Discussion
Tricuspid said:
mat205125 said:
Why've you not included Croft, Pinkham, Brookes, Kravitz, & Lazenby into your list of presenters to compare Schiff to?
Is it because it turns your argument and justification into an utter load of garbage?
No, it's because they are irrelevant to the point as they are not ex racing drivers. As I mentioned. Keep up at the back there!Is it because it turns your argument and justification into an utter load of garbage?
Why is it irrelevant to compare Schiff to Croft, Pinkham, Brookes, Kravitz, & Lazenby, as they are not ex racing drivers, however it is relevant to compare Schiff to Button, DiResta, Brundle etc, because they are ex racing drivers??
..... and we're not comparing Pinkham & Brookes to the ex racing drivers, as they are not ex racing drivers themselves, so cannot be compared???
Tricuspid said:
Muzzer79 said:
Patrick - she's the only American.
Brundle - he is the only one born in the 1950s
Rosberg - is the only German
Hill - is the only one who has raced bikes
Am I doing this right?
Good effort, but you missed a few ... Di Resta is the only one to have won at DTM, ditto Davidson in WEC, Herbert is the only one to have done a full season of BTCC. Brundle - he is the only one born in the 1950s
Rosberg - is the only German
Hill - is the only one who has raced bikes
Am I doing this right?
He also, of course, won Le Mans in a Group C Jaguar and won the World Sportscar Championship (the era equivalent of WEC) in 1988....
Edited by Muzzer79 on Tuesday 21st June 16:59
mat205125 said:
Clarify for all of us slow coaches who can't see any consistency in the point you're failing to make clearly.
Why is it irrelevant to compare Schiff to Croft, Pinkham, Brookes, Kravitz, & Lazenby, as they are not ex racing drivers, however it is relevant to compare Schiff to Button, DiResta, Brundle etc, because they are ex racing drivers??
..... and we're not comparing Pinkham & Brookes to the ex racing drivers, as they are not ex racing drivers themselves, so cannot be compared???
Because Sky lists her as "ex racing driver" and as an "expert race analyst". Because her credentials for being there are based on being an "ex racing driver". Because doing that in a lineup that consists of three F1 World Champions is a bit of a joke, like putting me on the Bakeoff programme as an expert analyst because I like scones. Why is it irrelevant to compare Schiff to Croft, Pinkham, Brookes, Kravitz, & Lazenby, as they are not ex racing drivers, however it is relevant to compare Schiff to Button, DiResta, Brundle etc, because they are ex racing drivers??
..... and we're not comparing Pinkham & Brookes to the ex racing drivers, as they are not ex racing drivers themselves, so cannot be compared???
The bottom line is: she's got very little race experience, so not credible as an expert alongside Brundle & co (surely we can at least agree on that?). She's got very little tv experience and nowhere near the quality of Lazenby, Pinkham, Kravitz & co. She tries to do both roles without much success in my opinion, but it's just my opinion and other people like her so fair enough.
The only way to judge a presenter is how well he or she presents. Are they entertaining, informative, and clear in what they say? Are they inclusive? Do they gain the confidence of those they interview? Are they worth listening to and watching?
Driver or not is immaterial.
The role of commentators is different.
Driver or not is immaterial.
The role of commentators is different.
Tricuspid said:
The bottom line is: she's got very little race experience, so not credible as an expert alongside Brundle & co (surely we can at least agree on that?). She's got very little tv experience and nowhere near the quality of Lazenby, Pinkham, Kravitz & co. She tries to do both roles without much success in my opinion, but it's just my opinion and other people like her so fair enough.
Wikipedia shows her as having done 48 races (presumably there was karting before that). Kimi Raikkonen had only done 23 races before starting as a F1 driver let alone pundit.
carl_w said:
Tricuspid said:
The bottom line is: she's got very little race experience, so not credible as an expert alongside Brundle & co (surely we can at least agree on that?). She's got very little tv experience and nowhere near the quality of Lazenby, Pinkham, Kravitz & co. She tries to do both roles without much success in my opinion, but it's just my opinion and other people like her so fair enough.
