Lewis Hamilton (Vol. 2)

[maz8062]

entropy said:

maz8062 said:

I’ve never seen a WDC suffer the ignominy of losing convincingly to a young whipper snapper and then making the switch to a new team and recovering form, especially in their twilight years. (Vettel/Ricci and Alonso/LH was not twilight years for the WDC’s involved) It’ll take an almighty effort which LH has in him for sure, but history or my history watching F1 would say otherwise.

Thus, for me, I think LH made a mistake in announcing the move this early. It’ll be a distraction. It is a distraction. It’ll mean that the team focuses on GR, the “team leader.” It’ll mean that some will question Ferrari’s investment in what may appear to be a washed up driver. Therefore unless he can turn his form around, Merc have an interest in seeing him performing, it will get harder and more toxic as the season progresses.

It's not like LH's powers have waned to Ricciardo proportions, has it?

There's no right way with announcing movements away from a team

Announce later the speculation over his Merc/F1 future still continues in the intervening time.

There's clearly no 2024 performance clause so Lewis is free to do as he please.

Someone suggested 2024 as a year out. That is totally unprofessional IMO. You take sabbatical because you've upset the management to the extent of being kicked out or waning desire and retirement.

I think he has done the right thing and being respectful to Merc and Sainz (hopefully less worry than if it was announced in the summer) and probably other (business?) reasons we are not privy to.

A lot of folk don’t understand how these things work. You’re looking forward and backwards rather than concentrating on today. Out of the races so far he’s been out-qualified 3-1. Races 3-0. He has 10 points to GR’s 24 (Max has 77) He’s flailing. If he is no longer the future of the team as he’s off somewhere else and if his performances continue in this vein, how long will it take before commentators will start asking if/when he’ll be dropped. There is so much at stake, LH has to deliver today because reputations of powerful people are at stake, bonuses, prize money etc. etc.

Yes he has done the right thing for himself but what about Merc? Has he done the right thing for them and how will this pan out for the next 20 races. Honestly if you think LH can continue with this form for the next 20 races without getting lambasted and ridiculed, you haven’t been following F1 long enough. It’s brutal.

[Siao]

Wills2 said:

Siao said:

Wills2 said:

maz8062 said:

Wills2 said:

Poor Lewis he's such a figure of fun in the paddock.

7 WDCs
103 Wins
197 Podiums
104 Poles
4650 points

Joining Ferrari for 2025 with hundreds of £ millions in the bank and more to come, where did it all go wrong...

LH will not be a figure of fun provided he times his exit to leave on a high. This really isn’t rocket science nor is it questioning his hall of fame position in F1. My point is that announcing the move to Ferrari at the beginning of the season was/is a dumb move and risks all manner of ridicule to come his way over the next 20 races. A lot of you disagree as some disagreed when I forecasted the same for Vettel and Ricci, but that is fine as no one on the internet is ever right.

My opinion still stands and I’m nigh on certain that unless LH turns this around quickly he’ll be in for a very rough time over the coming next 6/7 months.

Well it's your opinion and you're welcome to it, but I'm struggling to attach your minestrone of words to reality.

I also think that your post is slightly wrong, as I don't think anyone in the paddock is making fun of Lewis because of what he has achieved already, it is pointless to list his CV. I do think, however, that people that question this move are thinking the only unpredictable factor here; Ferrari. The team that has a race strategy drawn by toddlers and sometimes operates in ways fitting a Benny Hill episode...

Obviously Lewis has nothing to lose with this move, he gets paid mega bucks and goes to the most historic team in the world. I'd love it if Lewis went to Ferrari and got the team organised. It would be a win-win obviously, and more so for the sport if Lewis gets his hands in a car capable of challenging for wins. So here's to hoping!

The premise that anyone in that paddock is making fun of Hamilton is absurd, making fun? It's just bloody weird to think such a thing, why would anyone and for what reason, he's had one of the greatest careers and is now off to what many people think is the greatest team for a huge sum of money, he has lived the F1 dream and continues to...apart from Max there isn't one driver that wouldn't take that seat and wage yet apparently people are making fun of him...FFS

Nowt as queer as folk as say.

