RE: Video: Viper ACR's Rapid 'Ring Time
Discussion
Defconluke said:
Ring 'records' are getting pretty ridiculous these days. It's going to be fun to see manufacturers come up with the criteria for which their car is the fastest.
How long before we see a company saying they set the record for a 3-wheel-drive car wth 4 seats, a front mounted V7 engine with more than 153 cars produced?
By all means, set aa time in a car, but if it's not the fastest then don't try and say that it is.
I myself hold the record for going round the 'ring on an electric wheelchair. It took me just under four hours. Mind you, I was playing the trumpet and juggling a couple of cats at the time. And it was raining, so I couldn't get the power down properly coming out the carousel......How long before we see a company saying they set the record for a 3-wheel-drive car wth 4 seats, a front mounted V7 engine with more than 153 cars produced?
By all means, set aa time in a car, but if it's not the fastest then don't try and say that it is.
Wardy76 said:
I myself hold the record for going round the 'ring on an electric wheelchair. It took me just under four hours. Mind you, I was playing the trumpet and juggling a couple of cats at the time. And it was raining, so I couldn't get the power down properly coming out the carousel......
That paints a very impressive mental picture. LuS1fer said:
Seems to hold the Laguna Seca record too:
http://www.motortrend.com/features/laguna_lap/
When you say "too" you're implying it has the ring record..it doesn'thttp://www.motortrend.com/features/laguna_lap/
Dagnut said:
LuS1fer said:
Seems to hold the Laguna Seca record too:
http://www.motortrend.com/features/laguna_lap/
When you say "too" you're implying it has the ring record..it doesn'thttp://www.motortrend.com/features/laguna_lap/
j3ffers said:
I'm not the most technically minded, and yes there's clearly a lot of torque on the car, but why does the gearstick move around so much under acceleration? Would it not remain engaged in position, vs the flexing you can see on the in-car shots?
The car has factory Rubber Engine and Transmission mounts, there is some flex in them even new. Many of us swap the mounts to Woodhouse Polly mounts which are much stiffer. The gear stick is also sprung, it returns to a central position when in Neutral. Most of us change the long gear stick to a shorter aftermarket one, so the combined engine transmission flex and chassis flex, added with the long gearshift is the reason you are seeing the movement 
Here is a Pic of a Hurst Aftermarket shifter.
Standard shifter mechanism with a short aftermarket shaft knob
Dagnut said:
LuS1fer said:
Seems to hold the Laguna Seca record too:
http://www.motortrend.com/features/laguna_lap/
When you say "too" you're implying it has the ring record..it doesn'thttp://www.motortrend.com/features/laguna_lap/
http://www.autodebut.com/2011/dodge-viper-acr-x-ho...
I would have thought that to qualify as a production car it should hold a type approval in a major first world country (ie one with a recognised vehicle type approval process). The Viper ACR holds federal type approval in the USA. The SR8 was put through a SINGLE vehicle approval to make it road legal, but that does not make it a production road car.
Edited by ViperDave on Wednesday 28th September 21:20
I haven't watched the video yet because i'm at work. But the run they did a couple of years ago was very impressive.
I'm sure if "going around the ring as fast as possible" was the only objective, it wouldn't have the creature comforts it has that a Radical doesn't.
Maybe they should set the record (there is no such thing, M400 NBL) with 5 bags of cement in the boot. I don't recall Porsche or Ferrari being constantly compared to Radicals when setting a time around the ring!
I'm sure if "going around the ring as fast as possible" was the only objective, it wouldn't have the creature comforts it has that a Radical doesn't.
Maybe they should set the record (there is no such thing, M400 NBL) with 5 bags of cement in the boot. I don't recall Porsche or Ferrari being constantly compared to Radicals when setting a time around the ring!
Radicals are also only built to customer order.
You can't go into a showroom, pick one and drive it home. (As you could with a Viper, or maybe still can if you're lucky).
That's a true production car. A car built on a production line. Built before it's sold.
(Plus it's got a roof, windscreen, electric windows, boot space, airbags, etc).
You can't go into a showroom, pick one and drive it home. (As you could with a Viper, or maybe still can if you're lucky).
That's a true production car. A car built on a production line. Built before it's sold.
(Plus it's got a roof, windscreen, electric windows, boot space, airbags, etc).
vz-r_dave said:
Yes it does, it holds the record for a road worthy car with a roof, a boot and a windscreen.
f
k the radicals time and all who are ANAL enough to quote it. pathetic
Pathetic? you seem to be forgetting the gumpert..or is that to expensive? or exotic? or is it cos it's mid engined? or is the boot not big enough? What criteria exactly do you want to use to make the doge have a "record"...and as for anal I don't really give a fiddler w@nk either way ..you're the one getting wound up here.f
k the radicals time and all who are ANAL enough to quote it. patheticDagnut said:
Pathetic? you seem to be forgetting the gumpert..or is that to expensive? or exotic? or is it cos it's mid engined? or is the boot not big enough? What criteria exactly do you want to use to make the doge have a "record"...and as for anal I don't really give a fiddler w@nk either way ..you're the one getting wound up here.
Sorry mate, I was completely leathered when I sent that.Agree on your points.
Dagnut said:
Pathetic? you seem to be forgetting the gumpert..or is that to expensive? or exotic? or is it cos it's mid engined? or is the boot not big enough? What criteria exactly do you want to use to make the doge have a "record"...and as for anal I don't really give a fiddler w@nk either way ..you're the one getting wound up here.
