Sportsmanship - Does it exist in F1?

[DOCG]

MustangGT said:

DOCG said:

MustangGT said:

paulguitar said:

DOCG said:

Anyone who thinks Hamilton is a good sportsman is blinded by fanboyism.

Just look at how he nearly drove Coulthard off the track at Monza when he had a clear run on him.

When was that then?

Indeed. The depths some people sink to in trying to post disparaging remarks about somebody they have never met.

It's nothing about him personally, just his driving style.

Driving style?

Nearly anybody who knows anything about F1 (most of the paddock included) state that Lewis Hamilton is one of the cleanest drivers out there. So what do you not like?

His racing idol as a child was Senna, that should tell you something.

[paulguitar]

DOCG said:

I think you are referring to a different incident. I'm pretty sure it was a wet race, so it would have been 2008 when Toro Rosso got their shock victory.

Monza 2007 was a dry and sunny race if I recall.

Edited by DOCG on Tuesday 16th April 19:58

No reference to any incident between Hamilton and Coulthard in the race report, and Coulthard finished the race and was classified 13th:


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_Italian_Grand_P...

[DOCG]

paulguitar said:

DOCG said:

I think you are referring to a different incident. I'm pretty sure it was a wet race, so it would have been 2008 when Toro Rosso got their shock victory.

Monza 2007 was a dry and sunny race if I recall.

Edited by DOCG on Tuesday 16th April 19:58

No reference to any incident between Hamilton and Coulthard in the race report, and Coulthard finished the race and was classified 13th:


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_Italian_Grand_P...

They didn't make contact, Coulthard got a run on him (I think after Variante) and was about to overtake Hamilton but when side-by-side Hamilton veered to the left and Coulthard had to brake to avoid either contact or being run onto the grass.


Looking at the race result, Webber was one place behind Hamilton so I could be confusing him with Coulthard since they were teammates that season.

[paulguitar]

DOCG said:

His racing idol as a child was Senna, that should tell you something.

Hamilton is widely regarded as one of the fairest drivers on track throughout his career.


He's absolutely nothing like Senna. Or Schumacher.

[DOCG]

paulguitar said:

DOCG said:

His racing idol as a child was Senna, that should tell you something.

Hamilton is widely regarded as one of the fairest drivers on track throughout his career.


He's absolutely nothing like Senna. Or Schumacher.

I stopped watching F1 when they introduced the turbocharged lawnmower engines, and at that time Hamilton was considered a bit of a dirty driver and fairly regularly got into incidents with other drivers, I think 2011 was particularly bad.

[paulguitar]

DOCG said:

paulguitar said:

DOCG said:

His racing idol as a child was Senna, that should tell you something.

Hamilton is widely regarded as one of the fairest drivers on track throughout his career.


He's absolutely nothing like Senna. Or Schumacher.

I stopped watching F1 when they introduced the turbocharged lawnmower engines, and at that time Hamilton was considered a bit of a dirty driver and fairly regularly got into incidents with other drivers, I think 2011 was particularly bad.

So you haven't watched for 10 years, well over half of Hamilton's career.

Well, to educate you a bit, he's considered one of the cleanest drivers on track, and amongst multiple champions particularly clean.

I hate the hybrid engines too.

[DOCG]

paulguitar said:

DOCG said:

paulguitar said:

DOCG said:

His racing idol as a child was Senna, that should tell you something.

Hamilton is widely regarded as one of the fairest drivers on track throughout his career.


He's absolutely nothing like Senna. Or Schumacher.

I stopped watching F1 when they introduced the turbocharged lawnmower engines, and at that time Hamilton was considered a bit of a dirty driver and fairly regularly got into incidents with other drivers, I think 2011 was particularly bad.

So you haven't watched for 10 years, well over half of Hamilton's career.

Well, to educate you a bit, he's considered one of the cleanest drivers on track, and amongst multiple champions particularly clean.

I hate the hybrid engines too.

A leapard doesn't change it's spots. But having such a dominant car naturally means a driver is naturally less likely to come into conflict with others. I assume there's also no point in attempting risky overtakes through corners when they can just use DRS on the straights.

I didn't watch the races, but I read of numerous incidents regarding Hamilton in 2021.

[paulguitar]

DOCG said:

A leapard doesn't change it's spots. But having such a dominant car naturally means a driver is naturally less likely to come into conflict with others. I assume there's also no point in attempting risky overtakes through corners when they can just use DRS on the straights.

I didn't watch the races, but I read of numerous incidents regarding Hamilton in 2021.

Okay, champ. You don't watch the sport and haven't seen the last 220-odd races, but you know better than the team bosses, writers and commentators, current and retired drivers, etc.

[DOCG]

paulguitar said:

DOCG said:

A leapard doesn't change it's spots. But having such a dominant car naturally means a driver is naturally less likely to come into conflict with others. I assume there's also no point in attempting risky overtakes through corners when they can just use DRS on the straights.

I didn't watch the races, but I read of numerous incidents regarding Hamilton in 2021.

