Discussion
I think we need to get back to showing drivers driving at the limit, and using skill to make progress.
In my fantasy F1 rule changes, I'd include:
- dumping DRS
- scrapping blue flags
- narrower rear tyres (get the cars moving around some more, and also introduce an additional element of strategy and driver skill as regards getting the most out of harder-worked tyres at the rear)
- reintroduce testing on a "reverse grid" basis - backmarkers get far more (in a budget cap world, the testing overhead is not as large as it once was, and the opportunity to actually *learn* how to improve the cars will help the racing)
- introduce the 2 additional teams
- narrower, shorter cars overall (to improve the racing opportunities on existing circuits)
If the aero rules need further tweaking to allow closer following, that should also feature.
I'd also introduce a refinement to the wing flexibility rules: if the wings can be seen flexing from onboard cameras, they're illegal. The amount of money and time spent on rule-skirting flexible aero has been considerable. There's a rule; it should be enforced.
Numerically the racing is closer than it has ever been. But it isn't as exciting as it has ever been. We just don't have the sense that the drivers are heroic, or that the result is in much doubt.
Speed isn't everything. Having spent a delightful 10 minutes watching chain-driven Frazer Nashes in the wet at Goodwood, there's no doubt but that skill on display is something to celebrate
In my fantasy F1 rule changes, I'd include:
- dumping DRS
- scrapping blue flags
- narrower rear tyres (get the cars moving around some more, and also introduce an additional element of strategy and driver skill as regards getting the most out of harder-worked tyres at the rear)
- reintroduce testing on a "reverse grid" basis - backmarkers get far more (in a budget cap world, the testing overhead is not as large as it once was, and the opportunity to actually *learn* how to improve the cars will help the racing)
- introduce the 2 additional teams
- narrower, shorter cars overall (to improve the racing opportunities on existing circuits)
If the aero rules need further tweaking to allow closer following, that should also feature.
I'd also introduce a refinement to the wing flexibility rules: if the wings can be seen flexing from onboard cameras, they're illegal. The amount of money and time spent on rule-skirting flexible aero has been considerable. There's a rule; it should be enforced.
Numerically the racing is closer than it has ever been. But it isn't as exciting as it has ever been. We just don't have the sense that the drivers are heroic, or that the result is in much doubt.
Speed isn't everything. Having spent a delightful 10 minutes watching chain-driven Frazer Nashes in the wet at Goodwood, there's no doubt but that skill on display is something to celebrate
entropy said:
Some out-stayed their welcome, Frank Williams for instance thought too much of Williams Grand Prix Engineering as his baby rather than as a competitive race team; Ron Dennis's second coming at McLaren was a disaster.
The other thing is F1 teams are far, far too large with too many toys and data to play which and has meant role of Team Principle is just another managerial position given to technocrats.
The problem is that there seems to be no room for modern, younger replacements i.e. no new proper owner managed start-up F1 teams. The current situation doesn't allow individuals to enter the circus except as an appointee in a corporate structure.The other thing is F1 teams are far, far too large with too many toys and data to play which and has meant role of Team Principle is just another managerial position given to technocrats.
That's what I was really complaining about. It's all become a very closed and tight club which has no room for genuine new teams.
skwdenyer said:
In my fantasy F1 rule changes, I'd include:
- dumping DRS
- scrapping blue flags
- narrower rear tyres (get the cars moving around some more, and also introduce an additional element of strategy and driver skill as regards getting the most out of harder-worked tyres at the rear)
- reintroduce testing on a "reverse grid" basis - backmarkers get far more (in a budget cap world, the testing overhead is not as large as it once was, and the opportunity to actually *learn* how to improve the cars will help the racing)
- introduce the 2 additional teams
- narrower, shorter cars overall (to improve the racing opportunities on existing circuits)
All good ideas.- dumping DRS
- scrapping blue flags
- narrower rear tyres (get the cars moving around some more, and also introduce an additional element of strategy and driver skill as regards getting the most out of harder-worked tyres at the rear)
- reintroduce testing on a "reverse grid" basis - backmarkers get far more (in a budget cap world, the testing overhead is not as large as it once was, and the opportunity to actually *learn* how to improve the cars will help the racing)
- introduce the 2 additional teams
- narrower, shorter cars overall (to improve the racing opportunities on existing circuits)
I would also ban pit-to-car and car-to-pit communication, except in a safety emergency or alerting a forthcoming critical car failure.
All communication would be via the pit board.
Nope - I haven't "given up" on F1 - F1 is giving up on me. I'm not prepared to pay through the nose for it.
So I miss things even if I might have been interested in it. The financial model is to make fans pay for everything.
And that's the problem - finance is dominating the sport.
We are seeing the same happening with football.
So I miss things even if I might have been interested in it. The financial model is to make fans pay for everything.
And that's the problem - finance is dominating the sport.
We are seeing the same happening with football.
Forester1965 said:
Mercedes' performance now reminds me of McLaren post Newey, chasing maximum theoretical downforce ahead of usability, allied to poor correlation of virtual tools to reality. I bet a certain L Hamilton also remembers that time and it's factored into his decision of where to drive next year.
I agree, the window is too small to operate the car in, so on paper you have a really fast car but in reality you can't get it into the window to take advantage of it. If a driver doesn't understand how to stay in that window or trust the car once out of it, you're never going to get the best out of the pairing.