I'm no American car fanboy but the anti-Viper stuff is a bit silly, as are most of these comparisons.The Apollo ('Speed') managed it half a second quicker despite the fact it is essentially a race car made road legal. The Viper isn't. It's a production car that has a special edition so that you can drive to a race-track, lap faster than any other production car, then drive it home again (just like the 'good old days'). They made thousands of SRT-10s and hundreds of ACRs. The car on the 'Ring is exactly the same as one you could buy from a dealer.
Has anyone ever taken delivery of a Gumpert Apollo Speed? Is it a fixed production car or is it simply a development car they've taken to the 'Ring, having shown lots of 'variants' at motor shows, continually altering it, etc.? Was the time independently verified? It may manage to wangle its way to being road-registered in *some places*, but it's not a global car like the Viper. It's also a pseudo-racing car, to such an extent that Roland Gumpert said you needed a racing license to drive one. My mum could get into an ACR and drive it (even though she'd be scared to go over about 2,000rpm).
Yet despite the massive contrast in purpose, ethos and usability, the result of several hundred kilos of added lightness and a couple of hundred hp is merely half a second.
Same debates were brought up when the SSC Aero went faster than a Veyron. How many customer cars in that form did they deliver? It's not hard for a car with a changeable specification to run round with a grenade spec engine that people don't mind detonating; that doesn't have to conform to various regs or be homogenous; that can't simply be bought off the shelf.
LongLiveTazio said:
I'm no American car fanboy but the anti-Viper stuff is a bit silly, as are most of these comparisons.
The Apollo ('Speed') managed it half a second quicker despite the fact it is essentially a race car made road legal. The Viper isn't. It's a production car that has a special edition so that you can drive to a race-track, lap faster than any other production car, then drive it home again (just like the 'good old days'). They made thousands of SRT-10s and hundreds of ACRs. The car on the 'Ring is exactly the same as one you could buy from a dealer.
Has anyone ever taken delivery of a Gumpert Apollo Speed? Is it a fixed production car or is it simply a development car they've taken to the 'Ring, having shown lots of 'variants' at motor shows, continually altering it, etc.? Was the time independently verified? It may manage to wangle its way to being road-registered in *some places*, but it's not a global car like the Viper. It's also a pseudo-racing car, to such an extent that Roland Gumpert said you needed a racing license to drive one. My mum could get into an ACR and drive it (even though she'd be scared to go over about 2,000rpm).
Yet despite the massive contrast in purpose, ethos and usability, the result of several hundred kilos of added lightness and a couple of hundred hp is merely half a second.
Same debates were brought up when the SSC Aero went faster than a Veyron. How many customer cars in that form did they deliver? It's not hard for a car with a changeable specification to run round with a grenade spec engine that people don't mind detonating; that doesn't have to conform to various regs or be homogenous; that can't simply be bought off the shelf.
Who said anything Anti-Viper??? It's an awesome car... I'm just stating they are claiming a record they don't have....yeah it's probably not a fair comparison to a 300k gumpert(700hp btw)but what exactly are the criteria for this "record"? is it price? production number? usability? Their claiming their car is the fastest ca5r you can buy and use on the road to lap the ring...it isn't. The Gumpert was tested by sport auto btw.The Apollo ('Speed') managed it half a second quicker despite the fact it is essentially a race car made road legal. The Viper isn't. It's a production car that has a special edition so that you can drive to a race-track, lap faster than any other production car, then drive it home again (just like the 'good old days'). They made thousands of SRT-10s and hundreds of ACRs. The car on the 'Ring is exactly the same as one you could buy from a dealer.
Has anyone ever taken delivery of a Gumpert Apollo Speed? Is it a fixed production car or is it simply a development car they've taken to the 'Ring, having shown lots of 'variants' at motor shows, continually altering it, etc.? Was the time independently verified? It may manage to wangle its way to being road-registered in *some places*, but it's not a global car like the Viper. It's also a pseudo-racing car, to such an extent that Roland Gumpert said you needed a racing license to drive one. My mum could get into an ACR and drive it (even though she'd be scared to go over about 2,000rpm).
Yet despite the massive contrast in purpose, ethos and usability, the result of several hundred kilos of added lightness and a couple of hundred hp is merely half a second.
Same debates were brought up when the SSC Aero went faster than a Veyron. How many customer cars in that form did they deliver? It's not hard for a car with a changeable specification to run round with a grenade spec engine that people don't mind detonating; that doesn't have to conform to various regs or be homogenous; that can't simply be bought off the shelf.
Dagnut said:
Who said anything Anti-Viper??? It's an awesome car... I'm just stating they are claiming a record they don't have....yeah it's probably not a fair comparison to a 300k gumpert(700hp btw)but what exactly are the criteria for this "record"? is it price? production number? usability? Their claiming their car is the fastest ca5r you can buy and use on the road to lap the ring...it isn't. The Gumpert was tested by sport auto btw.
Didn't specifically mean you being anti-Viper, just some of the other posts. Minute an American car does anything good on this site there's always loads of people chiming in about how it must be dodgy, or won't handle, or the interior's crap, or... All cars are about compromise, that's why we don't all like the same thing? Doesn't diminish the achievement.I think the criteria is simply that the ACR is a production car. I personally don't think the Gumpert is. And although you say 700bhp when it was announced it was "up to 800", which is what I mean about a single example being fiddled with. It's inconsistent, it's not like there is a constant production specification.
IMO the Gumpert should be compared to Radicals: ostensibly racing cars that can be made road legal but would never be used on it and have huge race-car compromises. The Viper, LF-A, etc. are the other way on, road cars focused for track work when you fancy it.
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