RE: Driven: 2012 M/Y Lotus Evora
Discussion
John145 said:
Well done for not reading the article.
the point is, Im disagreeing with Lotus' minor tweaks having resolved the issues Ive raised... the gearbox is still crap, a little tweak to the linkages etc wont cure it... it needs a new gearbox to improve it. 2nd the interior has had very minor tweaks... not enough to put in in Porsche quality leage... etc etc.
So you drove the automatic one and reckoned that the manual box is now better?
I'm still in the market for another lotus but this update seems like they've got some things sorted and other things still to sort. Definitely put me off until lotus are actually happy with the finished product.
Maybe by the time the convertible version comes out they'll have finished tweaking the interior and sorted the exhaust out. The convertible version will give the Evora a new lease of life as well as I don't think the small updates are enough to help boost sales.
Come on Lotus, sort it out. Many if us believe in the Evora.
I'm still in the market for another lotus but this update seems like they've got some things sorted and other things still to sort. Definitely put me off until lotus are actually happy with the finished product.
Maybe by the time the convertible version comes out they'll have finished tweaking the interior and sorted the exhaust out. The convertible version will give the Evora a new lease of life as well as I don't think the small updates are enough to help boost sales.
Come on Lotus, sort it out. Many if us believe in the Evora.
f1ten said:
the point is, Im disagreeing with Lotus' minor tweaks having resolved the issues Ive raised... the gearbox is still crap, a little tweak to the linkages etc wont cure it... it needs a new gearbox to improve it.
2nd the interior has had very minor tweaks... not enough to put in in Porsche quality leage... etc etc.
Yet the article says the gearshift works now, the exhaust is new making the engine sound like a proper sports car, the leather is better quality. Obviously it's not a porsche, it's hand built. Your first post raised the issues with old evoras completely missing the fact that the article states this car fixes them....2nd the interior has had very minor tweaks... not enough to put in in Porsche quality leage... etc etc.
herebebeasties said:
Why is it that people keep insisting that Lotus cars have to be considerably cheaper than the equivalent Porsche? Do you want them to go bankrupt? Why shouldn't they charge the same money if their product is as good?
The price of something is ultimately what people are prepared to pay for it. That isn't necessarily linked to cost of production or actual value but rather perceived value of the product and/or brand. I believe Porsche make (for the motor industry) unusually high margins on sale of their cars, principally because their brand is so strong. People are just willing to pay more for them.
Even if the Evora is technically as good as or even better than a Porsche most people would at the moment still be willing to pay more for the Porsche.
Lotus doesn't have to charge less but if it doesn't then most likely it won't be able to compete (there will always be people that would only buy a Lotus or only buy a Porsche - what Lotus needs to do is persuade people who haven't necessarily made up their mind already).
Lotus might have more success if they priced the Evora lower, got more people to buy it and then hope that the car is good enough to drive up the perception of the brand. As the brand's value increases then the market might also support higher prices. Trying to increase the perception of the brand by raising prices to those of the market leaders is probably not a strategy with a high likelihood of success.
FINALLY, hate to be an "I told you so" type but I've been very vocal in most of these Lotus threads in saying that the Evora was a "nearly car". They nearly nailed it bar the few problems like interior quality, engine noise etc so well done to Lotus for actually listening and fixing these issues.
I still think the car is priced a bit too high though. As another poster stated, it really needs to undercut the Cayman to be competitive. I know the article states they've only raised the facelifted Evora's price by 1.5% but IMO they shouldn't have raised it at all. In fact it could have done with a 5% decrease and then it might have had a chance at turning around those poor sales figures. If the Cayman didn't exist or if it wasn't so good the price would have been fine but unfortunately it does and at this present time, Lotus do not have the clout to compete with it on level terms. The Evora either has to be significantly better (it isn't) or cheaper.
I still think the car is priced a bit too high though. As another poster stated, it really needs to undercut the Cayman to be competitive. I know the article states they've only raised the facelifted Evora's price by 1.5% but IMO they shouldn't have raised it at all. In fact it could have done with a 5% decrease and then it might have had a chance at turning around those poor sales figures. If the Cayman didn't exist or if it wasn't so good the price would have been fine but unfortunately it does and at this present time, Lotus do not have the clout to compete with it on level terms. The Evora either has to be significantly better (it isn't) or cheaper.
Guvernator said:
I still think the car is priced a bit too high though. As another poster stated, it really needs to undercut the Cayman to be competitive. I know the article states they've only raised the facelifted Evora's price by 1.5% but IMO they shouldn't have raised it at all. In fact it could have done with a 5% decrease and then it might have had a chance at turning around those poor sales figures. If the Cayman didn't exist or if it wasn't so good the price would have been fine but unfortunately it does and at this present time, Lotus do not have the clout to compete with it on level terms. The Evora either has to be significantly better (it isn't) or cheaper.
