2021 Cost Cap Breaches

[PhilAsia]

HighwayStar said:

deadslow said:

PhilAsia said:

Evercross said:

Nothing to see here. Move along please.

There certainly was the cheating by Red Bull to see here. It became very apparent.

What are you saying?

Let's say she did release the details, would you have rather they had been covered up? If you are, that speaks more about your mindset than hers.

If she was responsible, why did she release the details if the FIA were going to be transparent anyway? What prompted her to release details that were going to be released anyway?

Maybe I am wrong, but if there is cheating I want to know about it...I do not like cheating by anyone.

there was no cheating. Glad Wolff's mole has been binned for the good of the sport.

Shame the manipulation of the rules at AD and cost cap were not ruled on strictly enough for the historical integrity and good of the sport. Masi meme is warranted as usual for the troll...

[PhilAsia]

NRS said:

deadslow said:

there was no cheating. Glad Wolff's mole has been binned for the good of the sport.

So what do you call breaking the rules?

Staying up past his 9pm bedtime?

[MadCaptainJack]

NRS said:

So what do you call breaking the rules?

We call it a breach of the rules. We don't call it cheating unless it was done deliberately and dishonestly. The FIA has made it crystal clear that "there is no accusation or evidence that RBR has sought at any time to act in bad faith, dishonestly or in a fraudulent manner, nor has it wilfully concealed any information".

Therefore, RBR didn't cheat.

We've already been through this multiple times. You, jasandjules, and PhilAsia are just trolling now.

Stop it.

[PhilAsia]

sociopath said:

PhilAsia said:

Evercross said:

Nothing to see here. Move along please.

There certainly was the cheating by Red Bull to see here. It became very apparent.

What are you saying?

Let's say she did release the details, would you have rather they had been covered up? If you are, that speaks more about your mindset than hers.

If she was responsible, why did she release the details if the FIA were going to be transparent anyway? What prompted her to release details that were going to be released anyway?

Maybe I am wrong, but if there is cheating I want to know about it...I do not like cheating by anyone.

let's not even mention Mercedes having the info to be able to have extra floor supports ready to go the day they were announced as a rule change.

Yes, it was one of the unfathomable marvels of the F1 2022 season. The major engineering miracle that came up with a length of metal fastened at two ends will be the most talked about game-changer for years to come.

[What The Deuces]

PhilAsia said:

sociopath said:

PhilAsia said:

Evercross said:

Nothing to see here. Move along please.

There certainly was the cheating by Red Bull to see here. It became very apparent.

What are you saying?

Let's say she did release the details, would you have rather they had been covered up? If you are, that speaks more about your mindset than hers.

If she was responsible, why did she release the details if the FIA were going to be transparent anyway? What prompted her to release details that were going to be released anyway?

Maybe I am wrong, but if there is cheating I want to know about it...I do not like cheating by anyone.

let's not even mention Mercedes having the info to be able to have extra floor supports ready to go the day they were announced as a rule change.

Yes, it was one of the unfathomable marvels of the F1 2022 season. The major engineering miracle that came up with a length of metal fastened at two ends will be the most talked about game-changer for years to come.

If you are ever in the position one day Phil, you'll finally understand that its not about what you've got, it's where to put it to make it work.




Merc were clearly briefed, the other teams are just as clever and they didn't have solutions ready.

[PhilAsia]

MadCaptainJack said:

NRS said:

So what do you call breaking the rules?

We call it a breach of the rules. We don't call it cheating unless it was done deliberately and dishonestly. The FIA has made it crystal clear that "there is no accusation or evidence that RBR has sought at any time to act in bad faith, dishonestly or in a fraudulent manner, nor has it wilfully concealed any information".

Therefore, RBR didn't cheat.

We've already been through this multiple times. You, jasandjules, and PhilAsia are just trolling now.

Stop it.

Glad you had inside knowledge that it was not deliberate. Take a look at Masi/AD/FIA decision for more of the same.

[PhilAsia]

What The Deuces said:

PhilAsia said:

sociopath said:

PhilAsia said:

Evercross said:

Nothing to see here. Move along please.

There certainly was the cheating by Red Bull to see here. It became very apparent.

What are you saying?

Let's say she did release the details, would you have rather they had been covered up? If you are, that speaks more about your mindset than hers.