Easy mate, no need to get upset, it was your post actually. It said "Poor Lewis he's such a figure of fun in the paddock.", clearly sarcastic I bet. My post should have possibly said "as I don't think anyone in the paddock is making fun of Lewis because of what he has achieved already, if at all". Just that, I didn't mean that people make actual fun of him, just replied with the original post in mind. If people would make fun of something, it wouldn't be his past achievements; just his decision to go to Ferrari (for the reason I cited). I thought it was quite obvious, but if not, please accept my explanation above.

[PhilAsia]

maz8062 said:

entropy said:

maz8062 said:

I’ve never seen a WDC suffer the ignominy of losing convincingly to a young whipper snapper and then making the switch to a new team and recovering form, especially in their twilight years. (Vettel/Ricci and Alonso/LH was not twilight years for the WDC’s involved) It’ll take an almighty effort which LH has in him for sure, but history or my history watching F1 would say otherwise.

Thus, for me, I think LH made a mistake in announcing the move this early. It’ll be a distraction. It is a distraction. It’ll mean that the team focuses on GR, the “team leader.” It’ll mean that some will question Ferrari’s investment in what may appear to be a washed up driver. Therefore unless he can turn his form around, Merc have an interest in seeing him performing, it will get harder and more toxic as the season progresses.

It's not like LH's powers have waned to Ricciardo proportions, has it?

There's no right way with announcing movements away from a team

Announce later the speculation over his Merc/F1 future still continues in the intervening time.

There's clearly no 2024 performance clause so Lewis is free to do as he please.

Someone suggested 2024 as a year out. That is totally unprofessional IMO. You take sabbatical because you've upset the management to the extent of being kicked out or waning desire and retirement.

I think he has done the right thing and being respectful to Merc and Sainz (hopefully less worry than if it was announced in the summer) and probably other (business?) reasons we are not privy to.

A lot of folk don’t understand how these things work. You’re looking forward and backwards rather than concentrating on today. Out of the races so far he’s been out-qualified 3-1. Races 3-0. He has 10 points to GR’s 24 (Max has 77) He’s flailing. If he is no longer the future of the team as he’s off somewhere else and if his performances continue in this vein, how long will it take before commentators will start asking if/when he’ll be dropped. There is so much at stake, LH has to deliver today because reputations of powerful people are at stake, bonuses, prize money etc. etc.

Yes he has done the right thing for himself but what about Merc? Has he done the right thing for them and how will this pan out for the next 20 races. Honestly if you think LH can continue with this form for the next 20 races without getting lambasted and ridiculed, you haven’t been following F1 long enough. It’s brutal.

I believe I am right in saying Lewis stated that he took some damage to the front wing early in the race. That damage caused his car to understeer and so he decided to play the team game and let Russell through. The understeer was not dialled out until the last (3rd) pit stop, when Lewis then closed on George.

If he had no understeer he probably would have finished ahead of Russell.

As to the rest of your post, I find it quite squealy.

[nickfrog]

maz8062 said:

A lot of folk don’t understand how these things work. .

Unlike you who has been watching it for many years?

[maz8062]

nickfrog said:

maz8062 said:

A lot of folk don’t understand how these things work. .

Unlike you who has been watching it for many years?

You can’t help yourself but be feisty with strangers on the internet. I don’t see you nor do I know you, so why do you allow written words to alter your mood. I don’t.

[entropy]

maz8062 said:

Yes he has done the right thing for himself but what about Merc? Has he done the right thing for them and how will this pan out for the next 20 races. Honestly if you think LH can continue with this form for the next 20 races without getting lambasted and ridiculed, you haven’t been following F1 long enough. It’s brutal.

This is why Toto offered Lewis short contracts; Lewis aging and diminishing performance but to what extent? Toto knew what Merc were letting themselves in for. If it bothers you so much then Toto is as much to blame - why the need to re-sign Lewis? The here and now is not always indicative of the future.

[NRS]

RichB said:

NRS said:

<clip> It's interesting the two years the car is worst is when he's not really matching Russell...

It's only one season - 2021/22 that Russell has beaten Hamilton.

Meaning so far this season, the points scored is the worst in over a decade for the time in the season. As I said I think that likely has some impact on his dedication, not to mention the Ferrari thing meaning Mercedes will be more careful what they share with him. From memory Hamilton has tended to switch off a bit once championships are won too.

