What are fast Golfs like?
Discussion
It maybe worth some of you reading this:
Granted its a 325I not a 328i but still very relevant.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?3869039
Granted its a 325I not a 328i but still very relevant.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?3869039
300bhp/ton said:
Actually, I never claim them to be good looking. I usually say striking or different. Although I do actually like the look of many.
A Leon is about as visually appealing as a kitchen fridge. It's just dull and boring looking and as bland as a barren featureless desert. Which is fine if that's all you want. But not for me I'm afraid.
That being said, I always enjoy your suggestions even if I detest some of your choices A Leon is about as visually appealing as a kitchen fridge. It's just dull and boring looking and as bland as a barren featureless desert. Which is fine if that's all you want. But not for me I'm afraid.
Edited by 300bhp/ton on Tuesday 7th June 12:58
hill79 said:
No mention of a MK2 GTi? Not as quick on paper (around 130bhp IIRC) but a hell of a lot better as a drivers car than the MK3. I had a MK3 GTi for a while, horrible wallowy bouncy thing.
Until you get to serious licence losing speeds in a straight line a mk2 16v will dance around nearly any FWD mk3 an mk4 but sadly in less you are keen to do proper maintenance and put the time/effort into them (mk2s) for "most" people a mk3/4 offers more reliability an creature comforts (if these are important) That said, with the exception of air con my mk2 has nearly every luxury i could need. OP will this be a daily or a weekend car?
For 2k
For £2k you might get a serviceable MK1 GTi, but they're getting expensive, but they're pretty cheap to run, but they're really old for a daily now.
MK2's GTi's come in a few types, 8v (112bhp) and 16v (139bhp) if you want to see a fight, ask on a Golf forum which is best! The 16v is quicker, the engine is quite peaky and this gives the impression the 8v has more low-down grunt, it doesn't the dyno graphs are pretty equal until the higher revs, it's an insurance group higher, does a few less mpg and is a little more to run. Gearboxes on both can be a bother and the gears tend to be hidden all over the place as the linkages wear, not a hard fix though. There are pre 1990 ones (small metal bumpers) and post 90 ones, (bigger plastic bumpers) the later ones have more kit generally - if you can find a nice, un 'messed with' 3dr post-90 16v in Oak Green, you will never lose a penny on it. There's also faster, rarer ones like G60's, rallye's and G60 Limited's but they're rare has hens teeth and waaaay over your budget.
MK3’s come in 8v (125bhp) 16v (150bhp) GTi's and VR6 (174bhp) they also had a facelift mid run, the early ones are total rust monsters. The 8v Gti is pretty boring, the 16v is pretty good and much better VFM than the VR6. I had a VR6 and I love it, but it's not without it's problem, firstly, unlike the later R32's etc, it was never meant to appeal the GTi driver, it's very soft and wallowy and long geared high-speed cruisers, not to mention nose heavy and thirsty (for a small hatch) the later ones didn't even come with the classic GTi plastic arch extensions.
VR6’s getting on now and most will ether need or will have had the timing chain replaced. It rattles like hell over about 100k miles and will eventually the chain will snap or one of the runners will fail and the engine will detonate. Take it to a specialist and they'll ask you for £1000 to do the job, so given that the cheapest VR6's are £500 to buy, you can understand why owners don't bother. As mentioned to make a really good hot hatch out of a VR6 you need to replace all of the suspension to take out the wallow and ideally get a good specialist golf tuner to add the shorter gearing internals from the box of a 16v to the VR6 housing (not as simple as that ether) after that, AND changing the timing chain you'll be a few thousand out of pocket and the proud owner of a 174bhp golf will good handling that's still a bit nose heavy and thirsty. The engine is actually difficult and expensive to tune, but you can tune the 2.0 16v ABF engine in the 16v to 180ish, reasonably easily
MK4’s come in loads of combinations, but even VW admit that with the MK4 ‘GTi’ was more of a trim level that an model, the worst being the 2.0 8v which is painfully slow. They’re good daily drivers, probably the best built of all Golfs, but to be frank, unless you can afford one of the later 180bhp 20v Turbos or an R32, the faster diesels are better.
For 2k
For £2k you might get a serviceable MK1 GTi, but they're getting expensive, but they're pretty cheap to run, but they're really old for a daily now.
