F1 cancelled this year?
Discussion
BrettMRC said:
TheDeuce said:
ukaskew said:
I'm already seeing lots of discussion about this season not being a 'true' world championship (mainly relating to Hamilton potentially winning it, funnily enough).
Not sure I understand the logic, especially given the history of F1 and how some of the championships have been won.
If they get the required races in I don't see why not, if anything this season is going to be one hell of a test of teams (tight turnarounds), driver focus, fitness and consistency.
=Not sure I understand the logic, especially given the history of F1 and how some of the championships have been won.
If they get the required races in I don't see why not, if anything this season is going to be one hell of a test of teams (tight turnarounds), driver focus, fitness and consistency.
It'll be 'technically' a world championship season. And if they hit the target of 16+ races then it's as long as some previous championships.
But whoever wins, anyone who didn't want them to win is forever more going to bang on about how it would have been different if it was a normal season.. We just have to accept that and prepare ourselves for a decade of tedious debate on the subject .
In 2024 someone will say "Well, of course as we all know Hamilton only has his 9th title on a technicality. 2020 was a farce, and inspite of dominating all 12 races it can't truly be counted as a season". (Like that, but with adenoids and a beard)
vx220 said:
BrettMRC said:
TheDeuce said:
ukaskew said:
I'm already seeing lots of discussion about this season not being a 'true' world championship (mainly relating to Hamilton potentially winning it, funnily enough).
Not sure I understand the logic, especially given the history of F1 and how some of the championships have been won.
If they get the required races in I don't see why not, if anything this season is going to be one hell of a test of teams (tight turnarounds), driver focus, fitness and consistency.
=Not sure I understand the logic, especially given the history of F1 and how some of the championships have been won.
If they get the required races in I don't see why not, if anything this season is going to be one hell of a test of teams (tight turnarounds), driver focus, fitness and consistency.
It'll be 'technically' a world championship season. And if they hit the target of 16+ races then it's as long as some previous championships.
But whoever wins, anyone who didn't want them to win is forever more going to bang on about how it would have been different if it was a normal season.. We just have to accept that and prepare ourselves for a decade of tedious debate on the subject .
In 2024 someone will say "Well, of course as we all know Hamilton only has his 9th title on a technicality. 2020 was a farce, and inspite of dominating all 12 races it can't truly be counted as a season". (Like that, but with adenoids and a beard)
And just to square the circle -
If Hamilton doesn't win the short 2020 championship through bad luck , mechanical breakdown and Max punting off the track ..................despite being the fastest .
Do you honestly think his fans will simply say 'Thats racing , it was the same for everyone '
I think not .
2020 will always be remembered for being a very strange season .
If Hamilton doesn't win the short 2020 championship through bad luck , mechanical breakdown and Max punting off the track ..................despite being the fastest .
Do you honestly think his fans will simply say 'Thats racing , it was the same for everyone '
I think not .
2020 will always be remembered for being a very strange season .
Simoncelli58 said:
And just to square the circle -
If Hamilton doesn't win the short 2020 championship through bad luck , mechanical breakdown and Max punting off the track ..................despite being the fastest .
All of that could happen any season though. Fewer races might skew things a bit, but as has been said, it's the same for all of them.If Hamilton doesn't win the short 2020 championship through bad luck , mechanical breakdown and Max punting off the track ..................despite being the fastest .
Simoncelli58020 said:
will always be remembered for being a very strange season .
No argument there.Simoncelli58 said:
And just to square the circle -
If Hamilton doesn't win the short 2020 championship through bad luck , mechanical breakdown and Max punting off the track ..................despite being the fastest .
Do you honestly think his fans will simply say 'Thats racing , it was the same for everyone '
I think not .
2020 will always be remembered for being a very strange season .
Arguably any close fought championship of any length will be decided by specific events; Schumacher on Hill in Australia, Hamilton's engine letting go in 2016, Hamilton not changing tyres on time in 2007, Hamilton passing Glock at the end of Brazil 2008, Alonso unexpectedly failing to make progress in Abu Dhabi, Ferrari's cock ups for Irvine in 1999, Suzuka with Prost and Senna at both the first and last corners in different seasons...and so on.If Hamilton doesn't win the short 2020 championship through bad luck , mechanical breakdown and Max punting off the track ..................despite being the fastest .
