2021 F1 cars thread

2021 F1 cars thread

Author
Discussion

andburg

4,755 posts

135 months

Thursday 4th March
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El stovey said:
RichB said:
It's interesting because I was a glider pilot for 30 years and the top competition chaps would polish the wings of their gliders to the highest possible shine to ensure a smooth airflow over the wing. Indeed even dead flies on the leading edge caused a degradation in the performance of the wing because any imperfection causes the airflow to detach. That's counter to the concept that the slightly rough surface of matt paint causes the airflow to stay attached. Odd.
I think it depends on the speed and size of molecules the surface is operating in and what you’re trying to achieve.

Some aquatic animals have rougher skins like the now banned patterns on Olympic swimming body suits etc.

Aircraft designers looked and tested rough surfaces on wings but it didn’t work out or the benefit wasn’t worth the cost.
Could also be down to how long that extra performance is there for, the acclimation of dirt will probably degrade performance and I'd expect a glossy surface to stay clean longer. An F1 car needs to have absolute peak performance for maybe 1.5hrs, after that i will be stripped down and cleaned, a plane/glider needs to retain performance for month (google suggests washes are every 6 months for passenger jets)

DanielSan

16,239 posts

133 months

Thursday 4th March
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I actually quite like the side view of the Haas livery, it's a bit retro. Almost like a modern day version of this, only with more corrupt backing.

Sandpit Steve

3,043 posts

40 months

Thursday 4th March
quotequote all
RichB said:
It's interesting because I was a glider pilot for 30 years and the top competition chaps would polish the wings of their gliders to the highest possible shine to ensure a smooth airflow over the wing. Indeed even dead flies on the leading edge caused a degradation in the performance of the wing because any imperfection causes the airflow to detach. That's counter to the concept that the slightly rough surface of matt paint causes the airflow to stay attached. Odd.
I’ve been crew for one of those guys at national competitions, and you get to spend a *lot* of time with a bottle of polish in your hand!

A few years back, some of them experimented with plastic devices that would run down the wing and remove the dead flies in flight - although they just as often got stuck and added to the drag.

I’m assuming the matt paint helps by deliberately not keeping the flow laminar in particular areas of the car.

There was a great picture of Lewis’s car after the Turkish race last year, with the car covered in dirt from a wet/dry race you could see the airflow quite clearly. Rival teams might have learned something from the images.

Edited by Sandpit Steve on Thursday 4th March 11:13

mw88

260 posts

77 months

Thursday 4th March
quotequote all
andburg said:
I wonder what the HAAS will actually look like, its to my eyes a 2020 car in 2021 livery. The rear diffuser strakes appear to be too long and the floor doesnt seem to have the '21 cutout at the rear.
I think they would have done the bare minimum to get it legal for this year, with either focusing fully on 2022 or offloading the team to the Russians.

They're also having a hard time getting Ferrari personnel from Italy to start up their engines, so will only be fired up at the first test.

Sandpit Steve

3,043 posts

40 months

Thursday 4th March
quotequote all
mw88 said:
I think they would have done the bare minimum to get it legal for this year, with either focusing fully on 2022 or offloading the team to the Russians.

They're also having a hard time getting Ferrari personnel from Italy to start up their engines, so will only be fired up at the first test.
They’ve been mighty unlucky with the assembly of the car, a consequence of having a multi-location team. Usually they assemble the car at Dallara in Italy, who they contract to make the chassis, but this year with the same chassis as 2020, elected to build the car in the U.K. facility instead - but didn’t bank on the Ferrari PU engineers being unable to schedule a trip to the U.K. because of the pandemic quarantine measures in both countries.

So they’re all meeting in Bahrain, it could be as late as the first morning of the test that it gets fired up.

ajprice

20,560 posts

162 months

Thursday 4th March
quotequote all
2020 wide floor on the Haas, it is the new livery on a 2020 car.



They must have done something for the 2021 floor rules, even if it is cutting this floor down to size and hoping for the best. We'll see it in Bahrain.