MK2's GTi's come in a few types, 8v (112bhp) and 16v (139bhp) if you want to see a fight, ask on a Golf forum which is best! The 16v is quicker, the engine is quite peaky and this gives the impression the 8v has more low-down grunt, it doesn't the dyno graphs are pretty equal until the higher revs, it's an insurance group higher, does a few less mpg and is a little more to run. Gearboxes on both can be a bother and the gears tend to be hidden all over the place as the linkages wear, not a hard fix though. There are pre 1990 ones (small metal bumpers) and post 90 ones, (bigger plastic bumpers) the later ones have more kit generally - if you can find a nice, un 'messed with' 3dr post-90 16v in Oak Green, you will never lose a penny on it. There's also faster, rarer ones like G60's, rallye's and G60 Limited's but they're rare has hens teeth and waaaay over your budget.
MK3’s come in 8v (125bhp) 16v (150bhp) GTi's and VR6 (174bhp) they also had a facelift mid run, the early ones are total rust monsters. The 8v Gti is pretty boring, the 16v is pretty good and much better VFM than the VR6. I had a VR6 and I love it, but it's not without it's problem, firstly, unlike the later R32's etc, it was never meant to appeal the GTi driver, it's very soft and wallowy and long geared high-speed cruisers, not to mention nose heavy and thirsty (for a small hatch) the later ones didn't even come with the classic GTi plastic arch extensions.
VR6’s getting on now and most will ether need or will have had the timing chain replaced. It rattles like hell over about 100k miles and will eventually the chain will snap or one of the runners will fail and the engine will detonate. Take it to a specialist and they'll ask you for £1000 to do the job, so given that the cheapest VR6's are £500 to buy, you can understand why owners don't bother. As mentioned to make a really good hot hatch out of a VR6 you need to replace all of the suspension to take out the wallow and ideally get a good specialist golf tuner to add the shorter gearing internals from the box of a 16v to the VR6 housing (not as simple as that ether) after that, AND changing the timing chain you'll be a few thousand out of pocket and the proud owner of a 174bhp golf will good handling that's still a bit nose heavy and thirsty. The engine is actually difficult and expensive to tune, but you can tune the 2.0 16v ABF engine in the 16v to 180ish, reasonably easily
MK4’s come in loads of combinations, but even VW admit that with the MK4 ‘GTi’ was more of a trim level that an model, the worst being the 2.0 8v which is painfully slow. They’re good daily drivers, probably the best built of all Golfs, but to be frank, unless you can afford one of the later 180bhp 20v Turbos or an R32, the faster diesels are better.
I can vouch for the A3 1.8 T-Sport. I only paid a couple of grand for mine a few years ago and that was relatively low miles, full leather and the S3 alloys. It was one of the best cars I owned, purely down to the VFM factor.
I'd have another in a heartbeat. I wouldn't, however, have a Mk3 or Mk4 Golf. I looked at a Mk3 and they were all pretty tired. Plus if you're looking at one of those, they have the same engine as the Seat Ibiza GTI's which were lighter and much better looking. My experience of the Mk4 wasn't great either. My Dad had a GTI version and it was average, at best. Heavy, sluggish and dull to drive. It certainly wasn't a 'GTI' in that respect.
I'd have another in a heartbeat. I wouldn't, however, have a Mk3 or Mk4 Golf. I looked at a Mk3 and they were all pretty tired. Plus if you're looking at one of those, they have the same engine as the Seat Ibiza GTI's which were lighter and much better looking. My experience of the Mk4 wasn't great either. My Dad had a GTI version and it was average, at best. Heavy, sluggish and dull to drive. It certainly wasn't a 'GTI' in that respect.
300bhp/ton said:
considering some of the ugly crap in your garage you hardly have room to talk!
As for the Golfs, the Mk2 GTI is the one really. Very hard to find a decent one now, but I'm sure if you look hard enough and pay enough you could find one. The ride is soft compared to today's offerings, the interior is plasticky and they're not wildly fast but they are great cars. Everyone will look at your car adoringly, whereas they wouldn't look twice at say, a Smart Roadster. As long as you keep it standard, the old VW stuff has sadly seen a lot of attention from chavvy modders.
p4cks said:
I can vouch for the A3 1.8 T-Sport. I only paid a couple of grand for mine a few years ago and that was relatively low miles, full leather and the S3 alloys. It was one of the best cars I owned, purely down to the VFM factor.
I'd have another in a heartbeat. I wouldn't, however, have a Mk3 or Mk4 Golf. I looked at a Mk3 and they were all pretty tired. Plus if you're looking at one of those, they have the same engine as the Seat Ibiza GTI's which were lighter and much better looking. My experience of the Mk4 wasn't great either. My Dad had a GTI version and it was average, at best. Heavy, sluggish and dull to drive. It certainly wasn't a 'GTI' in that respect.
