Lewis Hamilton (Vol. 2)

[M5-911]

Bo_apex said:

Cancelled my next trip there.

So when was your last trip then? You did not care before?

[CustardOnChips]

Bo_apex said:

CustardOnChips said:

What are you doing about it?

Cancelled my next trip there.

So, nothing than!

[Bo_apex]

M5-911 said:

Bo_apex said:

Cancelled my next trip there.

So when was your last trip then? You did not care before?

You must try harder
45 organisations think Hamilton should cancel his next trip.
Hardly relevant but I cancelled mine of my own volition.

The original question was: will he ?

Interesting to see how some react to a question regarding a topical subject.

[swisstoni]

Bo_apex said:

M5-911 said:

Bo_apex said:

Cancelled my next trip there.

So when was your last trip then? You did not care before?

You must try harder
45 organisations think Hamilton should cancel his next trip.
Hardly relevant but I cancelled mine of my own volition.

The original question was: will he ?

Interesting to see how some react to a question regarding a topical subject.

I think most people can see what your game is.

[Bo_apex]

swisstoni said:

Bo_apex said:

M5-911 said:

Bo_apex said:

Cancelled my next trip there.

So when was your last trip then? You did not care before?

You must try harder
45 organisations think Hamilton should cancel his next trip.
Hardly relevant but I cancelled mine of my own volition.

The original question was: will he ?

Interesting to see how some react to a question regarding a topical subject.

I think most people can see what your game is.

So do you think Hamilton will do it ?

[M5-911]

Bo_apex said:

You must try harder
45 organisations think Hamilton should cancel his next trip.
Hardly relevant but I cancelled mine of my own volition.

The original question was: will he ?

Interesting to see how some react to a question regarding a topical subject.

So basically, you did not give a dam and you still don't as I doubt you ever had a ticket booked anyway.

Why should he?

[smallredball]

Bo_apex said:

M5-911 said:

Bo_apex said:

Cancelled my next trip there.

So when was your last trip then? You did not care before?

You must try harder
45 organisations think Hamilton should cancel his next trip.
Hardly relevant but I cancelled mine of my own volition.

The original question was: will he ?

Interesting to see how some react to a question regarding a topical subject.

But if you're doing whataboutism, where is your criticism of the other 20-odd drivers in the sport for the same reason?

That you've reserved this for LH shows that your priority is not human rights in Saudi - it's just a good cloak to use. (You're not alone; lots of LH haters do it.)

[M5-911]

Bo_apex said:

You must try harder
45 organisations think Hamilton should cancel his next trip.
Hardly relevant but I cancelled mine of my own volition.

The original question was: will he ?

Interesting to see how some react to a question regarding a topical subject.

Well, he answered your question with the problems in Bahrain last year. At least he talks about it publically and don't shy behind a keyboard...

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/s...

[Bo_apex]

smallredball said:

Bo_apex said:

M5-911 said:

Bo_apex said:

Cancelled my next trip there.

So when was your last trip then? You did not care before?

You must try harder
45 organisations think Hamilton should cancel his next trip.
Hardly relevant but I cancelled mine of my own volition.

The original question was: will he ?

Interesting to see how some react to a question regarding a topical subject.

But if you're doing whataboutism, where is your criticism of the other 20-odd drivers in the sport for the same reason?

That you've reserved this for LH shows that your priority is not human rights in Saudi - it's just a good cloak to use. (You're not alone; lots of LH haters do it.)

???
The movement of 45 organisations have reserved this for Hamilton.
Again, it's a good question for those organisations.

My simple question is: will he ?

[MarkwG]

Bo_apex said:

CustardOnChips said:

What are you doing about it?

Cancelled my next trip there.

More fool you, then - no-one has called for "Hamilton to cancel his trip" - they called for him to "Make a stand as he did in Bahrain", asked him to consider boycotting the race, but also gave some ideas for how he might help in other ways, if that wasn't possible: none of which call for him to stay away from Saudi.

https://menarights.org/en/articles/45-organisation...