It doesn't mention the changes in the standard kit level. I believe this more or less covers the increase in price, but may be wrong. Think its Xenon lights, body coloured handles and the Sport gearbox are all now standard.I think there's some room for negotiation on pricing, Murray's have some good deals on delivery mileage cars at the moment...
Guvernator said:
I still think the car is priced a bit too high though. As another poster stated, it really needs to undercut the Cayman to be competitive.
The Evora S undercuts even the cheapest Caymans here in Switzerland and that's before you look at the option list. I think you'll find that some of the issue in the UK is to do with the exchange rate. Porsche don't seem to have put up prices to reflect the last few years change in the exchange rate so are obviously running with lower margins than in the past. Lotus have been very good here at reducing local prices to reflect the strengthening Swissie, though I suspect there is still a small advantage in buying in the UK.Car looks great to me, always has done.
Linkage makes a massive difference to gearchange, I spent lots of late nights in the 90s trying to sort out gearchange on racing cars so I know from hard experience and could therefore believe what Lotus has done has made a massive difference.
Lotus are always going to stuggle against the Germans in terms of pricing just because of the volumes produced, given that limit I think they do a great job.
Nice one Lotus.
C43
Linkage makes a massive difference to gearchange, I spent lots of late nights in the 90s trying to sort out gearchange on racing cars so I know from hard experience and could therefore believe what Lotus has done has made a massive difference.
Lotus are always going to stuggle against the Germans in terms of pricing just because of the volumes produced, given that limit I think they do a great job.
Nice one Lotus.
C43
Looks good
They do like to tweak perhaps a tad to much at lotus, the Europa had much the same treatment, and by the tme they released the S version i think, when it really did look good, it was a bit to late
Having said that, the Evora started out much better than the Europa and has a lot more support and investment in it, i think it looks good
I was certain my Next Lotus would be a V8 Esprit, but i'm not so sure now, the Early Evora's will likely come down a fair bit over the next 2 or 3 years and could well make a more tempting propostion
They do like to tweak perhaps a tad to much at lotus, the Europa had much the same treatment, and by the tme they released the S version i think, when it really did look good, it was a bit to late
Having said that, the Evora started out much better than the Europa and has a lot more support and investment in it, i think it looks good
I was certain my Next Lotus would be a V8 Esprit, but i'm not so sure now, the Early Evora's will likely come down a fair bit over the next 2 or 3 years and could well make a more tempting propostion
adeelster said:
This is all very well and good but it all smacks of poor professionalism that the car wasn't launched like this in the first place.
No it doesn't. The Evora was developed with a small team and smaller budget in the old Lotus days. Its amazing given that fact but there were always going to be areas that didn't quite make the grade. More money and people and it is where it should have been. A lot of the changes shown on the new car have already been implemented as part of on-going improvements to the model. Visually the changes here are minor> Current owners were most concerned that it would be heavily restyled like that stupid Autocar image which could have had a big affect on residuals but thankfully that wasn't the case.
j_s14a said:
It seems these days that everyone wants a British sports car, except the British 
See TVR. That, and the unbridled adulation for German posh white goods, which is not shared to anything like the same degree by us on the continent. I do hope the Swizzlemyshizzle connection won't tarnish the brand beyond repair among connoisseurs, though.
Edited by 900T-R on Friday 9th September 09:34
adeelster said:
This is all very well and good but it all smacks of poor professionalism that the car wasn't launched like this in the first place. How can people have any confidence in the product? I suspect a lot of poor sods that have bought the current Evora will be apoplectic now. This doesn't happen with the germans. They do have facelifts but not so soon after launch.
The price of the car is all wrong. Most people think of it as a Cayman rival but it is priced closer to a 911. And because of all the various issues I would rather have a Cayman. I am no Lotus-hater, I would love them to do well to give us all a credible rival to the boringly ubiquitous germans but this is not the way to do it.
Seems so harsh to be criticising a car in this manner when it is one of the finest handling cars on sale...
OK agree about the price issue. The Evora is overpriced and not special enough at that price, but it is a fantastic car.The price of the car is all wrong. Most people think of it as a Cayman rival but it is priced closer to a 911. And because of all the various issues I would rather have a Cayman. I am no Lotus-hater, I would love them to do well to give us all a credible rival to the boringly ubiquitous germans but this is not the way to do it.
Seems so harsh to be criticising a car in this manner when it is one of the finest handling cars on sale...
I can't agree that this is a lack of professionalism though. BMW is one maker I can think of that during the life cycle of their cars regulalrly bring out upgrades and tweeks and no-one criticises them for it.
another example is the Honda S2000, how many handling, body and other tweeks did that receive over its life. And yet no-one says that they should have brought it out like that from the off.
A good manufacturer works with the customer base to improve their cars, or they go out of business. So I say Lotus have done well to do this..
And selfishly I hope it does affect the residuals on the other cars. I've wanted one from launch but just never could justify the cost.
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