Audi vs BMW And Keep It Clean Guys
Discussion
I've driven a variety of both marques over the years, both lowly models and the RS/M versions. Ten years ago I would have said that Audis were all dull understeering family cars with over servoed brakes, and BMWs were well balanced with better handling, more driver focused and with better engines. Lately though my opinions of both have changed. Audi interiors have just got better and better designed from an ergonomics point of view, and the suspension better designed and developed. Audi brakes are also no longer unusably sensitive. Even the steering, once an Audi weakpoint, is now reasonable in a lot of their cars. Audi have also retained fairly respectable styling. BMW on the other hand have produced some complete mingers from an external styling point of view, and for their interiors they still haven't quite got the ergonomic excellence of Audi. BMW have even pandered to the modern trait of brakes so over-servoed that heel and toe becomes difficult. BMW also struggle on with a poorer basic suspension design, and the dampers and springs often don't seem to match the wheels and tyres that their cars are fitted with, giving a jiggly ride on all but the standard 16" wheels. BMW have also lost their way somewhat with initial throttle response, never quite mastering drive by wire, whereas Mercedes and Audi seem to have made the best of a bad situation in that area. Engines were always BMWs strongpoint by a long way, mainly shown in terms of bhp/mpg, but Audi are catching up very fast. In summary, my current opinion for 2010/2011 models is that Audi build better cars than BMW, but the only sticking point is that Audis are either front wheel drive or four wheel drive, which in my book can never be as natural and as balanced as a rear drive chassis, and indeed having driven various Audis and BMWs back to back, actually isn't in the real world either. So for me I'd still go for BMW every time.
Edited by RobM77 on Wednesday 14th September 10:52
I've never driven the Audi RS models or the BMW M models so can't comment on which top end version is best. I have driven a few A4's and a few 3 series in various trim, spec and engine sizes.
The BMW's are just much nicer to drive. The Audi's feel solid but the steering is a bit numb, brakes are over servoed and the cars are just not dynamic enough when cornering or pushing on for me. Even the basic E46 318 I drove steered, braked and handled better than any other saloon I'd driven. OK so the engine is a tad underpowered!
I'm sure come the winter I may regret not buying a Quattro but for the rest of the year, I'll stick with my 325.
The BMW's are just much nicer to drive. The Audi's feel solid but the steering is a bit numb, brakes are over servoed and the cars are just not dynamic enough when cornering or pushing on for me. Even the basic E46 318 I drove steered, braked and handled better than any other saloon I'd driven. OK so the engine is a tad underpowered!
I'm sure come the winter I may regret not buying a Quattro but for the rest of the year, I'll stick with my 325.
Edited by toon10 on Wednesday 14th September 11:05
Audi & BMW models are so closely matched - both well-made, reliable (generally!), economical, safe, convey premium image (argubly perhaps) and even cost pretty much the same. They even like to charge OTT for options.
But the only difference is one handles superbly and the other handles, at best, 'wooly' and at worse just plain dull...
So why would you take the Audi over a BMW? Apart from the 4wd models i see no real reason TBH, unless someone can genuinely tell me?
But the only difference is one handles superbly and the other handles, at best, 'wooly' and at worse just plain dull...
So why would you take the Audi over a BMW? Apart from the 4wd models i see no real reason TBH, unless someone can genuinely tell me?
The Quattro system on the larger cars like the RS4 and RS6 is much better than the system on the TT (which isnt very good imo, and actually makes the car less fun to drive than the 2WD version, although there is more traction).
I would say the BMWs are better, but if you are looking for a AWD practical car I would also be looking at the Subarus and Mitsubishis unless you are getting into RS4/RS6 money.
I would say the BMWs are better, but if you are looking for a AWD practical car I would also be looking at the Subarus and Mitsubishis unless you are getting into RS4/RS6 money.
LocoCoco said:
OMNIO said:
FWD / RWD wouldnt factor into my thinking for a car i was going to be using every day.
It's top of the list for my every day car. Edited by RobM77 on Wednesday 14th September 11:20
RobM77 said:
Me too. There's this strange thinking that goes round that says RWD/FWD only matters on track or when driving fast, but I completely disagree - whether a car is RWD or FWD hugely affects its sub limit (road speed) handling.
I agree. Ive bought a E36 325i Coupe (with two other mates, plan to strip and track), and its a lovely drive on the road. The steering is direct with good feedback, very nice balance. One other thing that makes it nice, is its on 15 inch wheels with 55 profile tyres. Doesnt looks fashionable, but my god the ride is like a magic carpet!RobCrezz said:
RobM77 said:
Me too. There's this strange thinking that goes round that says RWD/FWD only matters on track or when driving fast, but I completely disagree - whether a car is RWD or FWD hugely affects its sub limit (road speed) handling.