Gareth1974

2,781 posts

105 months

Thursday 4th March
quotequote all
El stovey said:
RichB said:
It's interesting because I was a glider pilot for 30 years and the top competition chaps would polish the wings of their gliders to the highest possible shine to ensure a smooth airflow over the wing. Indeed even dead flies on the leading edge caused a degradation in the performance of the wing because any imperfection causes the airflow to detach. That's counter to the concept that the slightly rough surface of matt paint causes the airflow to stay attached. Odd.
I think it depends on the speed and size of molecules the surface is operating in and what you’re trying to achieve.

Some aquatic animals have rougher skins like the now banned patterns on Olympic swimming body suits etc.

Aircraft designers looked and tested rough surfaces on wings but it didn’t work out or the benefit wasn’t worth the cost.
A golf ball goes much further than a smooth ball, does the dimpled surface only have this effect on a spherical object?

RichB

45,199 posts

250 months

Thursday 4th March
quotequote all
andburg said:
Could also be down to how long that extra performance is there for, the acclimation of dirt will probably degrade performance and I'd expect a glossy surface to stay clean longer. An F1 car needs to have absolute peak performance for maybe 1.5hrs, after that i will be stripped down and cleaned, a plane/glider needs to retain performance for month (google suggests washes are every 6 months for passenger jets)
Gliders get meticulously cleaned after every single flight and polished every few months (or when there's no thermals to pass the time on a Sunday afternoon) wink

ch37

7,404 posts

187 months

Thursday 4th March
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ajprice said:
2020 wide floor on the Haas, it is the new livery on 2020 car.
I think Haas were the one ream that called it like it is, a livery launch.

ajprice

20,560 posts

162 months

Thursday 4th March
quotequote all
Haas photoshoppery with German colours for Mick Schumacher and BAR style split colours for Russian and German flags https://twitter.com/CharlieBass18/status/136743524...




andburg

4,755 posts

135 months

Thursday 4th March
quotequote all
RichB said:
liders get meticulously cleaned after every single flight and polished every few months (or when there's no thermals to pass the time on a Sunday afternoon) wink
my dad has thousands of hours in a glider, he used to bring it home and steal my portacable orbital to polish some of it

ajprice

20,560 posts

162 months

Thursday 4th March
quotequote all
mw88 said:
Does Russia's doping ban on World sports extend to not showing the flag?

Haas will probably claim it represents the American flag, or just the Uralkali colours laugh

The Alpine looks less shiny on track than the images
https://www.racefans.net/2021/03/03/first-pictures...

Edited by mw88 on Thursday 4th March 08:43
American flag is still there on this https://www.instagram.com/reel/CL_bNuBjbAF/?igshid...

In the photos of the whole car it's the 1&1 logo there.


Mark-C

3,414 posts

171 months

Thursday 4th March
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F1 advertising works ... at least I know who I'm going to buy my potash from!

slacker172

35 posts

117 months

Thursday 4th March
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I haven't read all 14 pages of the thread, so apologies is this is said already, but the Alpine Livery.............ouch hot mama..........now takes pride of place as wallpaper for me!!!

WelshPetrolhead

338 posts

101 months

Thursday 4th March
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In the images with the '1&1' logos, the American flag is located on the black strip at the bottom of the side pods under the HAAS lettering.

ChocolateFrog

12,715 posts

139 months

Thursday 4th March
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There really isn't a bad looking car among them this year.

LaurasOtherHalf

20,045 posts

162 months

Thursday 4th March
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ChocolateFrog said:
There really isn't a bad looking car among them this year.
I dunno, the McLaren is about as uninspiring as a bright orange race car can be for me.

RonaldMcDonaldAteMyCat

12,756 posts

61 months

Thursday 4th March
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Agree with that. it's an uninspiring paintjob.

El stovey

38,856 posts

229 months

Thursday 4th March
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ChocolateFrog said:
There really isn't a bad looking car among them this year.
I was thinking that,

Overall it’s possibly the best looking grid I can remember.

jsf

22,706 posts

202 months

Thursday 4th March
quotequote all
Sandpit Steve said:
There was a great picture of Lewis’s car after the Turkish race last year, with the car covered in dirt from a wet/dry race you could see the airflow quite clearly. Rival teams might have learned something from the images.
I use a wet race for flow vis and take pictures of it before i clean the car. It's quite interesting what you can learn. On the older cars, most of the rear wing does nothing, sometimes removing the airbox makes the car faster. Those high airbox cars were particularly st, when they were banned everyone went quicker. biggrin