If she was responsible, why did she release the details if the FIA were going to be transparent anyway? What prompted her to release details that were going to be released anyway?

Maybe I am wrong, but if there is cheating I want to know about it...I do not like cheating by anyone.

let's not even mention Mercedes having the info to be able to have extra floor supports ready to go the day they were announced as a rule change.

Yes, it was one of the unfathomable marvels of the F1 2022 season. The major engineering miracle that came up with a length of metal fastened at two ends will be the most talked about game-changer for years to come.

If you are ever in the position one day Phil, you'll finally understand that its not about what you've got, it's where to put it to make it work.

Merc were clearly briefed, the other teams are just as clever and they didn't have solutions ready.

Of course it is about understanding where to put it. They were studying the subject more than anyone and probably enough not to make an arse of it like some others do.....What The Deuces.

[Jasandjules]

MadCaptainJack said:

We call it a breach of the rules. We don't call it cheating unless it was done deliberately and dishonestly. The FIA has made it crystal clear that "there is no accusation or evidence that RBR has sought at any time to act in bad faith, dishonestly or in a fraudulent manner, nor has it wilfully concealed any information".

Therefore, RBR didn't cheat.

We've already been through this multiple times. You, jasandjules, and PhilAsia are just trolling now.

Stop it.

Not trolling - just noting the absurdity of your attempting to suggest the FIA is the bastion of truth and justice. I mean, I think some of us recall what happened last year and what the FIA did about it......

[TriumphStag3.0V8]

PhilAsia said:

Harry H said:

MustangGT said:

Okay, I think we can agree to call them prolific winners this year by cheating.

made that more accurate for you

...and last year


Max, 2021 WDC

Don't do that, it will upset deadslow very much. He hates being reminded that that team he support with all his heart are prolific cheats.

[rscott]

PhilAsia said:

What The Deuces said:

PhilAsia said:

sociopath said:

PhilAsia said:

Evercross said:

Nothing to see here. Move along please.

There certainly was the cheating by Red Bull to see here. It became very apparent.

What are you saying?

Let's say she did release the details, would you have rather they had been covered up? If you are, that speaks more about your mindset than hers.

If she was responsible, why did she release the details if the FIA were going to be transparent anyway? What prompted her to release details that were going to be released anyway?

Maybe I am wrong, but if there is cheating I want to know about it...I do not like cheating by anyone.

let's not even mention Mercedes having the info to be able to have extra floor supports ready to go the day they were announced as a rule change.

Yes, it was one of the unfathomable marvels of the F1 2022 season. The major engineering miracle that came up with a length of metal fastened at two ends will be the most talked about game-changer for years to come.

If you are ever in the position one day Phil, you'll finally understand that its not about what you've got, it's where to put it to make it work.

Merc were clearly briefed, the other teams are just as clever and they didn't have solutions ready.

Of course it is about understanding where to put it. They were studying the subject more than anyone and probably enough not to make an arse of it like some others do.....What The Deuces.

It's almost as if the team which had been asking FIA to make changes to address a problem with their car had gotten a quick fix ready, just in case FIA agreed.

[PhilAsia]

rscott said:

PhilAsia said:

What The Deuces said:

PhilAsia said:

sociopath said:

PhilAsia said:

Evercross said:

Nothing to see here. Move along please.

There certainly was the cheating by Red Bull to see here. It became very apparent.

What are you saying?

Let's say she did release the details, would you have rather they had been covered up? If you are, that speaks more about your mindset than hers.

If she was responsible, why did she release the details if the FIA were going to be transparent anyway? What prompted her to release details that were going to be released anyway?

Maybe I am wrong, but if there is cheating I want to know about it...I do not like cheating by anyone.

let's not even mention Mercedes having the info to be able to have extra floor supports ready to go the day they were announced as a rule change.

Yes, it was one of the unfathomable marvels of the F1 2022 season. The major engineering miracle that came up with a length of metal fastened at two ends will be the most talked about game-changer for years to come.

If you are ever in the position one day Phil, you'll finally understand that its not about what you've got, it's where to put it to make it work.

Merc were clearly briefed, the other teams are just as clever and they didn't have solutions ready.