[nickfrog]

maz8062 said:

nickfrog said:

maz8062 said:

A lot of folk don’t understand how these things work. .

Unlike you who has been watching it for many years?

You can’t help yourself but be feisty with strangers on the internet. I don’t see you nor do I know you, so why do you allow written words to alter your mood. I don’t.

I don't either. Who are you to tell people others don't understand these things? Perhaps they do, far better than you. And some even from the inside.

Simply accept that others like me don't agree with your predictions. That doesn't necessarily mean they don't understand.

[maz8062]

nickfrog said:

maz8062 said:

nickfrog said:

maz8062 said:

A lot of folk don’t understand how these things work. .

Unlike you who has been watching it for many years?

You can’t help yourself but be feisty with strangers on the internet. I don’t see you nor do I know you, so why do you allow written words to alter your mood. I don’t.

I don't either. Who are you to tell people others don't understand these things? Perhaps they do, far better than you. And some even from the inside.

Simply accept that others like me don't agree with your predictions. That doesn't necessarily mean they don't understand.

Here we go; shouting again at strangers on the internet. Getting hurt by written words. You should understand that when you shout people often can’t hear you.

[nickfrog]

maz8062 said:

nickfrog said:

maz8062 said:

nickfrog said:

maz8062 said:

A lot of folk don’t understand how these things work. .

Unlike you who has been watching it for many years?

You can’t help yourself but be feisty with strangers on the internet. I don’t see you nor do I know you, so why do you allow written words to alter your mood. I don’t.

I don't either. Who are you to tell people others don't understand these things? Perhaps they do, far better than you. And some even from the inside.

Simply accept that others like me don't agree with your predictions. That doesn't necessarily mean they don't understand.

Here we go; shouting again at strangers on the internet. Getting hurt by written words. You should understand that when you shout people often can’t hear you.

Not shouting nor getting hurt. You have invented that

All I calmly said is that others may think differently to you and that you might not be in the position of authority that you think.

You do sound shouty and hurt so perhaps you're simply projecting.

[MarkwG]

maz8062 said:

MarkwG said:

You've acknowledged it's just your opinion then: you've also offered no evidence anyone else is stating that, compared to the majority on here who seem to think that's just you. Incidentally, no-one I know or read, or who's opinion holds any value, says Vettel or Ricciardo are figures of fun either. The last person I can recall who earned that accolade was Roman Grojean, & he grew out of it years ago. You admit to watching F1 since 2007 - my sons been watching longer than that, & whilst acknowledging since 2021 Hamilton has had a rough ride, doesn't see that as tarnishing him at all: if anything, he's grown in admiration for a driver who hasn't walked away, as per Nico Rosberg, or descended into petulance, as Vettel tended to

Edited by MarkwG on Wednesday 10th April 10:09

Figure of fun is subjective. To me, commentators calling for Lawson to replace Ricci part way through the season is disrespectful to Ricci. Poking fun. Likewise LH having to respond to endless questions about his form and the Ferrari performance against the Merc is, in my view, poking fun.

I’ve been watching F1 since the early 80’s when Piquet was driving a Brabham, Senna a Toleman etc. 40 years of watching F1. In all that time I’ve never seen a WDC suffer the ignominy of losing convincingly to a young whipper snapper and then making the switch to a new team and recovering form, especially in their twilight years. (Vettel/Ricci and Alonso/LH was not twilight years for the WDC’s involved) It’ll take an almighty effort which LH has in him for sure, but history or my history watching F1 would say otherwise.

Thus, for me, I think LH made a mistake in announcing the move this early. It’ll be a distraction. It is a distraction. It’ll mean that the team focuses on GR, the “team leader.” It’ll mean that some will question Ferrari’s investment in what may appear to be a washed up driver. Therefore unless he can turn his form around, Merc have an interest in seeing him performing, it will get harder and more toxic as the season progresses.

The phrase "poking fun" is not about subjectivity, it has a meaning - to ridicule, or tease. Journalists & others suggesting it's time for one driver to replace another is just creating or reporting a story, which is their job: they're not ridiculing per se. They ask the same questions of every driver, Hamilton's no different from them. The only driver not getting asked is Verstappen.