Do you honestly think his fans will simply say 'Thats racing , it was the same for everyone '
I think not .
2020 will always be remembered for being a very strange season .
I'd rather see a 20.race season than an 8 race one, however wouldn't argue the latter produces an illegitimate WDC.
TheDeuce said:
It'll be 'technically' a world championship season. And if they hit the target of 16+ races then it's as long as some previous championships.
Much longer in fact.The shortest official F1 World Championships were only 7 races long. F1 didn't actually reach a double figure number of races until 1958 when they held 11 rounds.
Anyone who looks back and says the 2020 champion is not worthy as the season was so short will also therefore be insinuating that the likes of Fangio and company were not proper champions either which is clearly total rubbish.
It doesn't matter how long the season is as long as it meets the regulations in the given year.
Whoever wins will be a very worthy World Champion in my eyes.
TwentyFive said:
TheDeuce said:
It'll be 'technically' a world championship season. And if they hit the target of 16+ races then it's as long as some previous championships.
Much longer in fact.The shortest official F1 World Championships were only 7 races long. F1 didn't actually reach a double figure number of races until 1958 when they held 11 rounds.
Anyone who looks back and says the 2020 champion is not worthy as the season was so short will also therefore be insinuating that the likes of Fangio and company were not proper champions either which is clearly total rubbish.
It doesn't matter how long the season is as long as it meets the regulations in the given year.
Whoever wins will be a very worthy World Champion in my eyes.
RonaldMcDonaldAteMyCat said:
rguably any close fought championship of any length will be decided by specific events; Schumacher on Hill in Australia, Hamilton's engine letting go in 2016, Hamilton not changing tyres on time in 2007, Hamilton passing Glock at the end of Brazil 2008, Alonso unexpectedly failing to make progress in Abu Dhabi, Ferrari's cock ups for Irvine in 1999, Suzuka with Prost and Senna at both the first and last corners in different seasons...and so on.
That's not really true. Every world championship is defined by every event, not just specific ones.Whilst I agree that your examples may be the stand out moment of a given year, they are not the singular reason why a title was won or lost. It is a culmination of many variables throughout the year resulting in an overall outcome.
ChocolateFrog said:
Getting excited now.
Seems Ferrari have written off Vettels swansong and CLC's chances.
HAM vs VER in a sprint, I can't wait.
This is my hope too. My worry is that whilst Ferrari were looking a little out of shape this season, I thought they would tangle with red bull even if they can't touch Mercedes. But they're now looking so hopeless (everything seems to have gone wrong..) I can't see them battling red bull all that often either!Seems Ferrari have written off Vettels swansong and CLC's chances.
HAM vs VER in a sprint, I can't wait.
So will red bull be a challenge for Mercedes beyond these first three 'red bull' races? Hope so! The worst outcome would be Mercedes safely ahead of red bull, and red bull safely ahead of Ferrari for most races. There actually is space for that scenario to happen if Ferrari are far enough off the pace this season..
All speculation of course... But that's about the best/worst of what could happen at the top of the grid. My hope is that the new Honda power along with a typically sorted red bull car is an approximate match for Mercedes, at least often enough for Mercedes to have a proper championship fight on their hands
PanicBuyingBogRoll said:
Doesn't new and improved Honda PU usually translate into engines going pop?
It will be interesting to see how Max deals with the pressure of having a genuine chance of a WDC. I'm guessing it could be explosive.
It appears to me that several times last season Max was given some very high power modes for extended periods in multiple races through the season to get the job done. Their PU proved extremely resilient. In Brazil last year, Mercedes couldn't keep up for about the last ten laps - even on the straights. In fairness Mercedes had some PU concerns due to age I recall.. But the pace of the RB's was impressive by any standard.It will be interesting to see how Max deals with the pressure of having a genuine chance of a WDC. I'm guessing it could be explosive.
They don't like to go pop anymore it seems.
It was quite different in the McLaren-Honda days, but that relationship was very different too. It was more Honda as a supplier than as a partner. Also, Alonso gobbing off publicly about Honda's efforts was never going to work out well either. Making derogative comments about someone else's work in public is a big no no in Japanese culture. The change between What they managed with McLaren and what they then managed for Toro Rosso and then Red Bull was staggering.