Of course it is about understanding where to put it. They were studying the subject more than anyone and probably enough not to make an arse of it like some others do.....What The Deuces.

It's almost as if the team which had been asking FIA to make changes to address a problem with their car had gotten a quick fix ready, just in case FIA agreed.

Yes, I agree. How did they have the time to mine and smelt the metals and fabricate the metal rods and fittings. Then there were the measure twice and cut once time constraints.

It is all too rocket science to make sense...

[MustangGT]

MadCaptainJack said:

We call it a breach of the rules. We don't call it cheating unless it was done deliberately and dishonestly. The FIA has made it crystal clear that "there is no accusation or evidence that RBR has sought at any time to act in bad faith, dishonestly or in a fraudulent manner, nor has it wilfully concealed any information".

Therefore, RBR didn't cheat.

We've already been through this multiple times. You, jasandjules, and PhilAsia are just trolling now.

Stop it.

I see you still believe every press release made by the FIA. They say what they say to avoid tarnishing the reputation of F1, no more and no less than that. It is like being a politician.

[mat205125]

MustangGT said:

MadCaptainJack said:

We call it a breach of the rules. We don't call it cheating unless it was done deliberately and dishonestly. The FIA has made it crystal clear that "there is no accusation or evidence that RBR has sought at any time to act in bad faith, dishonestly or in a fraudulent manner, nor has it wilfully concealed any information".

Therefore, RBR didn't cheat.

We've already been through this multiple times. You, jasandjules, and PhilAsia are just trolling now.

Stop it.

I see you still believe every press release made by the FIA. They say what they say to avoid tarnishing the reputation of F1, no more and no less than that. It is like being a politician.

MCJ statement is balanced and unquestionably objective.

No matter what logic, there will always be a moon landing hoax conspiracy theorist, who doesn't like what they're presented with, and will look for anything that might possibly fit their agenda.

No point debating

[MustangGT]

mat205125 said:

MustangGT said:

MadCaptainJack said:

We call it a breach of the rules. We don't call it cheating unless it was done deliberately and dishonestly. The FIA has made it crystal clear that "there is no accusation or evidence that RBR has sought at any time to act in bad faith, dishonestly or in a fraudulent manner, nor has it wilfully concealed any information".

Therefore, RBR didn't cheat.

We've already been through this multiple times. You, jasandjules, and PhilAsia are just trolling now.

Stop it.

I see you still believe every press release made by the FIA. They say what they say to avoid tarnishing the reputation of F1, no more and no less than that. It is like being a politician.

MCJ statement is balanced and unquestionably objective.

No matter what logic, there will always be a moon landing hoax conspiracy theorist, who doesn't like what they're presented with, and will look for anything that might possibly fit their agenda.

No point debating

Indeed, certainly not with people who are so blinkered they will believe anything that conveniently fits their view, however unlikely.

Of course the FIA cannot call a team cheats, they have history for not doing that, including in very recent years, such as Ferrari and even Red Bull. If they did it would bring the sport into disrepute. It really is that simple.

[NRS]

mat205125 said:

MustangGT said:

MadCaptainJack said:

We call it a breach of the rules. We don't call it cheating unless it was done deliberately and dishonestly. The FIA has made it crystal clear that "there is no accusation or evidence that RBR has sought at any time to act in bad faith, dishonestly or in a fraudulent manner, nor has it wilfully concealed any information".

Therefore, RBR didn't cheat.

We've already been through this multiple times. You, jasandjules, and PhilAsia are just trolling now.

Stop it.

I see you still believe every press release made by the FIA. They say what they say to avoid tarnishing the reputation of F1, no more and no less than that. It is like being a politician.

MCJ statement is balanced and unquestionably objective.

No matter what logic, there will always be a moon landing hoax conspiracy theorist, who doesn't like what they're presented with, and will look for anything that might possibly fit their agenda.

No point debating

What is the FIA quote about Ferrari and the fuel flow "incident" they had? Whatever was agreed in the end clearly had a big negative effect on their performance, but Ferrari never cheated or broke the rules according to the FIA. I guess that was an accident too?

RB clearly did it accidently. It's well known teams will skip practice sessions and pit stop practices in F1 for example, as practices give you no advantage. It's perfectly understandable they'd skip the cost cap practice year too. Of course that was ABSOLUTELY NOT because it would allow them to plead innocence on grey areas, because no one had flagged those particular ones to the FIA in the practice year...!