I'm not remotely interested in social media clowns, nor is anyone else with any common sense. No-one with any credibility is seriously suggesting Hamilton should be swapped because he's not performing, as they are about Ricciardo: if anything, they're suggesting he'd have been better off moving this year, because the Mercedes is still underperforming, whereas the Ferrari is performing above expectation. Whether he made the wrong choice announcing his move at the start of the season is subjective, perhaps. I think he's been honest: there are many examples of drivers agreeing terms long before they transfer across, al least all parties are clear where they stand. If Mercedes prioritise Russell over Hamilton, that's up to them. Historically, they've not made that decision until there's a clear championship contender in evidence. Until then, the focus is on maximum points for the team, irrespective of which car is leading. I would expect that to be the same this season.

[maz8062]

MarkwG said:

The phrase "poking fun" is not about subjectivity, it has a meaning - to ridicule, or tease. Journalists & others suggesting it's time for one driver to replace another is just creating or reporting a story, which is their job: they're not ridiculing per se. They ask the same questions of every driver, Hamilton's no different from them. The only driver not getting asked is Verstappen.

I'm not remotely interested in social media clowns, nor is anyone else with any common sense. No-one with any credibility is seriously suggesting Hamilton should be swapped because he's not performing, as they are about Ricciardo: if anything, they're suggesting he'd have been better off moving this year, because the Mercedes is still underperforming, whereas the Ferrari is performing above expectation. Whether he made the wrong choice announcing his move at the start of the season is subjective, perhaps. I think he's been honest: there are many examples of drivers agreeing terms long before they transfer across, al least all parties are clear where they stand. If Mercedes prioritise Russell over Hamilton, that's up to them. Historically, they've not made that decision until there's a clear championship contender in evidence. Until then, the focus is on maximum points for the team, irrespective of which car is leading. I would expect that to be the same this season.

Fair enough, but what do you think Toto means in the quotes below:

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/sport/motorsports/george...

A 7 x WDC “testing” - if that’s not ridicule I don’t know what is.

[paulguitar]

maz8062 said:

Fair enough, but what do you think Toto means in the quotes below:

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/sport/motorsports/george...

A 7 x WDC “testing” - if that’s not ridicule I don’t know what is.

That doesn't seem to be saying anything like you think it does. there is nothing even remotely related to 'ridicule' there.


You need to get outside, take a walk, or something.

[maz8062]

paulguitar said:

maz8062 said:

Fair enough, but what do you think Toto means in the quotes below:

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/sport/motorsports/george...

A 7 x WDC “testing” - if that’s not ridicule I don’t know what is.

That doesn't seem to be saying anything like you think it does. there is nothing even remotely related to 'ridicule' there.


You need to get outside, take a walk, or something.

What’s wrong with you? Why can’t you converse in a civil way? Why do you have to get personal. If you disagree with me argue or ignore me, but there really is no point in playground antics as it reflects on you.

[MarkwG]

maz8062 said:

MarkwG said:

The phrase "poking fun" is not about subjectivity, it has a meaning - to ridicule, or tease. Journalists & others suggesting it's time for one driver to replace another is just creating or reporting a story, which is their job: they're not ridiculing per se. They ask the same questions of every driver, Hamilton's no different from them. The only driver not getting asked is Verstappen.

I'm not remotely interested in social media clowns, nor is anyone else with any common sense. No-one with any credibility is seriously suggesting Hamilton should be swapped because he's not performing, as they are about Ricciardo: if anything, they're suggesting he'd have been better off moving this year, because the Mercedes is still underperforming, whereas the Ferrari is performing above expectation. Whether he made the wrong choice announcing his move at the start of the season is subjective, perhaps. I think he's been honest: there are many examples of drivers agreeing terms long before they transfer across, al least all parties are clear where they stand. If Mercedes prioritise Russell over Hamilton, that's up to them. Historically, they've not made that decision until there's a clear championship contender in evidence. Until then, the focus is on maximum points for the team, irrespective of which car is leading. I would expect that to be the same this season.

Fair enough, but what do you think Toto means in the quotes below:

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/sport/motorsports/george...

