RE: Video: LFA vs GT-R, ZR1, GT2 RS and Ferrari 430

[PunterCam]

And who'd've thought it! The GTR walks it! Reminds me a little of some of their previous videos... Of course back then it was an NSX they loved.

It's a real shame they're stopping the shows, but they never really provided anything insightful - just biased Japanese TV, which is fine. In reality, the ZR1 would have walked this track.

[Guibo]

S1MMA said:

Over what increment? That's really the key isnt it? GTR would muller pretty much everything 0-30mph, but rolling start vs something more powerful/lighter the GTR has no advantage and it holds a car with 420bhp/tonne (ZR1) whilst the GTR has 300bhp/tonne. That doesn't add up and makes no sense.

No advantage except for full-throttle, no-lift shifts with a transmission that transmits torque during the gearchange, not to mention shorter overall gearing. Tell me, what does physics say the ZR1's power/wt ratio is when it's between gearchanges...? Torque at the wheels after gear multiplication?

The Autocar result you listed was for the old GT-R, wasn't it?

Here's a 600 hp GT-R:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0Jr8LUNzNo

I averaged 100-260 (62-161 mph) times of around 15.4s. You can compare that to the ZR1's 15.8s to cover the 60-160 mph spread. The German mag Sport Auto timed a 590 PS GT-R at 6.9s for the 100-200 kph sprint. Check these other German results for the ZR1.

Sport Auto, Supertest: 7.4
Sport Auto, 0-300-0 comparo: 7.5
AutoBild: 7.7

Now check another tuned GT-R tested by AutoBild, Novidem's GT-RS rated at 585 PS: 7.6

It's a safe bet that a GT-R tuned to 700 hp won't lose to a ZR1 like it did in the Best Motoring video.

[lasko]

Guibo said:

It's a safe bet that a GT-R tuned to 700 hp won't lose to a ZR1 like it did in the Best Motoring video.

GTR only lost to ZR1 in the POWER WARS segment because all cars were required to be in 2nd gear and conduct rolling atart at 50 km/h. We all know from the dig that this is no contest (GTR wins here)

ZR1 i think has strong, broad accessible power at broad RPMs while the GTR doesn't reach its sweetspot until 3,500 RPMs (but GTR has close spacing gearing so it stays in its sweetspot while driving at 10/10ths).

Edited by lasko on Friday 20th May 05:49

[CraigVmax]

you might find this interesting gents, was taken at vmax200

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dH8-bNsoMk

[jon-]

CraigVmax said:

you might find this interesting gents, was taken at vmax200

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dH8-bNsoMk

Good video, thanks. I do love that car.

Have to wonder when during the ultimate vmax runs he didn't let the auto box do the job to stop the early shifting.

Out of interest did you happen to spot what tyres the LFA was wearing?

[CraigVmax]

he was a very handy driver, i think he tried it all manner of ways, they did a lot of runs.

Dont know ref tyres but can probably find out if you're interested

[jon-]

CraigVmax said:

he was a very handy driver, i think he tried it all manner of ways, they did a lot of runs.

Dont know ref tyres but can probably find out if you're interested

Very, please. Not just for my own personal curiosity but it would shed a little more like on the LFAs apparent performance in this video

[CraigVmax]

from the horses mouth..

The LFA runs on Bridgestone POTENZA S001 tyres. 265/35 R20 on the front and 305/30 R20 on the rear.

[Wadeski]

lasko said:

WHY DO PEOPLE HERE THINK THE "RACE PARADE" IS THE BE-ALL-END-ALL???

IT'S JUST THAT... A PARADE!


TIME ATTACK lap times matter... not the "race parade"


Here's the lap times posted... IN THE TIME ATTACK SEGMENT

Fuji Speedway

GT2 RS - 1.51.802
GTR - 1.52.937
ZR1 - 1.53.964
LFA - 1.55.342

Indeed. Just as in any race, overtaking opporunity, mechanical failure (porker had a dodgy synchro which made 2nd gear difficult), and driver mistakes played an important role. And over just FOUR LAPS anything can happen.

the time attack figures show what cars is fastest, NOT the race.

[jon-]

CraigVmax said:

from the horses mouth..

The LFA runs on Bridgestone POTENZA S001 tyres. 265/35 R20 on the front and 305/30 R20 on the rear.

Thanks Craig, appreciated Pretty obvious when you think about it (Jap car, Jap tyres )

Assuming the cars in the videos were on the stock rubber, the GTR and GT2RS should have walked off, with a tyre alone advantage of at least a couple of seconds per lap.

[Trommel]

GT-R doesn't have Cup-style tyres.

[jon-]

Trommel said:

GT-R doesn't have Cup-style tyres.