Wills2 said:
Forester1965 said:
Mercedes' performance now reminds me of McLaren post Newey, chasing maximum theoretical downforce ahead of usability, allied to poor correlation of virtual tools to reality. I bet a certain L Hamilton also remembers that time and it's factored into his decision of where to drive next year.
I agree, the window is too small to operate the car in, so on paper you have a really fast car but in reality you can't get it into the window to take advantage of it. If a driver doesn't understand how to stay in that window or trust the car once out of it, you're never going to get the best out of the pairing.
Increase the amount of free practice if that's more "sustainable," but teams (and people) have to be able to learn.
I was a lifelong F1 fan, having watched almost every race since 1984, but I gave up on the sport & cancelled my Sky subscription last summer, having been a subscriber since the start. I still check on the results as I do the football scores, and follow the news about the sport, and I might occasionally watch the C4 highlights if a race has been particularly exciting, but that’s as far as it goes.
Verstappen & Red Bull’s total dominance means everyone knows the outcome before the race starts, and what is the point of watching live sport if you know the result in advance? How many of the millions of football fans who are going to games this weekend would still attend if they knew the result before kick-off? I also wonder how many of F1’s new fans who have discovered it via Drive to Survive will quickly lose interest.
It’s not just the predictability, though. There have been eras of dominance before, after all. I have also become disillusioned with F1 since the stolen championship in Abu Dhabi 2021. The reality is that part of my love of the sport died that day, and my interest waned from then on. I know I’m not the only one.
Verstappen & Red Bull’s total dominance means everyone knows the outcome before the race starts, and what is the point of watching live sport if you know the result in advance? How many of the millions of football fans who are going to games this weekend would still attend if they knew the result before kick-off? I also wonder how many of F1’s new fans who have discovered it via Drive to Survive will quickly lose interest.
It’s not just the predictability, though. There have been eras of dominance before, after all. I have also become disillusioned with F1 since the stolen championship in Abu Dhabi 2021. The reality is that part of my love of the sport died that day, and my interest waned from then on. I know I’m not the only one.
Bradgate said:
It’s not just the predictability, though. There have been eras of dominance before, after all. I have also become disillusioned with F1 since the stolen championship in Abu Dhabi 2021. The reality is that part of my love of the sport died that day, and my interest waned from then on. I know I’m not the only one.
Not the only one for sure. What a farce that was, now it's still a farce just a different type but with shared reasons.Bradgate said:
I was a lifelong F1 fan, having watched almost every race since 1984, but I gave up on the sport & cancelled my Sky subscription last summer, having been a subscriber since the start. I still check on the results as I do the football scores, and follow the news about the sport, and I might occasionally watch the C4 highlights if a race has been particularly exciting, but that’s as far as it goes.
Verstappen & Red Bull’s total dominance means everyone knows the outcome before the race starts, and what is the point of watching live sport if you know the result in advance? How many of the millions of football fans who are going to games this weekend would still attend if they knew the result before kick-off? I also wonder how many of F1’s new fans who have discovered it via Drive to Survive will quickly lose interest.
It’s not just the predictability, though. There have been eras of dominance before, after all. I have also become disillusioned with F1 since the stolen championship in Abu Dhabi 2021. The reality is that part of my love of the sport died that day, and my interest waned from then on. I know I’m not the only one.
Completely agree with that second paragraph Verstappen & Red Bull’s total dominance means everyone knows the outcome before the race starts, and what is the point of watching live sport if you know the result in advance? How many of the millions of football fans who are going to games this weekend would still attend if they knew the result before kick-off? I also wonder how many of F1’s new fans who have discovered it via Drive to Survive will quickly lose interest.
It’s not just the predictability, though. There have been eras of dominance before, after all. I have also become disillusioned with F1 since the stolen championship in Abu Dhabi 2021. The reality is that part of my love of the sport died that day, and my interest waned from then on. I know I’m not the only one.
Check out the odds from the last Chinese GP in 2019
And this weekends odds, says it all really:
I'm also not convinced by increased viewership, last time I found independent figures on this a couple of years ago, worldwide they were down, mainly due to a big drop in Brazil and Germany (who had moved behind a paywall) I was convinced then, as I am now, that any recent uplift due to DTS was driven by lockdowns, and would not sustain. I find it odd it's very difficult to find TV viewership figures over time split by territory. Personal experience is that almost completely friends, family, and work colleagues saying they can't be bothered anymore. I'm sure many on here have had the same experience. I can't recall anybody saying "Oh yeah I've just got into F1, it's great!'
I haven’t missed a race or qualifying since 2008, but this season I’ve started to go off the boil, hardly read anything in the off season, either.
It’s just so boring, they really f
ked up with these regs, the cars sound gash, the cars are too big, heavy and worse yet max and red bull are dominating.
They either need to strangle red bull, or get someone in that 2nd red bull seat to at least give max a race, given the current goings on at RB hopefully Horner does just this.
Surely liberty are seeing the decline and act
It’s just so boring, they really f
ked up with these regs, the cars sound gash, the cars are too big, heavy and worse yet max and red bull are dominating.They either need to strangle red bull, or get someone in that 2nd red bull seat to at least give max a race, given the current goings on at RB hopefully Horner does just this.
Surely liberty are seeing the decline and act
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