Perez, The Elephant in the Room??
Discussion
kambites said:
Maybe Redbull have finally realised that moving a driver with only half a season's experience into the top team and expecting them to perform is a recipe for destroying them!
I think the reason for this will be (in part at least) contractual, RB juniors come through with a generic RB contract, "you drive where we place you and that is that", Perez joined when RB were out of options and not from their junior pool and thus has his own terms, they probably exclude being shunted into an AT mid season. goldbazinga said:
I'm confident that he'll be gone by the end of the season, but I can't understand why they don't get rid earlier. There's a bunch of younger drivers that would/could do a much better job, I don't understand why they are holding off making the change. He's had plenty of time this season to get over a blip in performance, so this is the level that he's driving at, which (by F1 standards) just isn't good enough.
Who are all these young better drivers? We've seen multiple examples of inexperienced drivers being thrown in the deep end at Red Bull and sinking. The chances are, unless they are exceptional, they won't do any better than Perez without the support and preparation they need for the job.I think this is the real reason they brought D.Ricc. back into the team. They don't have any young drivers who are ready to step up, and no other established drivers would touch the team with a ten foot pole. He is going to be the new #2 when they finally ditch Perez. Yuki isn't good enough, and is a Honda driver anyway who will be gone when Honda switch to Aston Martin, and Lawson can't even beat Yuki most of the time. They don't have anyone else waiting in the wings.
geeks said:
I think the reason for this will be (in part at least) contractual, RB juniors come through with a generic RB contract, "you drive where we place you and that is that", Perez joined when RB were out of options and not from their junior pool and thus has his own terms, they probably exclude being shunted into an AT mid season.
This makes sense, because they're certainly not keeping him because they're happy with his performance!Don’t see why they need Albon. They’ve got Ricciardo who will be grateful to play second fiddle to Verstappen and will mop up if MV ever falters, and can slot Lawson straight back in to AlphaTauri.
I don’t honestly see DR posing a credible threat but he could (should) be able to handle the pressure of a top seat. You’d hope they understand by now that putting a rookie in Perez’s seat next year is unlikely to work out.
Their only issue at that point is who they make their joint reserve driver to cover both teams.
I don’t honestly see DR posing a credible threat but he could (should) be able to handle the pressure of a top seat. You’d hope they understand by now that putting a rookie in Perez’s seat next year is unlikely to work out.
Their only issue at that point is who they make their joint reserve driver to cover both teams.
As long as he finishes second he’s done his job.
They are pretty ruthless on drivers so I’d expect Perez will be gone after this season.
I’d love to see Liam Lawson given his chance ideally in the B team and stick either DR or Yuki in the red bull next year give Liam a learning year in the junior team.
Wouldn’t be surprised to see Lando given an offer to partner Max next year.
They are pretty ruthless on drivers so I’d expect Perez will be gone after this season.
I’d love to see Liam Lawson given his chance ideally in the B team and stick either DR or Yuki in the red bull next year give Liam a learning year in the junior team.
Wouldn’t be surprised to see Lando given an offer to partner Max next year.
Daniel Ricciardo 
This is the same Daniel Ricciardo who interrupted a Lando Norris interview to state “I’m going to end you!” when it was announced he was leaving renault to come to McLaren?
I’m half convinced red bull are almost happy with Perez’ dire performance as it helps build the cult of Verstappen, of how no one can tame the beast of the RB19 like he can and win the constructors all by himself.
This is the same Daniel Ricciardo who interrupted a Lando Norris interview to state “I’m going to end you!” when it was announced he was leaving renault to come to McLaren?
I’m half convinced red bull are almost happy with Perez’ dire performance as it helps build the cult of Verstappen, of how no one can tame the beast of the RB19 like he can and win the constructors all by himself.
FNG said:
Don’t see why they need Albon. They’ve got Ricciardo who will be grateful to play second fiddle to Verstappen and will mop up if MV ever falters, and can slot Lawson straight back in to AlphaTauri.
I don’t honestly see DR posing a credible threat but he could (should) be able to handle the pressure of a top seat. You’d hope they understand by now that putting a rookie in Perez’s seat next year is unlikely to work out.
Their only issue at that point is who they make their joint reserve driver to cover both teams.
Depends if Ricciardo is still capable of driving at the level he showed years ago. 5 years ago he was more than capable of giving the (at the time) verstappen a run for his money - after his not particularly brilliant time at Renault and the disaster at Mclaren, whether he can still handle the pressure of a top seat is somewhat open to pressure. That said though, he can't possibly do worse than Perez has in the last couple of races as Perez has been absolutely dire so anything should be an improvement.I don’t honestly see DR posing a credible threat but he could (should) be able to handle the pressure of a top seat. You’d hope they understand by now that putting a rookie in Perez’s seat next year is unlikely to work out.
Their only issue at that point is who they make their joint reserve driver to cover both teams.
isaldiri said:
Depends if Ricciardo is still capable of driving at the level he showed years ago. 5 years ago he was more than capable of giving the (at the time) verstappen a run for his money - after his not particularly brilliant time at Renault and the disaster at Mclaren, whether he can still handle the pressure of a top seat is somewhat open to pressure. That said though, he can't possibly do worse than Perez has in the last couple of races as Perez has been absolutely dire so anything should be an improvement.
But that’s not what they will want now. And yes Ricciardo hasn’t delivered, but he’s got enough experience to handle the pressure and I can’t believe he honestly expects to go toe to toe against Verstappen if he gets the second seat. So in those respects he’s the better deal. He can’t have the same establish-myself career aspiration that a younger and considerably poorer alternative might.