[M5-911]

Bo_apex said:

???
The movement of 45 organisations have reserved this for Hamilton.
Again, it's a good question for those organisations.

My simple question is: will he ?

Answer to your question:
No he won't.

Why? because like he did in Bahrain, he goes there and doesn't shy away to talk about it instead of just being a keyboard warrior like you or others.

[MarkwG]

M5-911 said:

Bo_apex said:

???
The movement of 45 organisations have reserved this for Hamilton.
Again, it's a good question for those organisations.

My simple question is: will he ?

Answer to your question:
No he won't.

Why? because like he did in Bahrain, he goes there and doesn't shy away to talk about it instead of just being a keyboard warrior like you or others.

[Bo_apex]

MarkwG said:

More fool you, then - no-one has called for "Hamilton to cancel his trip" - they called for him to "Make a stand as he did in Bahrain", asked him to consider boycotting the race, but also gave some ideas for how he might help in other ways, if that wasn't possible: none of which call for him to stay away from Saudi.

https://menarights.org/en/articles/45-organisation...

Boycotting the race while still travelling to Saudi would be interesting.

[Bo_apex]

M5-911 said:

Bo_apex said:

???
The movement of 45 organisations have reserved this for Hamilton.
Again, it's a good question for those organisations.

My simple question is: will he ?

Answer to your question:
No he won't.

Why? because like he did in Bahrain, he goes there and doesn't shy away to talk about it instead of just being a keyboard warrior like you or others.

Hamilton published a Chinese Happy New Year from behind his keyboard. Did that not count then ?

[LukeBrown66]

Thing is contractually he will have to be there. Only thing he can do is not take part and withdraw, but that will get him into hot water contractually, but I expect he has the power to fix that.

More is the point, why not put more pressure on the people who decided to go there anyway, FOM, Hamilton is simply honouring a contract, FOM allowed Saudi to buy a race just as they did Russia, China, Bahrain etc etc.

There is an answer to all this, but fanboys won't like it, stop watching, don't pay, don't go to races, don't buy tickets, merch etc. If you want change that is the only way it's happening.

[Teddy Lop]

smallredball said:

Bo_apex said:

M5-911 said:

Bo_apex said:

Cancelled my next trip there.

So when was your last trip then? You did not care before?

You must try harder
45 organisations think Hamilton should cancel his next trip.
Hardly relevant but I cancelled mine of my own volition.

The original question was: will he ?

Interesting to see how some react to a question regarding a topical subject.

But if you're doing whataboutism, where is your criticism of the other 20-odd drivers in the sport for the same reason?

That you've reserved this for LH shows that your priority is not human rights in Saudi - it's just a good cloak to use. (You're not alone; lots of LH haters do it.)

there are not two opinions to chose from, the world is not binary. At least outside NP&E.

Lifelong Lewis fan, observed him in GP2, loved him since he handed alonso his ass on a plate in '07. Even though I once said I'd never want to see someone break schumachers records as the early noughties were the least exciting period of f1 ever, I've enjoyed immensely seeing Hamilton do exactly that, against all the odds and every precedent, someone who isnt a snake in a team not run by grasping tyrants, all power to them. Love you Lewis.

But the contrast on this topic, I have no defence for. I'm amazed that any intelligent and thoughtful person can't see how the BLM vehicle isn't being cynically exploited by sinister forces, or that as far as human rights go (which BLM essentially purports to be) the American situation is quite laudable and the unjust death rate insignificant when held to the likes of Saudi etc.

[Bo_apex]

LukeBrown66 said:

Thing is contractually he will have to be there. Only thing he can do is not take part and withdraw, but that will get him into hot water contractually, but I expect he has the power to fix that.

More is the point, why not put more pressure on the people who decided to go there anyway, FOM, Hamilton is simply honouring a contract, FOM allowed Saudi to buy a race just as they did Russia, China, Bahrain etc etc.

