbelievably poor McLaren and driving around for years looking bad next to potential GOAT Alonso before vanishing.

George has so far seemed better than Kubica, but he's far from a perfect control/benchmark, especially in a williams. Has George jumped to F1 too early to find a spot to demonstrate his skill, or will his pre-F1 results keep him going?

thebigmacmoomin

2,307 posts

117 months

Sunday 17th November
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It's hard to tell as the Williams car is terrible, though he is spoken of highly.

He signed a 3 year deal at Williams I think so perhaps its him or Ocon for the Mercedes seat for 2022 with Lewis retiring after beating Schumacher's 7 titles or Bottas leaving.

37chevy

3,280 posts

104 months

Sunday 17th November
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I rate him, as do Mercedes otherwise they would have dropped him by now...only time will tell though, next year will be Important alongside Latiffi

EDLT

15,220 posts

154 months

Sunday 17th November
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Back in the good old days drivers did a year or more in a back-of-the-grid team (Button seemingly spent most of his career there) so it shouldn't hurt his reputation. His problem is needing to stick around until some drivers retire, which is going to be tricky now it's the norm to get into F1 as a teenager then stay until your mid-30s.

Big Robbo

280 posts

94 months

Sunday 17th November
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Mercedes rate him very highly. In a test last year in his Williams he was last, but the next day in the Mercedes he went fastest overall so I think that he will be in the mix when Lewis decides to call time

Dynion Araf Uchaf

2,296 posts

171 months

Sunday 17th November
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Not sure how you think it is hard to tell. He has completely dominated Kubica, and whilst Kubica clearly can't be the same driver he was, he's probably only about 0.5 to 1s per lap slower. Coincidentally Russell is 0.5 to 1s per lap quicker. So you'd have to say that he is at least as quick as Kubica was before his accident. Which makes him top drawer.

Norris on the other hand is good and able to beat a good but not future world champion material Sainz, and Albon is the luckiest driver on earth, arriving at Red Bull just as Max has a fall back from his high standards.

Ergo, Russell is the best of the three British rookie drivers but whether he'll get the chance to prove it, only time will tell.

37chevy

3,280 posts

104 months

Sunday 17th November
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Dynion Araf Uchaf said:
Not sure how you think it is hard to tell. He has completely dominated Kubica, and whilst Kubica clearly can't be the same driver he was, he's probably only about 0.5 to 1s per lap slower. Coincidentally Russell is 0.5 to 1s per lap quicker. So you'd have to say that he is at least as quick as Kubica was before his accident. Which makes him top drawer.

Norris on the other hand is good and able to beat a good but not future world champion material Sainz, and Albon is the luckiest driver on earth, arriving at Red Bull just as Max has a fall back from his high standards.

Ergo, Russell is the best of the three British rookie drivers but whether he'll get the chance to prove it, only time will tell.
Probably because we don’t really know how good, or how hampered Kubica is....sure he was a great driver in his previous F1 career but prior to this year it’s been a long time since he was driving competitively at this level.

2020 will be a make or break year for Russell

TheDeuce

3,753 posts

14 months

Sunday 17th November
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37chevy said:
I rate him, as do Mercedes otherwise they would have dropped him by now...only time will tell though, next year will be Important alongside Latiffi
Yep. I think it's fair to say that he's a good driver, his test for Mercedes this season was very positive. It's also fair to say that so far we have only seen him battle RK in the same car, and at this stage I think it's OK to say RK has lost some pace, so that's not all that conclusive. For that reason, Latifi's introduction will give a better representation of George's racing potential.

thegreenhell

6,300 posts

167 months

Monday 18th November
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His future somewhat depends on whether Mercedes stay in F1 beyond 2020, but his main concern has to be somehow keeping himself in the spotlight and hoping he doesn't get left behind when the 'next big thing' inevitably arrives in the sport. He's going to have at least two, possibly three years driving around fighting over dead last before one of the top seats opens up again.

One of the issues with F1 now compared to the past is that there are too few cars, and drivers hang around far too long past their sell-by dates, which means there's very little turnover in drivers, particularly at the top. Mercedes in particular seem to be very conservative in everything they do, and never look like taking a chance on putting a young driver in their race car. Mercedes with Toto in charge will never replace one of the current drivers unless they leave of their own accord, which seems equally unlikely for the foreseeable future. At least with Red Bull everybody in their junior ranks has a chance to be tried and spat out by Helmut Marko.

HustleRussell

17,140 posts

108 months

Monday 18th November
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He needs to do to Latifi what he has done to Kubica and he'll be in a Mercedes quicker than you can say "Sorry Valterri"...

TheDeuce

3,753 posts

14 months

Monday 18th November
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HustleRussell said:
He needs to do to Latifi what he has done to Kubica and he'll be in a Mercedes quicker than you can say "Sorry Valterri"...
Why would that make him better than Bottas? Noot saying he isn't potentially better... But bettering his team rookie team mate wouldn't be enough to demonstrate he was better than Bottas.

thegreenhell

6,300 posts

167 months

Monday 18th November
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He can't do anything in that Williams that will get him bumped into a better team ahead of time, unless they unexpectedly give him a known, experienced team mate to beat. The only chance for that would be Hulkenberg, but that seems extremely unlikely.

mattikake

4,756 posts

147 months

Monday 18th November
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GR is way better than Norris imo and is in the same league as LeClerc at least. Given the car I expect him to form a big 3 of dominance in f1 with CLC and Max, especially now driver weight is not a hindrance as in lower formula.