The Bridgestone RE070s and Dunlop Sport 600 DSSTsaren't quite on the level of the Cup tyres on the GT2 RS, but they're a much sticker tyre than something like the S001 (unless of course GTRs are coming with different tyres these days)

Dunlops:

[Porkie]

Riggers said:

loveice said:

Wow, I never thought PH would would call that Ferrari a F430 GT3. Please, get the fact right! It's a F430 Scuderia RSD (a japanese tuned road going F430 Scuderia).

Well there you go - I'll freely admit that I had never heard of such a machine before, but you live and learn. Original article is now EFA

Riggers... he is WRONG himself. Its NOT a Scuderia at ALL!

Can't believe he is asking YOU to get your facts right!!! and monging it up himself. EPIC FAIL!

Its a normal F430 with a basildon spec spoiler and some other bits from some go slower jap tuner called RSD

The easy way to tell is the exhausts.

430 Scuds have Exhausts coming out much higher and more centrally. Normal F430's like the one in the video have them in the lower bumpers.

[PascalBuyens]

lasko said:

Keiichi Tsuchiya cheated again..... by using launch control

What everyone is conveniently forgetting is that the ZR1 killed the competition in " POWER WARS " segment.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NukiQ6gvrpE&fea...

Did you also notice then that Tsuchiya was driving it in the power wars, yet when they had to drive it on track, there's a (to pu tit gentle) slower driver in the ZR1?


I might be putting some oil on a hot fire here, but can't stop wondering what would happen if KT has the ZR-1 as a toy (given it's faster than the GTR on the Ring, I'd think it'd be faster on almost any other track too... But then again, would be a bit of a shock to have an American car waste the Japs/germans...

[trunks82]

Wow.didnt expect that.Nissan should use it as a promotional video.and does anyone else think this is how top gear should be every week?

[big_rob_sydney]

Didnt read all the posts, but at face value, the GTR won, simple. And while I dont generally place much stock in americanisms, one I DO like is "when the flag drops, the bullst stops".

You can argue all you like in favour of your preferred car, but that GTR is just an amazing piece of kit. And while I get some of the argument over long runs vs short runs, the GTR is also much cheaper, so you could replace whatever breaks.

I personally would never buy one of the other cars now that I've seen how the GTR beats them.

[Mr Sparkle]

Baddie said:

ZeeTacoe said:

If you think about it, it is such total bks. How bad must Toyota's electronics/electrical motor/dial department be if a tonne and a bit of car can out pace half a gram of red plastic?

Think they were referring to the engine being blipped in neutral...

I once had a Striker kit car with a 20 valve imported version of the Toyota 4 AGE 1.6. It wasn't quite R300 fast, but in second gear the rev counter was 4-500 rpm behind when it smacked the 7800 rpm limiter, and the speedo was still reading less than 60 when it hit the limiter at close to 70 mph. The instruments were crap though!

Motorbikes still use needles and they will rev more quickly than a larger car engine - just a marketing gimmick (albeit one I quite like)

ETA: The LFA didn't get of the line very well - left the line at 2000rpm and then bogged down, also the GTR driver moved his steering wheel to avoid the F430 before the cars left the line - how did the driver know the Ferrari would cock up his start?

Edited by Mr Sparkle on Saturday 21st May 06:03

[icebite78]

Just thought this would come in handy as proof of what the GT-R can do, enjoy!!!

http://www.insideline.com/lexus/lf-a/2012/videos/2...

[ZeeTacoe]

big_rob_sydney said:

Didnt read all the posts, but at face value, the GTR won, simple. And while I dont generally place much stock in americanisms, one I DO like is "when the flag drops, the bullst stops".

You can argue all you like in favour of your preferred car, but that GTR is just an amazing piece of kit. And while I get some of the argument over long runs vs short runs, the GTR is also much cheaper, so you could replace whatever breaks.

I personally would never buy one of the other cars now that I've seen how the GTR beats them.

I just hope that no one posts a link to the Drivers republic test where a 911 Carrera S beat the GTr in a straight line nor the DR issue where Chris Harris doesn't know how the GTr beat the GT2 at the ring.

[GeeTeaEye]

Very sad to see the end of Best Motoring. A very unique offering of motoring entertainment.

I'll miss the touge challenges the most, and the in-car camera footage of the drift king's lightning quick reactions! I agree that Best Motoring had a strong bias in favour of their domestic vehicles, but do remember that in a shootout between the Lexus ISF and BMW M3 the driver conceded that the M3 was still the benchmark japanese manufacturers were working towards.

In relation to the Nissan GTR, I would just like to comment that at least Nissan are still producing competitive sports cars. The other japanese manufacturers appear to have completely lost the plot with their current offerings! Subaru + Mitsubishi's line up consists of nothing more than lukewarm hatchbacks, Honda relies solely on the sub-standard Civic Type R, and Toyota have nothing until the FT-86 arrives!

Perhaps the end of Best Motoring alligns with the end of an era in japanese performance car production...