RE: Lotus Poised To 'Twist Key' On Esprit's New V8

[julian64]

If lotus build this car, and use a bespoke engine, then they become the sucessor to TVR.

The only reason I bought my Cerbera was because it was an entirely British exotic including the engine. I also wanted V8. The flant plane crank was just a bonus.

There was no other British car to buy at the time that did this. I want a ferrari made in britain.

I wouldn't pay £123K for one though. If that came down to about 70-80K I would because the car would fullfill the rest of my criteria.

Maybe the car is for me second hand about two years after launch then .

I do hope they go ahead.

[zebedee]

TheRoadWarrior said:

It sounds great.

Unfortunately it also sounds like a load of nonsense.


The spec list sounds like it was writted by some 6-yr old top trumps enthusiast- brand new V8 stressed-member engine, 600bhp, hub motors, super lightweight, we'll take it racing blah blah.

Never gonna see the light of day.

wrong

[kambites]

julian64 said:

I wouldn't pay £123K for one though. If that came down to about 70-80K I would because the car would fullfill the rest of my criteria.

I think expecting it to be less than half the price of its competitors is a bit much.

[zebedee]

Bash Brannigan said:

Should Lotus not have re-thought the commercial value in such a broad product range since the Evora was a sales flop? I like the design of this Esprit, but in a time where Proton owned Lotus is coming up against several competitors from VAG then they really have to question whether there is enough of a gap in the market to sell sufficient numbers of these things.

you don't think they have done that? You think they just decided to do it after a few pints in the Norfolk Arms one night? Good grief.

[ZeeTacoe]

40% smaller than the Toyota engine, seems lotus have seen the light and gone with push rods

[zebedee]

scampbird said:

I've heard it will be manufactured by the Moomins, built out of Kryptonite and will run on pure hot air. Which is all Lotus is full of these days. Less sodding talk, more action.

examples please?

[CooperS]

The whole new line up looks great if not radical and anything different to their competitors

I cant see why i should care thou, they've announced current Elise owners arent the people they want buying into the Lotus brand (just look at the new magazine) and so i really dont care.

Good luck to them but tbh stop telling us what your going to do and just tell us when you've done it.

[zebedee]

scampbird said:

Yes apologies that anybody should dare to have an opinion that isn't 100% optimistic.

This is Lotus. How many times have we been promised great things from them, only for it to either not happen or be hugely underwhelming?

I mean good luck to them, I genuinely hope they succeed, but I'd like to see the results, not just read about a load of hot air from a bunch of marketing morons.

well seeing as you consider that the Elise and Evora are mildy disappointing cars, when they are in fact widely regarded as being excellent cars, I don't think you can claim to be someone particularly clued up about what Lotus is doing or saying to be honest.

[jsr]

I dont believe the success of Lotus rests on the Esprit. Yes, they are up against some big names and im sure potential buyers will need a very good reason to part with their money on the Lotus as opposed to Porsche/Ferrari/Mclaren etc.

However, the new Elise should be the company's bread and butter. If this is not done correctly, then they will face a difficult time ahead.

[Howard1650]

lovely looking car, just hope they can do it - shame I'll never afford one.

(can't believe Lotus are already talk up the idea of 'limited models', just launch the car with a great option list and allow owners to decide)

[zebedee]

CooperS said:

The whole new line up looks great if not radical and anything different to their competitors

I cant see why i should care thou, they've announced current Elise owners arent the people they want buying into the Lotus brand (just look at the new magazine) and so i really dont care.

Good luck to them but tbh stop telling us what your going to do and just tell us when you've done it.

It is important for Lotus to make a statement that it is 'arriving' and changing, why else announce all the cars together, and bring all these top people in from the industry? The whole idea is surely that they are trying to alter people's perception of Lotus as a brand BEFORE the cars arrive. I loved reading about the Evora design and development and couldn't wait to have a go in one and it didn't disappoint one jot, in fact it blew me away, so more news on the Esprit for me please, fingers crossed I can drive one of those too!

I'd rather read about a forthcoming new Esprit on pistonheads than a new Chinese MG saloon car.


edited to add I am an s1 elise owner and I am not surprised they don't see me as a potential customer for a £125k car, I don't take offence at that!