[deadslow]

NRS said:

deadslow said:

there was no cheating. Glad Wolff's mole has been binned for the good of the sport.

So what do you call breaking the rules?

I just call it breaking the rules, more accurately 'being found to have broken the rules'. They did not know they had transgressed, nor did their independent accountants, but ultimately it was decided they were over the line. That's not cheating, that's an argument between accountants.

I was once found to have broken a rule. I parked my car, but the rear wheel was (literally) one inch on a zig zag. I was not aware of this and had no intention of mis-parking. The rozzers stopped and gave me a £60.00 reminder to be more careful. I do not consider myself to be a criminal, nor to have tried to gain any unfair/illegal advantage. I just broke a rule, inadvertently.

[MarkwG]

deadslow said:

NRS said:

deadslow said:

there was no cheating. Glad Wolff's mole has been binned for the good of the sport.

So what do you call breaking the rules?

I just call it breaking the rules, more accurately 'being found to have broken the rules'. They did not know they had transgressed, nor did their independent accountants, but ultimately it was decided they were over the line. That's not cheating, that's an argument between accountants.

I was once found to have broken a rule. I parked my car, but the rear wheel was (literally) one inch on a zig zag. I was not aware of this and had no intention of mis-parking. The rozzers stopped and gave me a £60.00 reminder to be more careful. I do not consider myself to be a criminal, nor to have tried to gain any unfair/illegal advantage. I just broke a rule, inadvertently.

Right, you're going with the "multi winning team with accountants & lawyers everywhere is incompetent at following rules they helped devise & negotiate" excuse...even though that incompetence won them a WDC & a WCC...because they "didn't know"...

[deadslow]

MarkwG said:

deadslow said:

NRS said:

deadslow said:

there was no cheating. Glad Wolff's mole has been binned for the good of the sport.

So what do you call breaking the rules?

I just call it breaking the rules, more accurately 'being found to have broken the rules'. They did not know they had transgressed, nor did their independent accountants, but ultimately it was decided they were over the line. That's not cheating, that's an argument between accountants.

I was once found to have broken a rule. I parked my car, but the rear wheel was (literally) one inch on a zig zag. I was not aware of this and had no intention of mis-parking. The rozzers stopped and gave me a £60.00 reminder to be more careful. I do not consider myself to be a criminal, nor to have tried to gain any unfair/illegal advantage. I just broke a rule, inadvertently.

Right, you're going with the "multi winning team with accountants & lawyers everywhere is incompetent at following rules they helped devise & negotiate" excuse...even though that incompetence won them a WDC & a WCC...because they "didn't know"...

I am going with - they were found to have transgressed a rule so they paid a fine. The End (just like my example above)

It's not like they were burning oil deliberately to gain performance, as some have done.

[paulguitar]

deadslow said:

I am going with - they were found to have transgressed a rule so they paid a fine. The End (just like my example above)

It's not like they were burning oil deliberately to gain performance, as some have done.

There is a certain amusing innocence about you, DS. When it comes to Red Bull, anyway.

[MustangGT]

deadslow said:

MarkwG said:

deadslow said:

NRS said:

deadslow said:

there was no cheating. Glad Wolff's mole has been binned for the good of the sport.

So what do you call breaking the rules?

I just call it breaking the rules, more accurately 'being found to have broken the rules'. They did not know they had transgressed, nor did their independent accountants, but ultimately it was decided they were over the line. That's not cheating, that's an argument between accountants.

I was once found to have broken a rule. I parked my car, but the rear wheel was (literally) one inch on a zig zag. I was not aware of this and had no intention of mis-parking. The rozzers stopped and gave me a £60.00 reminder to be more careful. I do not consider myself to be a criminal, nor to have tried to gain any unfair/illegal advantage. I just broke a rule, inadvertently.

Right, you're going with the "multi winning team with accountants & lawyers everywhere is incompetent at following rules they helped devise & negotiate" excuse...even though that incompetence won them a WDC & a WCC...because they "didn't know"...

I am going with - they were found to have transgressed a rule so they paid a fine. The End (just like my example above)

It's not like they were burning oil deliberately to gain performance, as some have done.