Wikipedia shows her as having done 48 races (presumably there was karting before that). Kimi Raikkonen had only done 23 races before starting as a F1 driver let alone pundit.cc3 said:
Seems her only success was racing a Renault Clio in China so hardly the pinnacle of motor racing. Must be thousands of people across the world who have had success at a higher and more challenging level of racing than that
That was 10 races, so even if you take those off still 50% more than Raikkonencarl_w said:
Tricuspid said:
The bottom line is: she's got very little race experience, so not credible as an expert alongside Brundle & co (surely we can at least agree on that?). She's got very little tv experience and nowhere near the quality of Lazenby, Pinkham, Kravitz & co. She tries to do both roles without much success in my opinion, but it's just my opinion and other people like her so fair enough.
Wikipedia shows her as having done 48 races (presumably there was karting before that). Kimi Raikkonen had only done 23 races before starting as a F1 driver let alone pundit.Muzzer79 said:
Tricuspid said:
Muzzer79 said:
Patrick - she's the only American.
Brundle - he is the only one born in the 1950s
Rosberg - is the only German
Hill - is the only one who has raced bikes
Am I doing this right?
Good effort, but you missed a few ... Di Resta is the only one to have won at DTM, ditto Davidson in WEC, Herbert is the only one to have done a full season of BTCC. Brundle - he is the only one born in the 1950s
Rosberg - is the only German
Hill - is the only one who has raced bikes
Am I doing this right?
He also, of course, won Le Mans in a Group C Jaguar and won the World Sportscar Championship (the era equivalent of WEC) in 1988....
Edited by Muzzer79 on Tuesday 21st June 16:59
Tricuspid said:
Muzzer79 said:
Tricuspid said:
Muzzer79 said:
Patrick - she's the only American.
Brundle - he is the only one born in the 1950s
Rosberg - is the only German
Hill - is the only one who has raced bikes
Am I doing this right?
Good effort, but you missed a few ... Di Resta is the only one to have won at DTM, ditto Davidson in WEC, Herbert is the only one to have done a full season of BTCC. Brundle - he is the only one born in the 1950s
Rosberg - is the only German
Hill - is the only one who has raced bikes
Am I doing this right?
He also, of course, won Le Mans in a Group C Jaguar and won the World Sportscar Championship (the era equivalent of WEC) in 1988....
Edited by Muzzer79 on Tuesday 21st June 16:59
TobyTR said:
heebeegeetee said:
Thanks for the link, I enjoyed that. I was surprised at earlier criticism of Nico, I think he's an excellent pundit, possibly the best of them, and I enjoy his other YouTube stuff too.
And I thought Naomi was excellent too, and yes, I think it's great to have someone young, fresh, and who can appeal to a wider audience.
Having a stream of older white males isn't going to do that imo.
Why? What's skin colour got to do with it? Some might say that's... Racist.And I thought Naomi was excellent too, and yes, I think it's great to have someone young, fresh, and who can appeal to a wider audience.
Having a stream of older white males isn't going to do that imo.
Tricuspid said:
carl_w said:
Tricuspid said:
The bottom line is: she's got very little race experience, so not credible as an expert alongside Brundle & co (surely we can at least agree on that?). She's got very little tv experience and nowhere near the quality of Lazenby, Pinkham, Kravitz & co. She tries to do both roles without much success in my opinion, but it's just my opinion and other people like her so fair enough.
Wikipedia shows her as having done 48 races (presumably there was karting before that). Kimi Raikkonen had only done 23 races before starting as a F1 driver let alone pundit.A better comparison would be taking a white NCAA college basketball player of average ability, who's not good enough to play in the NBA, but giving them an expert analyst role because producers want some added diversity on tv. Obviously being at that level they would make a better expert analyst than your average armchair warrior, but it would raise many eyebrows on why they got the job over other ex-NBA players in the first place, or in this case, ex-F1 drivers.