[Davey S2]

They would have been better off building the new Elan at around £80K than the Esprit IMO but have since canned the Elan.

[anonymous-user]

hmmmmm, a large (ish) capacity N/A engine that needs lots of revs to make a high specific output, sounds a bit silly to me for an engine series that will only go on sale in 2015(ish) and pursumably have a life time of >5 years......... (probably ok in a £300k+ car, but not in a £125k one. i.e. how much is a litre of unleaded going to be in 2015/2020??)

Now sure, they can add all sorts of "Hybrid" stuff to help get the economy back, but that all adds weight and cost. much better to just do a proper downsized FI engine like MAL.........

( i certainly wouldn't want to gamble my companies future on spending millions on what could turn out to be a dinosaur?)

[wobert]

Tib said:

Creating their own engine is also a bit of a gamble I reckon, but I suppose Lotus have been drafted in to give advice on some of the Vauxhall units before, so they might be alright...

That last statement is a bit of an understatement to say the least.......

Lotus Engineering has input into 90% of the gasoline engines sold into Europe, a bit removed from the "drafting in to give advice to Vauxhall" comment

Back in the ealry to mid 90's when I worked there on base engine design, GM (Opel to be precise) accounted for c60% of LE's turnover - since then they have worked with numerous main-stream european manufacturers, so I would presume the above 90% isn't too far wide of the mark.

I also had the honour of working on the design of the original V8 back in 93-94!

[scampbird]

zebedee said:

scampbird said:

Yes apologies that anybody should dare to have an opinion that isn't 100% optimistic.

This is Lotus. How many times have we been promised great things from them, only for it to either not happen or be hugely underwhelming?

I mean good luck to them, I genuinely hope they succeed, but I'd like to see the results, not just read about a load of hot air from a bunch of marketing morons.

well seeing as you consider that the Elise and Evora are mildy disappointing cars, when they are in fact widely regarded as being excellent cars, I don't think you can claim to be someone particularly clued up about what Lotus is doing or saying to be honest.

I have owned 2 Elises and recently test drove an Evora, which was a car I was interested in buying. I have been to the factory twice, I was a member of the official Lotus club back in the day and have spent far too many hours on Lotus forums.

At no point did I mention the Elise. Its a fine, fun little car, if slightly spoiled by a constant desire to push it "up market".

Again, apologies for having an opinion.

[julian64]

kambites said:

julian64 said:

I wouldn't pay £123K for one though. If that came down to about 70-80K I would because the car would fullfill the rest of my criteria.

I think expecting it to be less than half the price of its competitors is a bit much.

Not really. A long time ago I stopped believing there was any connection between what something cost to design and make, and what it sold for.

I could go and buy a second hand TVR Cerbera with no engine for 5K, I could then stick a Chevy LS9 in it for probably another fifteen.

Mega car peformance that would probably embarrass any one of those cars for £20K.

What you pay for something is what the market will stand, not what its worth. Marketing companys jobs revolve around convincing you there is no difference.

[kambites]

julian64 said:

What you pay for something is what the market will stand, not what its worth. Marketing companys jobs revolve around convincing you there is no difference.

I'd say that what the market will stand is the very definition of what it's worth... a car is worth whatever people will pay for it.

[LordGrover]

No PH-ometer? I'll give it a 9 anyway.

[andy_s]

Good stuff, progress on their plans from last year.

[Junglehop]

lovely looking thing, i dont think the white looks good though. its been seen in black and that just looks epic.

Huge shame they decided to Can the Elan as this was the looker of the bunch in my view. dropped as it was too close to the esprit apparently.

The engine solution is interesting, i concur with the above sentiments that a car of that price would not sell well with an off the shelf engine. it requires something homegrown and homebuilt. the V8 esprit engine was a great engine which experienced a few teething troubles but towards the end of its life was bang on. pushed out 350bhp in the V8's but was far more capable. Many have since been tuned. the gearbox was the limiting factor. incidentally i think im correct in thinking the budget for the V8 engine was more than that of the Elise!

i dont think the new Esprit wil carry the weight of lotus on its shoulders. it will merely be a showcase for the new Elise/Exige/Eterne et al a flagship if you will.

be interesting to find out how many they expect to shift.

I for one would be at the front of the que... i first need to win the lotto or find myself a securicor depot....