Good shout. I had one and it was indeed great value.I'd have another in a heartbeat. I wouldn't, however, have a Mk3 or Mk4 Golf. I looked at a Mk3 and they were all pretty tired. Plus if you're looking at one of those, they have the same engine as the Seat Ibiza GTI's which were lighter and much better looking. My experience of the Mk4 wasn't great either. My Dad had a GTI version and it was average, at best. Heavy, sluggish and dull to drive. It certainly wasn't a 'GTI' in that respect.
Alternatively get a paper round and buy a Mk5 GTI
yonex said:
So as per usual everything is crap unless you speifically say otherwise 
Nope, not at all my friend. As said, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. All I said is it was visually dull and boring. This in my view has no bearing on it's ability. On the contrary I suspect it is an exceeding capable car. But that doesn't stop it looking as dull as dish water.As for my car. Well I couldn't care less if people liked or loathed it visually. Personally I like it, it's quirky and fun, although it's far from pretty. But one thing it isn't is boring and dull to look at.
DickSkruttock said:
The Crack Fox said:
Mk3 1.8t 150bhp, wallowy, narrow power band, not that reliable. I had 2, 1 from new.
Mk3 VR6, nose heavy and not that quick really, sounds good though. I've tracked one.
Octavia VRs for me, same platform and a tad more practical.
Only a 1.8T in a mark 4 Mk3 VR6, nose heavy and not that quick really, sounds good though. I've tracked one.
Octavia VRs for me, same platform and a tad more practical.
Having had 2 of them I found them very relaible for 3 years and 50K of use. A simple remap sees 150>190 and better driveability.
I had a MK3 GTI 8v last year as a runaround and they are better built than the MK4s, although the engine suffered in the cold weather and the electric window regulators fail on them. Also rust is a killer behind the plastic trim.
Go for the later 2001 mk4 cars, there are differences such as turbo size and fly by wire throttle, the later cars capable of more power through a remap.
The 1.8 T suffers from a few faults, such as rotting breather pipes(£60 on ebay for silicone) temp senders (£6 ebay) turbo diverter valves/ sensors again, readily available. Most parts are cheap i bought 4x discs and pads from ebay delivered for £78.
Shop around, theres a load overpriced, mine was up at £2400 originally
Edited by nottyash on Wednesday 8th June 11:22
I recently purchased a Mk4 Golf V5 2.3 (170hp)for the g/f - we thought about the GTI models too, but as strong as they are, there are more things to go wrong with them - turbo, cambelt, water pump etc. V5 has a timing chain which should last for lifetime of the car.
She drove the V5 and loved the off beat sound (it's a bit more of a warble than the V6 plus theres no 4wd to go wrong) it has the optional sports springs and Santa Monica alloys and rides lovely - it handles the bends well with a little understeer but the rear is plyable. It is not a frantic hot hatch but it revs very cleanly and with it being a 20v if you keep it high in the rev range it will fly. The engine is torquey and makes for relaxed motorway driving too. It's not the ost economical but it was our second car so no drama really. For a 10 yr old car they have lots of kit and nice touches - eg auto wipers, auto dim mirror, climate control, esp, recaro seats. All in all i think they look great and still have the chunky VW look off to a T!
She drove the V5 and loved the off beat sound (it's a bit more of a warble than the V6 plus theres no 4wd to go wrong) it has the optional sports springs and Santa Monica alloys and rides lovely - it handles the bends well with a little understeer but the rear is plyable. It is not a frantic hot hatch but it revs very cleanly and with it being a 20v if you keep it high in the rev range it will fly. The engine is torquey and makes for relaxed motorway driving too. It's not the ost economical but it was our second car so no drama really. For a 10 yr old car they have lots of kit and nice touches - eg auto wipers, auto dim mirror, climate control, esp, recaro seats. All in all i think they look great and still have the chunky VW look off to a T!
Lets Torque said:
Don't buy off this guy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WIYWDWTNWI8
Being serious though, they are probably going to be thirsty, try and get a good one though as some have been 'chavved' up. I don't know if you can get a good one at that price or what as I'm not up on those generation Golfs.
I may be of no use to this thread and I may be wrong about the MPG. So if I have been useless. Forget what I said and someone that knows more or owned one in the past will be along shortly.
Hope I can be of some use though.
Edit: Good shout on the Octavia VRS. That's the one I would go for..
what the hell is wrong with americans, i would never do that to a car!http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WIYWDWTNWI8
Being serious though, they are probably going to be thirsty, try and get a good one though as some have been 'chavved' up. I don't know if you can get a good one at that price or what as I'm not up on those generation Golfs.
I may be of no use to this thread and I may be wrong about the MPG. So if I have been useless. Forget what I said and someone that knows more or owned one in the past will be along shortly.
Hope I can be of some use though.
Edit: Good shout on the Octavia VRS. That's the one I would go for..
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