You can compare him to his team mates in f3 and gp3 and he thoroughly trounced them. I mean it wasn't even close, every lap. Some of those team mates are still languishing in f2, picking up occasional wins and podiums.

GR has proven his speed where he can, has superb results consistency, is not prone to errors, has mental resilience both in a race and over a season, can get a car set up, provides sound engineering feedback and has ability to overtake clinically. He is just lacking a good shot. Imo latifi hasn't got a chance, just like when he tried racing GR in f2. At least that is my prediction (read: hope)!

TheDeuce

3,753 posts

14 months

Tuesday 19th November
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thegreenhell said:
He can't do anything in that Williams that will get him bumped into a better team ahead of time, unless they unexpectedly give him a known, experienced team mate to beat. The only chance for that would be Hulkenberg, but that seems extremely unlikely.
Impossible I'd say. The only reason latifi isn't signed is because they're holding out for a driver that brings money - not one that costs money. Hulkenberg isn't about to tombstone his career at Williams unless he's paid well to do so.

Fingers crossed for GR's F1 future, I'd love to see what he can really do. But it's true to say that at Williams right now he simply cannot show very much. He's shown he's probably a cut above, but turning 'probably' into a safe bet for a higher ranking team requires more concrete evidence.

dobly

557 posts

107 months

Tuesday 19th November
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All 3 of the new wave of Young British* Drivers are top notch.

I'm not sure if anyone could categorically say one is the best.

(* includes the London born Thai)

I'd add Jack Aitken into the mix for the next few years as well.

The other good thing is that they all seem to be genuinely likeable individuals.

Dynion Araf Uchaf

2,296 posts

171 months

Tuesday 19th November
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dobly said:
All 3 of the new wave of Young British* Drivers are top notch.

I'm not sure if anyone could categorically say one is the best.

(* includes the London born Thai)

I'd add Jack Aitken into the mix for the next few years as well.

The other good thing is that they all seem to be genuinely likeable individuals.
they probably are, but social media has changed the landscape for all sporting personalities, no longer can you be border line autistic/asperbergery or rude/arrogant you have to create a following by being 'engaging' Can you imagine Senna in today's world, all that 'mystery' would be removed under the glare of social media. And the hounding he'd have got from knocking Prost off in 1990. COULD you ever have seen him having to apologise for his behaviour like today's lot have to?

mattikake

4,756 posts

147 months

Tuesday 19th November
quotequote all
dobly said:
I'd add Jack Aitken into the mix for the next few years as well.
But the thing is GR decimated Aitken in F2 and Aitken didn't fare much better with GR in GP3. The results look ok on paper for GP3 but witnessing the racing, timings and incidents and it really wasn't close.

HustleRussell

17,140 posts

108 months

Tuesday 19th November
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TheDeuce said:
HustleRussell said:
He needs to do to Latifi what he has done to Kubica and he'll be in a Mercedes quicker than you can say "Sorry Valterri"...
Why would that make him better than Bottas? Noot saying he isn't potentially better... But bettering his team rookie team mate wouldn't be enough to demonstrate he was better than Bottas.
George is a Mercedes young driver, Valterri is not- Mercedes will need to promote George or risk losing him to the competition as they nearly did with Ocon.

Wolff has a professional relationship with Bottas but I'd imagine that the Mercedes backing Ocon and Russell have would trump that.

I don't have such a downer on Bottas as some people do but IMO there's no way he should've been 5th in the WDC last season and has looked eminently beatable by not only Hamilton but the Ferrari and Red Bull drivers on several occasions this season.

thegreenhell

6,300 posts

167 months

Tuesday 19th November
quotequote all
HustleRussell said:
George is a Mercedes young driver, Valterri is not- Mercedes will need to promote George or risk losing him to the competition as they nearly did with Ocon.

Wolff has a professional relationship with Bottas but I'd imagine that the Mercedes backing Ocon and Russell have would trump that.
Mercedes backing of Ocon didn't trump anything, as demonstrated by him sitting in the garage all year, and then disappearing off to Renault next year, while Bottas continues in the Mercedes race car for another year.

In most cases, manufacturer-backed young driver programmes seem to be a career hindrance rather than a help. They bring drivers in to F1, but then because their incumbents hang around for an eternity the young guns rarely get a chance to drive for the team that paid for them to be there. Other manufacturers won't touch them because of their association to their rivals, as well as having their own young drivers-in-waiting, so they disappear into the backwaters of DTM or FE.

FourWheelDrift

78,657 posts

232 months

Tuesday 19th November
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Worth saying as well, how the 3 finished the 2018 F2 season.

1st George Russell - 287 points (7 wins, 3x 2nd, 1x 3rd)
2nd Lando Norris - 219 points (1 win, 4x 2nd, 4x 3rd)
3rd Alex Albon - 212 points (4 wins, 1x 2nd, 3x 3rd)

And they are now reversed in order in terms of competitive F1 car. They all deserve competitive cars.