TheDeuce said:
It appears to me that several times last season Max was given some very high power modes for extended periods in multiple races through the season to get the job done. Their PU proved extremely resilient. In Brazil last year, Mercedes couldn't keep up for about the last ten laps - even on the straights. In fairness Mercedes had some PU concerns due to age I recall.. But the pace of the RB's was impressive by any standard.
They don't like to go pop anymore it seems.
It was quite different in the McLaren-Honda days, but that relationship was very different too. It was more Honda as a supplier than as a partner. Also, Alonso gobbing off publicly about Honda's efforts was never going to work out well either. Making derogative comments about someone else's work in public is a big no no in Japanese culture. The change between What they managed with McLaren and what they then managed for Toro Rosso and then Red Bull was staggering.
Ironic really; Alonso has been jumping ships to "better" teams since his last WDC, doing all the donkey work, then moving on just before real improvements; McLaren have been jumping ships to "better" engines since their las WCC, doing all the donkey work, then moving on just before real improvements.They don't like to go pop anymore it seems.
It was quite different in the McLaren-Honda days, but that relationship was very different too. It was more Honda as a supplier than as a partner. Also, Alonso gobbing off publicly about Honda's efforts was never going to work out well either. Making derogative comments about someone else's work in public is a big no no in Japanese culture. The change between What they managed with McLaren and what they then managed for Toro Rosso and then Red Bull was staggering.
JonChalk said:
Ironic really; Alonso has been jumping ships to "better" teams since his last WDC, doing all the donkey work, then moving on just before real improvements; McLaren have been jumping ships to "better" engines since their las WCC, doing all the donkey work, then moving on just before real improvements.
I think if you repeatedly can't get something to work, and then someone else can (year one).. It's best to look at what changes you could make on your side of the table. Certainly better than telling the world the PU is crap, and then the following season watching it sweep past you in a competitors car!Anyway, Mercedes power from next year on. If they're still blaming the PU with Merc power and reliability, they will need their heads knocking together.
I can't help but think in some way, probably packaging>cooling, they just can't seem to get on top of any of the hybrid era PU's.
jsf said:
McLaren were the best of the rest last year and beat the works Renault team.
They are on top of the PU.
They did a lot better last season, on various levels. But they also used more PU parts than Renault did on their own two cars. I wouldn't say they were entirely on top of the PU when there is another team using the same PU and suffering less issues with it.They are on top of the PU.
McLaren designed a superior car, good enough to beat Renault in-spite of multiple PU related DNF's and forced extra parts usage and penalties.
TheDeuce said:
They did a lot better last season, on various levels. But they also used more PU parts than Renault did on their own two cars. I wouldn't say they were entirely on top of the PU when there is another team using the same PU and suffering less issues with it.
McLaren designed a superior car, good enough to beat Renault in-spite of multiple PU related DNF's and forced extra parts usage and penalties.
Your mental gymnastics must be exhausting. McLaren designed a superior car, good enough to beat Renault in-spite of multiple PU related DNF's and forced extra parts usage and penalties.
There was no problem with the PU integration, Renault engines just go bang too often.
jsf said:
TheDeuce said:
They did a lot better last season, on various levels. But they also used more PU parts than Renault did on their own two cars. I wouldn't say they were entirely on top of the PU when there is another team using the same PU and suffering less issues with it.
McLaren designed a superior car, good enough to beat Renault in-spite of multiple PU related DNF's and forced extra parts usage and penalties.
Your mental gymnastics must be exhausting. McLaren designed a superior car, good enough to beat Renault in-spite of multiple PU related DNF's and forced extra parts usage and penalties.
There was no problem with the PU integration, Renault engines just go bang too often.
How do you account for a sustained PU/component failure rate higher than Renault themselves? If there is no problem and they're fully on top of it, that wouldn't be the case would it? Specifically look at their burn rate of energy store and control electronics.
Same story with Honda power in 2017. Across both cars McLaren chewed through 14 x ES and 13 x CE. The very next year Honda moved to supply Toro Rosso who got through just 6 x ES and 2 x CE. Clearly there are aspects of managing the temperamental nature of these hybrid PU's that they aren't fully on top of.
I could be wrong of course... If you believe that is so, an alternative theory as to why they repeatedly fail to get the results other get off the bat would be useful.
Gassing Station | Formula 1 | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff