RE: PH Carpool: TVR Tuscan S

[blueg33]

Guvernator said:

I've run high performance cars before so I am under no illusion about running one on a shoe string budget. An expression I always like is "you have to pay to play". Even the fabled Japanese reliability isn't always as it seems. When I ran a GT-R, I knew of quite a few people who had to have rebuilds on the allegedly bulletproof RB26 engine in that car due to not looking after them properly or poor tuning. At the end of the day most performance engines are highly strung and need some looking after, however once they got rebuilt, they usually stayed in one piece.

I am just constantly surprised at the amount of "I've had 3 rebuilds comments" that seem to be par for the course and almost treated as normal in TVR world. If something is fixed, I'd expect it to stay fixed! I guess the explanation that they were rebuilt with the same fundamentally dodgy parts makes sense somewhat, I still wouldn't like to be the person on that 3rd rebuild, whatever the reason.

From my research the ones that have had 3 rebuilds tend to have had them done by the factory where damaged parts were replaced with the same poor quality parts. As far as I am aware with the Speed 6 engine all of the later rebuilds are ok.

Plus when I was looking for a car, I was told by an owner that the engine had been rebuilt, when I phoned the engine builder it turns out that what the owner was describing as a rebuilt was the replacement of 2 valves and a couple of finger followers. So that engine may need more work doing in future and someone may think that it requires a 2nd rebuild, whilst in reality it hasn't had one

[Guvernator]

coach said:

Ah ' ris the curse of the internet forum. It's very rare people post up in massive numbers that they have had NO issues with any product. People go onto forums to ask for or look for advice on the product. It's sad but true that most people don't post about the years of trouble free service they have had

Do a search on most products and if you cut out the shopping it's usually advice and issues.

While I agree the internet or forums aren't a great place to gather anecdotal evidence for the exact reasons you stated, I still think it's telling that whenever I take a look at the Tuscan forums for instance, all I seem to see are posts about someone asking for advice about a noise from the engine, dodgy electrics, car not starting or opening\closing, dodgy handling which needs sorting, basically take your pick from a raft of major and minor issues. I'm not saying other marques don't have their fair share of problems but from someone who would love to own a Tuscan where it not for the reliability worries, it really doesn't paint a very good picture when 80% of the posts seem to be about people having issues. A look at some of the other forum sections reveals nowhere near as many problem posts.

[blueg33]

Guvernator said:

While I agree the internet or forums aren't a great place to gather anecdotal evidence for the exact reasons you stated, I still think it's telling that whenever I take a look at the Tuscan forums for instance, all I seem to see are posts about someone asking for advice about a noise from the engine, dodgy electrics, car not starting or opening\closing, dodgy handling which needs sorting, basically take your pick from a raft of major and minor issues. I'm not saying other marques don't have their fair share of problems but from someone who would love to own a Tuscan where it not for the reliability worries, it really doesn't paint a very good picture when 80% of the posts seem to be about people having issues. A look at some of the other forum sections reveals nowhere near as many problem posts.

I would disagree, I see much the same when I look at Ferrari, Porsche and Aston Forumsn (Fora?)

I recently posted about a noise tat I was worried about and how TVR Power told me it was fine, drive it as hard as you like.

Most of the faults are known issues as they are with the other marques, but in my experience a TVR owner is more likely to try and fix it himself than a Ferrari owner who will just take it to a dealer and bend over.

For instance the Porsche Forum has a sticky called "996-997 wet-sump engine reliability: enter your stats here!"

You also have to remember that many TVR's are over 10 years old and older cars tend to have issues that are caused by age.

I can categorically state that in the first 9 months of my ownership, my Tuscan has fewer problems and niggles than my new Audi A6 had in its first 9 months, and the A6 is waay better than my E60 5 series was

Edited by blueg33 on Wednesday 1st June 15:36

[m3jappa]

It's also the fact that a tvr is a fraction of the cost of other exotica so a few issues IMO are accepted. I wanted one with a rebuild as I don't fancy a bill of a few k. Most other things I can live with.

[montyvr6]

Guvernator said:

coach said:

Ah ' ris the curse of the internet forum. It's very rare people post up in massive numbers that they have had NO issues with any product. People go onto forums to ask for or look for advice on the product. It's sad but true that most people don't post about the years of trouble free service they have had

Do a search on most products and if you cut out the shopping it's usually advice and issues.

While I agree the internet or forums aren't a great place to gather anecdotal evidence for the exact reasons you stated, I still think it's telling that whenever I take a look at the Tuscan forums for instance, all I seem to see are posts about someone asking for advice about a noise from the engine, dodgy electrics, car not starting or opening\closing, dodgy handling which needs sorting, basically take your pick from a raft of major and minor issues. I'm not saying other marques don't have their fair share of problems but from someone who would love to own a Tuscan where it not for the reliability worries, it really doesn't paint a very good picture when 80% of the posts seem to be about people having issues. A look at some of the other forum sections reveals nowhere near as many problem posts.

I think its worth considering the fact that a higher percentage of TVR owners would read/post on a forum such as this then their counterpart Ferrari/Porsche/Lambo and other non prestige marques.

I for example bought a 2003 Audi A6 TDi 18 months ago and very quickly the alternator broke, followed by a CV joint and the engine under tray had a stupid design which scoops up snow and forces the under tray off the car, so I had to lie on the floor in the snow and rip it off. But no one is really interested so I wouldn't post it.

[mikesgt2]

I had a 2000 early Tuscan 4 litre SP6 for 3 years and it never let me down once.

Always needed a service each year for a tune up but it started first time everytime.

A good choice of car for sensible money and nothing turns heads like one this side of 100k.

You just need to get used to super glueing bits back on yourself and with a sense of humour TVR ownership is an enjoyable experience.

Hope yours goes on and on..

[blueg33]

montyvr6 said:

I think its worth considering the fact that a higher percentage of TVR owners would read/post on a forum such as this then their counterpart Ferrari/Porsche/Lambo and other non prestige marques.

I for example bought a 2003 Audi A6 TDi 18 months ago and very quickly the alternator broke, followed by a CV joint and the engine under tray had a stupid design which scoops up snow and forces the under tray off the car, so I had to lie on the floor in the snow and rip it off. But no one is really interested so I wouldn't post it.

Flood water and deep puddles do the same with later A6's

[Zed Ed]

Reliable or not, I desire one, more than ever.

Cerb or Tuscan S?

[wackojacko]

Zed Ed said:

Reliable or not, I desire one, more than ever.

Cerb or Tuscan S?

Tuscan all day ! then buy a Cerb

[coach]

Tamora!

[TVRWannabee]

coach said:

Ah ' ris the curse of the internet forum. It's very rare people post up in massive numbers that they have had NO issues with any product. People go onto forums to ask for or look for advice on the product. It's sad but true that most people don't post about the years of trouble free service they have had

Do a search on most products and if you cut out the shopping it's usually advice and issues.

Agreed. I work online and you will find there is someone complaining about anything you could mention. You just have to work out if there are positives too.

I suspect all the satisfied TVR owners are too busy blatting around the countryside to sit on a computer saying how happy they are. Well I would be.

In any case most cars respond to how they are driven of course.

[Jonathan Legard]

The article said:

My car caught fire

Dagnut said:

sometimes its hard to imagine how this company failed

Please tell me I need a whoosh parrot, mate.

[blueg33]

Jonathan Legard said:

Please tell me I need a whoosh parrot, mate.

Plenty of Ferraris have caught fire, its a a F355 habit.

But you are confusing incidence with causation.

[blueg33]

I have started a suitable thread in the Tuscan forum

[Jonathan Legard]

blueg33 said:

Plenty of Ferraris have caught fire, its a a F355 habit.

But you are confusing incidence with causation.

Wouldn't you agree that the incidence of unreliability had a causal relationship to poor sales?

[wackojacko]

Jonathan Legard said:

blueg33 said:

Plenty of Ferraris have caught fire, its a a F355 habit.

But you are confusing incidence with causation.

Wouldn't you agree that the incidence of unreliability had a causal relationship to poor sales?

It was a tough market and they didn't appeal to the Porsche sort of people, those who bought a TVR knew what they were buying and know how good they are.

It's easy to speculate...... I don't think you can really understand unless you've driven any TVR.(if you have then carry on)

They don't catch fire just like that, it's a 'fault' with many fibreglass cars due to the increased amount wiring due to the lack of natural earth from the panels. TVR just gets lumbered with it, granted a few have gone up but that may have been due to dodgy repairs, DIY and some factory issues.

As said above Ferrari had a similar problem with the 458 and the F355 is still a liability.
seen 2 Nobles burn't out
many Lotus's of different kinds
Corvettes etc.

[blueg33]

Jonathan Legard said:

Wouldn't you agree that the incidence of unreliability had a causal relationship to poor sales?

Not necessarily. But even if I do, that isn't what you said as such, but I wont split hairs as I guess you were implying.

I don't know enough about the financial position of TVR at the end of its days, but a great many British car companies have failed or would have without a savior. Unfortunately I think TVR choose the wrong savior.

The list is well know as to who saved the various British car makers, but at the moment the only ones I can think of that are still British owned are Morgan and Ginetta and the latter mainly make race cars.

So maybe the malaise with TVR is the one that affected many others

I also think that TVR's are unfairly lambasted, most cars that will do 0-60 in 4 seconds, and 185mph top speed that are 10 years old will have issues, come to think of it many new ones too.

[TVRWannabee]

Well, it seems the attraction of TVRs is worldwide. Or is it monty's charisma?

http://1click.indiatimes.com/article/00hCeeSdEf6my...

[speedtwelve]

On the plus side, it's rare that a TVR develops a unique fault. My Chim has had some of the 'classics': worn cam, failed speedo sender, a temporary inability for the odo to go from 49999 to 50000 miles etc. The vast majority of us went in with eyes open, as has been said. I know that if I allow the fuel hoses in the Chimaera engine bay to perish the car will eventually conflagrate on the hard shoulder of the M3.

Re: the Tuscan. I drove a vanilla 3.6 Tuscan 1 a while back, and it was terrific. Max-beans it made my rebuilt Chimaera feel like a Daewoo in a straight line. The throttle-response compared to the (already good) RV8 was razor-sharp, the racket out the back obscene. The steering was kart-direct and very high-geared without being twitchy. A completely ballistic hooligan machine, yet not the impending-death handling nightmare that I was expecting, at least not in the dry.

I love my Chim, but a T-car is a definite step-up.

[FestivAli]

At the time I write this it shows I'll be the 106th poster, I haven't read the other comments, but I'm going to guess you've so far had 105 people tell you that this is their dream car. It's my favorite styled car of all time, being my number 1 dream car (followed by the 2000 Concept version of the Koenigsegg CC and the previous generation XK8 Coupe...). I saw one in Melbourne once (Maybe the Healey Factory in Ringwood had it? They get the odd Chim in) and almost crashed as they are so rare here in AUS. I only have this to ask, which is a better experience for a sunday blast on a fine day? The Tuscan or on of your aforementioned two-wheelers? I only ask because I was nuts about cars until I had a go on a bike (only a little 125cc Sachs Express) and it was so much more fun than what is supposedly a fun car (my dads '08 MX-5) I sort of lost my passion for 4 wheeled things. (edited to say the reason I ask is that I want to know that once I have a bike as well as my current car (09 Fiesta 1.6 Manual, which is ok) will I still pine for something exotic and ridiculously fast? Because if I will I'll probably never have the money to buy a house...)

Ali.