Valtteri Bottas at Mercedes

[thegreenhell]

He was one fumbled pitstop away from being WDC, which must make it a pretty decent car.

[sparta6]

APontus said:

sparta6 said:

You need to re-check your data.
The Ferrari wasn't dominant until 2001.
Fact.

It was a race winning car that narrowly lost the championship with a B standard driver. It was at times the class car in 1999.

It won races, but was not a contender until 2000.
It became dominant in 2001 with developed bespoke tyres - well deserved too.

B Standard driver ? Clearly you never raced alongside Irvine

Comparing tenacious Irvine with sleepy Bottas is pretty funny. Bottas is about to get sacked

[APontus]

sparta6 said:

It won races, but was not a contender until 2000.

By how many points did Irvine lose the championship in 1999?

[TheDeuce]

Durzel said:

A team can't win the WDC with both drivers, so it's only natural - and pretty obvious - that there will come a point during the season, for all teams, where it is inevitable that one driver will have to take on a supporting role to the other one. Sadly for Bottas it is anticipated that he will take on that role before next years car has turned a wheel.

Anticipated, but not acted upon until one driver has a clear advantage that's worth backing.

[Siao]

APontus said:

sparta6 said:

You need to re-check your data.
The Ferrari wasn't dominant until 2001.
Fact.

It was a race winning car that narrowly lost the championship with a B standard driver. It was at times the class car in 1999.

By Irvine's own admission, they had stopped updates on the car after Schumacher got injured. A combination of Hakkinen binning it, Salo and Schumacher letting him through and some bad luck from McLaren meant that Irvine got a chance to be so close in the standings.

[sparta6]

APontus said:

sparta6 said:

It won races, but was not a contender until 2000.

By how many points did Irvine lose the championship in 1999?

Are you suggesting that Coulthard was a more fierce competitor than Irvine ?

[nickfrog]

sparta6 said:

You need to re-check your data.
The Ferrari wasn't dominant until 2001.
Fact.

I would call it an opinion. And then as it's yours, it doesn't have much in the way of credibility.

[Durzel]

TheDeuce said:

Durzel said:

A team can't win the WDC with both drivers, so it's only natural - and pretty obvious - that there will come a point during the season, for all teams, where it is inevitable that one driver will have to take on a supporting role to the other one. Sadly for Bottas it is anticipated that he will take on that role before next years car has turned a wheel.

Anticipated, but not acted upon until one driver has a clear advantage that's worth backing.

Indeed. It is a cold calculus. If Bottas somehow had the measure of Hamilton and got himself into basically an unassailable position, to all intents and purposes, then I would fully expect Mercedes to tell Hamilton he has to tow the line.

[sparta6]

Siao said:

By Irvine's own admission, they had stopped updates on the car after Schumacher got injured. A combination of Hakkinen binning it, Salo and Schumacher letting him through and some bad luck from McLaren meant that Irvine got a chance to be so close in the standings.

Some correct factual observation on PH.
Rare !
Eddie was tenacious.

[TheDeuce]

Durzel said:

TheDeuce said:

Durzel said:

A team can't win the WDC with both drivers, so it's only natural - and pretty obvious - that there will come a point during the season, for all teams, where it is inevitable that one driver will have to take on a supporting role to the other one. Sadly for Bottas it is anticipated that he will take on that role before next years car has turned a wheel.

Anticipated, but not acted upon until one driver has a clear advantage that's worth backing.

Indeed. It is a cold calculus. If Bottas somehow had the measure of Hamilton and got himself into basically an unassailable position, to all intents and purposes, then I would fully expect Mercedes to tell Hamilton he has to tow the line.

Yep. And both drivers are on record agreeing with that principle so they'd pretty much have to go along with it.

Also for the sake of the team, several hundred people, even as racing drivers they should ultimately want to support their teams good fortunes in that situation and play nicely.

[nickfrog]

sparta6 said:

Some correct factual observation on PH.
Rare !

Particularly when you post.

[sparta6]

nickfrog said:

sparta6 said:

You need to re-check your data.
The Ferrari wasn't dominant until 2001.
Fact.

I would call it an opinion. And then as it's yours, it doesn't have much in the way of credibility.

The general opinion on PH is that Hamilton is the greatest ever and it has nothing to do with Mercedes dominance for 7 years

Rosberg could've stolen his WDC in the Williams

[sparta6]

nickfrog said:

Particularly when you post.

I see you remain obsessed with me

[Muzzer79]

APontus said:

sparta6 said:

It won races, but was not a contender until 2000.

By how many points did Irvine lose the championship in 1999?

And let's remember which team won the constructor's championship in 1999.....

[Siao]

Muzzer79 said:

APontus said:

sparta6 said:

It won races, but was not a contender until 2000.

By how many points did Irvine lose the championship in 1999?

And let's remember which team won the constructor's championship in 1999.....

The team that didn't have 12 retirements...

[nickfrog]

sparta6 said:

nickfrog said:

Particularly when you post.

I see you remain obsessed with me

I wouldn't say obsessed, but I think you're an invaluable part of PH from a comedy value POV and that should be recognised.

[paulguitar]

sparta6 said:

The general opinion on PH is that Hamilton is the greatest ever and it has nothing to do with Mercedes dominance for 7 years

The first part possibly, the rest inaccurate because Mercedes has not been dominant for 7 years.

Assume you weren't watching/born in 2018, 2019, and not seen the races in 2021?

[nickfrog]

sparta6 said:

The general opinion on PH is that Hamilton is the greatest ever and it has nothing to do with Mercedes dominance for 7 years

That's all in your head and it does explain your stance on the basis that you judge all others by the standards of your own binary views.

[thegreenhell]

Siao said:

Muzzer79 said:

APontus said:

sparta6 said:

It won races, but was not a contender until 2000.

By how many points did Irvine lose the championship in 1999?

And let's remember which team won the constructor's championship in 1999.....

The team that didn't have 12 retirements...

The team whose lead driver missed seven races through injury, and his substitute only scored in two races.

[Siao]

paulguitar said:

sparta6 said:

The general opinion on PH is that Hamilton is the greatest ever and it has nothing to do with Mercedes dominance for 7 years

The first part possibly, the rest inaccurate because Mercedes has not been dominant for 7 years.

Assume you weren't watching/born in 2018, 2019, and not seen the races in 2021?

I guess that's a little bit like when people talk about the Ferrari dominance '00-'04, forgetting '03. Or RB '10-'13, forgetting '12.