TobyTR said:
TobyTR said:
heebeegeetee said:
Thanks for the link, I enjoyed that. I was surprised at earlier criticism of Nico, I think he's an excellent pundit, possibly the best of them, and I enjoy his other YouTube stuff too.
And I thought Naomi was excellent too, and yes, I think it's great to have someone young, fresh, and who can appeal to a wider audience.
Having a stream of older white males isn't going to do that imo.
Why? What's skin colour got to do with it? Some might say that's... Racist.And I thought Naomi was excellent too, and yes, I think it's great to have someone young, fresh, and who can appeal to a wider audience.
Having a stream of older white males isn't going to do that imo.
TobyTR said:
heebeegeetee said:
TobyTR said:
Why? What's skin colour got to do with it? Some might say that's... Racist.
I can take it... but one thing that I think is indisputable, is that appearance matters. As in, appealing to a wider audience.
I can't see what's box ticking about that.
Tricuspid said:
Dingu said:
Fact is that nobody whinging about her inexperience in here knows enough about F1 or racing for it to matter.
Translation: everyone who doesn’t agree with me is wrongI’m not sure what you really want. Naomi isn’t steeped in F1 experience so what’s she there for. Nico is an F1 champion, has inside knowledge and doesn’t mince he words but, damn, he’s not good enough either. Danica knows nothing about F1, is clearly winging it but out of the 3 Danica is good for the show. That’s how you various points boil down to me… seems you’re prepared to forgive Danica being total out of her depth re F1 and her contribution because of her racing experience/career and 1 IndyCar win… hmmm
Wouldn’t it be simpler to make a cuppa, grab a beer or do something else while Naomi is on screen? I can listen to Horner when he’s on so I just mute until he’s done.
HighwayStar said:
Sounds very much that… Tricuspid is right and everyone is wrong. Of course you’re entitled to your opinion but she’s clearly not going to be removed.
I would referred the honourable gentleman to my earlier post ..."She tries to do both roles without much success in my opinion, but it's just my opinion and other people like her so fair enough."
HighwayStar said:
Sky are backing her after the trolling she has received. There are only a few PHers, yes small sample size I know, who, for various reasons, don’t like/appreciate her. In the bigger picture most viewers don’t care.
I’m not sure what you really want. Naomi isn’t steeped in F1 experience so what’s she there for. Nico is an F1 champion, has inside knowledge and doesn’t mince he words but, damn, he’s not good enough either. Danica knows nothing about F1, is clearly winging it but out of the 3 Danica is good for the show. That’s how you various points boil down to me… seems you’re prepared to forgive Danica being total out of her depth re F1 and her contribution because of her racing experience/career and 1 IndyCar win… hmmm
Wouldn’t it be simpler to make a cuppa, grab a beer or do something else while Naomi is on screen? I can listen to Horner when he’s on so I just mute until he’s done.
Exactly. What do I want? Nothing, it's just a conversation like you would have in a pub. That's all. Exchange of views for the information and entertainment of all concerned. Of no consequence whatsoever beyond that. I don't expect Sky to sack her based on the ramblings of a few on Pistonheads. What is interesting is the way everything seems to be either right or wrong; you either love her or you're a racist, there doesn't seem to be any middle ground. That's not healthy, but it does seem to reflect the wider society (see also Brexit, Trump, Scottish Independence et al.)I’m not sure what you really want. Naomi isn’t steeped in F1 experience so what’s she there for. Nico is an F1 champion, has inside knowledge and doesn’t mince he words but, damn, he’s not good enough either. Danica knows nothing about F1, is clearly winging it but out of the 3 Danica is good for the show. That’s how you various points boil down to me… seems you’re prepared to forgive Danica being total out of her depth re F1 and her contribution because of her racing experience/career and 1 IndyCar win… hmmm
Wouldn’t it be simpler to make a cuppa, grab a beer or do something else while Naomi is on screen? I can listen to Horner when he’s on so I just mute until he’s done.
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