WPA said:
Yes if they want to RB could sack Perez but who do they replace him with, yes they have the money for any driver they want but would that driver want to join team Max, I cannot see it at the end of the day, Red Bull is Max's team and joining it seems like career suicide to me.
F1 drivers don’t think that way.They all intrinsically believe that if they were in a Red Bull too, they’d be beating Max because they all believe they’re faster than him.
Muzzer79 said:
WPA said:
Yes if they want to RB could sack Perez but who do they replace him with, yes they have the money for any driver they want but would that driver want to join team Max, I cannot see it at the end of the day, Red Bull is Max's team and joining it seems like career suicide to me.
F1 drivers don’t think that way.They all intrinsically believe that if they were in a Red Bull too, they’d be beating Max because they all believe they’re faster than him.
rallycross said:
As long as he finishes second he’s done his job.
They are pretty ruthless on drivers so I’d expect Perez will be gone after this season.
I’d love to see Liam Lawson given his chance ideally in the B team and stick either DR or Yuki in the red bull next year give Liam a learning year in the junior team.
Wouldn’t be surprised to see Lando given an offer to partner Max next year.
If they did and I was Lando I'd tell them to FRO!They are pretty ruthless on drivers so I’d expect Perez will be gone after this season.
I’d love to see Liam Lawson given his chance ideally in the B team and stick either DR or Yuki in the red bull next year give Liam a learning year in the junior team.
Wouldn’t be surprised to see Lando given an offer to partner Max next year.
Red Bull is Max's team so anyone else is only ever going to treated as 2nd best.
WPA said:
Yes if they want to RB could sack Perez but who do they replace him with, yes they have the money for any driver they want but would that driver want to join team Max, I cannot see it at the end of the day, Red Bull is Max's team and joining it seems like career suicide to me.
Redbull don't need a 2nd driver who is top quality or anyone outside the Redbull stable.They have Max and a car advantage such that he won the wdc and wcc on his own!!!
Redbull could sack Perez and put Riccardo in the car with a pure no2 contract as he knows after his Mclaren performance his stock is down.
No matter what Horner says there is zero way Redbull would ever have a pairing like George and Lewis, they are a one man team and that works for them.
Honestly if I was Red Bull I would be trying to talk Haas into releasing Hulkenberg, it would be pennies to a team like Red Bull and he would gladly sign as a strict number 2, he is quick and consistent and I believe would do a much better job than Perez is currently.
I like Checo but he's not up to the job anymore based on his form across 2023, I'd have Hulkenberg in the car for everything after the Mexican Grand Prix, it would just be cruel if they did it before then.
I like Checo but he's not up to the job anymore based on his form across 2023, I'd have Hulkenberg in the car for everything after the Mexican Grand Prix, it would just be cruel if they did it before then.
patmahe said:
Honestly if I was Red Bull I would be trying to talk Haas into releasing Hulkenberg, it would be pennies to a team like Red Bull and he would gladly sign as a strict number 2, he is quick and consistent and I believe would do a much better job than Perez is currently.
I like Checo but he's not up to the job anymore based on his form across 2023, I'd have Hulkenberg in the car for everything after the Mexican Grand Prix, it would just be cruel if they did it before then.
Hulkenberg may be pennies to a team like Red Bull but buying Checo out of his 2024 contract won't be pennies and where does this leave DR? I like Checo but he's not up to the job anymore based on his form across 2023, I'd have Hulkenberg in the car for everything after the Mexican Grand Prix, it would just be cruel if they did it before then.
If DR puts in half decent performances in the next two races I can see him getting the nod, with Lawson in an AlphaTauri for 2024 and possible promotion to Red Bull in 2025.
The reason they haven’t binned Perez is quite straightforward. Thanks to his performances earlier in the season, he’s still second in the drivers’ championship, and RB have never had a 1-2 before.
Now since the summer, he’s underperformed and the other constructors have caught up, but Perez is still second, with a gap of 30 points to Lewis in 3rd. One might argue that, if Lewis had finished on the podium last weekend and cut that gap in half, then Perez would be under serious threat, but there’s no way he’s getting fired when he can still get that elusive 1-2 for the team.
Now since the summer, he’s underperformed and the other constructors have caught up, but Perez is still second, with a gap of 30 points to Lewis in 3rd. One might argue that, if Lewis had finished on the podium last weekend and cut that gap in half, then Perez would be under serious threat, but there’s no way he’s getting fired when he can still get that elusive 1-2 for the team.
Muzzer79 said:
F1 drivers don’t think that way.
They all intrinsically believe that if they were in a Red Bull too, they’d be beating Max because they all believe they’re faster than him.
Hmmmm. Yes. No. Maybe.They all intrinsically believe that if they were in a Red Bull too, they’d be beating Max because they all believe they’re faster than him.
Whilst I broadly agree with your statement, when you have drivers such as Senna, Schumacher, Hamilton and Verstappen, I do wonder how many drivers on the grid truly believe, in their heart of hearts, if they can consistently beat such drivers.
Even in the junior formula, (F3 and Formula Vauxhall Lotus), I really rated Barrichello, but I’m not convinced that he thought he was overall better than Schumacher.
Nico Rosberg, a guy who is very intelligent and absolutely is no slouch, has openly admitted that he did have what it took to go up against Hamilton for another year.
I’m not saying that your statement is wrong Muzzer. It’s just that I’m sceptical that for many drivers, they may not honestly believe their own bulls
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