I agree. Ive bought a E36 325i Coupe (with two other mates, plan to strip and track), and its a lovely drive on the road. The steering is direct with good feedback, very nice balance. One other thing that makes it nice, is its on 15 inch wheels with 55 profile tyres. Doesnt looks fashionable, but my god the ride is like a magic carpet!
And it can afford to because it doesn't have to control the mass of engine, gearbox, diff and driveshafts all at one end of the car.Even those baggy old Mercedes taxis that pick you up from airports abroad feel beautifully balanced to me. In fact they represent some of my first experiences of rear wheel drive - that feeling of unity and balance as the car corners is unique to RWD, and felt as such even as a child before I learnt to drive.
Melvin Udall said:
LocoCoco said:
It's top of the list for my every day car.
Why?infradig said:
This is like trying to discuss with my wife why I'm reluctant to get the 'nice red Audi estate' (actually a 55 plate 2.7tdi quattro A6) to replace my e39 diesel with quarter of a million miles on it. I don't like the look of e60/1's but just know I'd regret it the first decent bit of road (the switch the dsc off/move the backrest up a couple of notches/turn the radio off sort of road)I came across. For 95% of my motorway slogging an A6 would be perfect though!
Sorry, bit what exactly are you implying? As for an everyday car, I don't particularly see why RWD or FWD has to come into the equation, unless it is your only car. Going to the shops, or the drive to work, or picking the wfe up from her friends, or taking the kids to school, ormdriving to a holiday home doesn't really require it, to be honest.
Melvin Udall said:
Why?
Burnouts make me happy, I feel daft doing them in a FWD car but love fishtailing it about at slow speeds pulling away from junctions. Gravel roads are so much fun. When it snows its a real challenge to make it along some roads.All my journeys contain burnouts or attempted drifts, it's just what I enjoy.
I've owned each,
Audi V8 S4 - Very nicely screwed together, horrible ride though and quite dull to drive.
Alpina D3 - Powered by Satins fuel, but other than that, a more fun car and i think better looking.
If I had both sitting on the drive now, I'd take the Alpina, even though it basically 320d in drag, it's far more pleasurable to drive.
I'm not fan of new Audi styling either. BMW have released some horros I know, but at least their model line up doesn't start with the A1 and copy at various sizes up to the A1 250%, or A8 as it's normally known.
Audi V8 S4 - Very nicely screwed together, horrible ride though and quite dull to drive.
Alpina D3 - Powered by Satins fuel, but other than that, a more fun car and i think better looking.
If I had both sitting on the drive now, I'd take the Alpina, even though it basically 320d in drag, it's far more pleasurable to drive.
I'm not fan of new Audi styling either. BMW have released some horros I know, but at least their model line up doesn't start with the A1 and copy at various sizes up to the A1 250%, or A8 as it's normally known.
I can feel the difference in balance between FWD and RWD cars at any speed. I just don't care about the difference in my big heavy family barge. I care about other aspects of the car more than I care about perfect balance. I spend more time hoping our 1-year-old isn't about to vomit due to not being used to a front-facing car seat than whether the car feels balanced in rush hour traffic.
There's a difference between noticing the RWD dynamics and prioritising them.
There's a difference between noticing the RWD dynamics and prioritising them.
Snowboy said:
rudecherub said:
At a glance you can really see the difference in the style of tyres.
See how the tyres on the left compact the snow under them but the tyres on the right cut through the snow so the rubber is in contact with the ground underneath.
I'm not sure why it's in the Audi vs BMW thread though.
It did used to be that BMWs were driven by w
kers and Audis were cool.
Now Audis are driven by wkers and BMWs are cool.
Drive them all and pick the one you like best.
Ideally I need an RS3 to go with the wifes 1M.
Both great but overpriced cars. Sold to many just for the badge.
and while we are on the subject don't forget to have a look at Mercedes to.
kers and Audis were cool.Now Audis are driven by w
kers and BMWs are cool.Drive them all and pick the one you like best.
Ideally I need an RS3 to go with the wifes 1M.
Both great but overpriced cars. Sold to many just for the badge.
and while we are on the subject don't forget to have a look at Mercedes to.
goldblum said:
Snowboy said:
rudecherub said:
At a glance you can really see the difference in the style of tyres.
See how the tyres on the left compact the snow under them but the tyres on the right cut through the snow so the rubber is in contact with the ground underneath.
I'm not sure why it's in the Audi vs BMW thread though.
The one with the big blocky tyres keeps traction.
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