Okay, champ. You don't watch the sport and haven't seen the last 220-odd races, but you know better than the team bosses, writers and commentators, current and retired drivers, etc.

I didn't claim to know better than anyone, but it's clear that fans of any particular driver are highly subject to confirmation bias. Especially with the bias towards British that was always extremely prominent in English speaking media regarding F1.

[paulguitar]

DOCG said:

I didn't claim to know better than anyone, but it's clear that fans of any particular driver are highly subject to confirmation bias. Especially with the bias towards British that was always extremely prominent in English speaking media regarding F1.

It has nothing to do with nationality. I supported Gilles Villeneuve, Niki Lauda and Mika Hakkinen. And the UK media has not been universally supportive of Hamilton. Far from it, actually.

Hamilton is considered to have been a fair and decent driver because, over a very long career, he has, on balance, been a fair and decent driver.

[Henson]

DOCG said:

Anyone who thinks Hamilton is a good sportsman is blinded by fanboyism.

Just look at how he nearly drove Coulthard off the track at Monza when he had a clear run on him.

I’m intrigued as to why you needed to bump this thread - no activity for a fortnight - with a made-up set of events/accusation.

It’s genuinely fascinating.

What has Lewis Hamilton done that affects you so deeply?

[DOCG]

Henson said:

DOCG said:

Anyone who thinks Hamilton is a good sportsman is blinded by fanboyism.

Just look at how he nearly drove Coulthard off the track at Monza when he had a clear run on him.

I’m intrigued as to why you needed to bump this thread - no activity for a fortnight - with a made-up set of events/accusation.

It’s genuinely fascinating.

What has Lewis Hamilton done that affects you so deeply?

Perhaps you should consider the possibility that I didn't make it up

Perhaps I stumbled across this thread, which reminded of a particular event that I thought was relevant to the topic. Surely that would be a more likely chain of events?

[DOCG]

paulguitar said:

DOCG said:

I didn't claim to know better than anyone, but it's clear that fans of any particular driver are highly subject to confirmation bias. Especially with the bias towards British that was always extremely prominent in English speaking media regarding F1.

It has nothing to do with nationality. I supported Gilles Villeneuve, Niki Lauda and Mika Hakkinen. And the UK media has not been universally supportive of Hamilton. Far from it, actually.

Hamilton is considered to have been a fair and decent driver because, over a very long career, he has, on balance, been a fair and decent driver.

From what I recall in 2007 and 08, the media was hugely supportive of Hamilton (I was a Hamilton fan myself in those days), then of course hugely supportive of Button in 2009.

[Henson]

DOCG said:

…I didn't make it up…

Yes, you did.

It never happened. You made it up.

[DOCG]

Henson said:

DOCG said:

…I didn't make it up…

Yes, you did.

It never happened. You made it up.

You said yourself that such behaviour would be "fascinating", yet refuse to accept the possibility of far more likely events. Very irrational.

[paulguitar]

DOCG said:

From what I recall in 2007 and 08, the media was hugely supportive of Hamilton (I was a Hamilton fan myself in those days), then of course hugely supportive of Button in 2009.

Certainly not all of the media. There were a lot of stodgy old-timers amongst the print media in particular who found Hamilton quite hard to deal with, as different as he was from what they were comfortable with.

[Henson]

DOCG said:

You said yourself that such behaviour would be "fascinating", yet refuse to accept the possibility of far more likely events. Very irrational.

You make things up on a discussion forum.
And then accuse others of being irrational.

Okay.

[DOCG]

paulguitar said:

DOCG said:

From what I recall in 2007 and 08, the media was hugely supportive of Hamilton (I was a Hamilton fan myself in those days), then of course hugely supportive of Button in 2009.

Certainly not all of the media. There were a lot of stodgy old-timers amongst the print media in particular who found Hamilton quite hard to deal with, as different as he was from what they were comfortable with.

But what about the incident with Alonso in Hungary qualifying? The media fully blamed Alonso for it, and of course as an 11 year old I believed them. Then years later I found out that it was Hamilton who broke the internal team agreement to give Alonso the optimum qualifying lap (it alternated race-by-race), but the media never said a word about it! Alonso was simply portrayed as the villain for the rest of the season.

Marc Priestley did a YouTube video explaining the circumstances in detail.

[DOCG]

Henson said:

DOCG said:

You said yourself that such behaviour would be "fascinating", yet refuse to accept the possibility of far more likely events. Very irrational.

You make things up on a discussion forum.
And then accuse others of being irrational.

Okay.

I didn't make anything up.

[Henson]

DOCG said:

Henson said:

DOCG said:

You said yourself that such behaviour would be "fascinating", yet refuse to accept the possibility of far more likely events. Very irrational.

You make things up on a discussion forum.
And then accuse others of being irrational.

Okay.

I didn't make anything up.

DOCG said:

Just look at how he nearly drove Coulthard off the track at Monza when he had a clear run on him.

Your actual words.

What you claimed to happen - didn’t.

You made it up.