A 7 x WDC “testing” - if that’s not ridicule I don’t know what is.

Of course it's not "ridicule" - he's asked to explain the decision, so he explained it. Every race session is also a testing session. If you think that stops on race weekends, you've not been really watching for the length of time you suggest.

[MustangGT]

maz8062 said:

F

A 7 x WDC “testing” - if that’s not ridicule I don’t know what is.

I have to agree with you, you do not know what ridicule is.

Edited by MustangGT on Wednesday 10th April 17:41

[paulguitar]

maz8062 said:

What’s wrong with you? Why can’t you converse in a civil way? Why do you have to get personal. If you disagree with me argue or ignore me, but there really is no point in playground antics as it reflects on you.

Respectfully, you appear to have lost your mind a bit, when it comes to Lewis Hamilton, for whatever reason. Talk of 'ridicule' and being 'laughed at' is bizarre behaviour, and that link you're provided contains absolutely nothing linked to ridicule, and yet for you, 'if that’s not ridicule I don’t know what is'.

That's why I suggested a walk, some air. I'm half kidding, but whatever is going on with you is illogical and a bit obsessive.

[Purosangue]

maz8062 said:

entropy said:

maz8062 said:

I’ve never seen a WDC suffer the ignominy of losing convincingly to a young whipper snapper and then making the switch to a new team and recovering form, especially in their twilight years. (Vettel/Ricci and Alonso/LH was not twilight years for the WDC’s involved) It’ll take an almighty effort which LH has in him for sure, but history or my history watching F1 would say otherwise.

Thus, for me, I think LH made a mistake in announcing the move this early. It’ll be a distraction. It is a distraction. It’ll mean that the team focuses on GR, the “team leader.” It’ll mean that some will question Ferrari’s investment in what may appear to be a washed up driver. Therefore unless he can turn his form around, Merc have an interest in seeing him performing, it will get harder and more toxic as the season progresses.

It's not like LH's powers have waned to Ricciardo proportions, has it?

There's no right way with announcing movements away from a team

Announce later the speculation over his Merc/F1 future still continues in the intervening time.

There's clearly no 2024 performance clause so Lewis is free to do as he please.

Someone suggested 2024 as a year out. That is totally unprofessional IMO. You take sabbatical because you've upset the management to the extent of being kicked out or waning desire and retirement.

I think he has done the right thing and being respectful to Merc and Sainz (hopefully less worry than if it was announced in the summer) and probably other (business?) reasons we are not privy to.

A lot of folk don’t understand how these things work. You’re looking forward and backwards rather than concentrating on today. Out of the races so far he’s been out-qualified 3-1. Races 3-0. He has 10 points to GR’s 24 (Max has 77) He’s flailing. If he is no longer the future of the team as he’s off somewhere else and if his performances continue in this vein, how long will it take before commentators will start asking if/when he’ll be dropped. There is so much at stake, LH has to deliver today because reputations of powerful people are at stake, bonuses, prize money etc. etc.

Yes he has done the right thing for himself but what about Merc? Has he done the right thing for them and how will this pan out for the next 20 races. Honestly if you think LH can continue with this form for the next 20 races without getting lambasted and ridiculed, you haven’t been following F1 long enough. It’s brutal.

from a chap who says ...........I have been watching F1 from the 1980s .............then in the next breath , ive really only been following since 2007 ?
So what is it you turned on the tv in the 80s watched a bit of F1 , got bored then in 2007 you had a F1 epiphany and are now telling everyone

"A lot of folk don’t understand how these things work " why have i got a mental picture of you sat in a pub , with a flat cap , and a cardigan

[maz8062]

MustangGT said:

maz8062 said:

F

A 7 x WDC “testing” - if that’s not ridicule I don’t know what is.

I have to agree with you, you do not know what ridicule is.

Can you imagine Alonso being asked to “test” and give way to Lance stroll to attack the cars ahead for points? Can you imagine it, when F1 drivers live to win first, beat their team mate second? No of course not, but when it comes to LH testing while his team mate grabs the points to extend his lead it is fair game. We have different definitions of ridicule but I’m happy with mine, thanks.

[nickfrog]

maz, when did you last drive a single seater with chronic understeer due to damage? Honest question.