There is an answer to all this, but fanboys won't like it, stop watching, don't pay, don't go to races, don't buy tickets, merch etc. If you want change that is the only way it's happening.

Hamilton has the ability to repaint the Silver Arrows and suspect boycotting a race is easily within his leverage.

Agree that FOM should be pulling out of Saudi/China/Russia with immediate effect, plenty of other circuits available.

The 45 organisations should also be having a meaningful conversation with FOM.

[swisstoni]

Must be hard to get a protest space outside the Saudi embassy with all these ‘organisations’ and their big concerns.
I’m sure their not spouting from their loo seats.

Better get down there soon Bo to avoid disappointment.
Unless you are already there of course, on 4G?

[angrymoby]

Bo_apex said:

CustardOnChips said:

What are you doing about it?

Cancelled my next trip there.

cancelling your holiday because of covid isn't a boycott

& as pointed out elsewhere, wtf were you doing a: booking it again & b: booking it previously, when you- like everybody else knows about their historical stty human rights record

[glazbagun]

angrymoby said:

glazbagun said:

Then he doesn't care about human rights, only the rights of some humans. I think this is why F1 has famously avoided political stances on anything divisive as it expanded. Kimi made the point about the hypocrisy of the F1 circus virtue signalling over climate change.

if you take virtue signalling to mean a public act with very little associated cost, then i'm not sure Hamilton falls into that bracket

probably also arguable that accusing someone of virtue signalling is in itself an act of virtue signalling (& round & round we go)

My point was that F1 avoids the associated cost whenever it can and avoids controversy for it's own pragmatic purposes. Thinking of things F1 has taken a stand on:

• Renault and Ligier boycotted the SA GP in 1985 over apartheid, whilst the French govt was also boycotting them. They hadn't boycotted them before and it cost WCC points but, arguably, not WDC points. SA GP off calendar until post-apartheid times. Most political I can think of.

• Safety on multiple occasions. Initially led by drivers but eventually became much of what F1 is synonymous with.

• Tobacco Advertising. Probably the biggest associated financial cost of a public act by F1.

• Climate change- even in the 90's I remember a commitment to carbon neutrality with a not insignificant dollar cost, but that is offset by the need for F1 to remain tenuously relevant to car manufacturers.

• Removed grid girls- again little associated cost.

^^^ All of these are fairly non controversial in F1's markets. There was no comment on Russias invasion of Ukraine, Japanese denial of war crimes, Turkeys denial of the Armenian genocide, the 2003 invasion of Iraq, the Chinese treatment of Hong Kong/Uighurs or the Arab Spring, even when it caused the cancelation of a GP. The reasons for this are entirely pragmatic- F1 makes money by racing in multiple countries and is allowed there in part because they act to advertise host countries in a positive light. They don't rock the boat because they want to be invited back and in turn profit from those markets.

Lewis, particularly with his Breonna Taylor protest, is the most outspoken driver I can remember on a non-F1 issue. He is at his reputational peak and has social capital to burn and is using it in a way that, say, Jackie Stewart did for safety and Michael Schumacher didn't do at all. Bottas or Gasly couldn't do it.

The problem he will run into, and the reason why F1 treats moral judgement with the indifference of an arms manufacturer, is that once you start publicly highlighting injustice, how can you stop? And if you do stop, how can you avoid accusations of hypocrisy? I'd love him (all of them!) to rock up to the Saudi GP with political T-Shirts and embarrass their hosts, but it's not going to happen. In which case, claims of standing up for human rights ring hollow.

That said, it has to start somewhere. I think F1's treatment of the drivers meagre anti-racism protest at the start of the race to be an apologetic embarrassment. Turning both barells on the amorality and sheer hypocrisy of F1 would be a fight worth picking.

Edited by glazbagun on Saturday 27th February 19:44