Most responsive RWD 6 cylinder car
Discussion
Grovsie26 said:
flatline84 said:
because FWD cars are automatically disqualified
In that case so is you're opinion for being totally retarded, a bit like yourself, id imagine.OP , I can tell you that the GTV6 had the most responsive engine I have driven, but that would be 25 years old or more by now, so it's probably not what you're looking for.
Alfanatic said:
The topic says RWD. Quite funny that a whole bunch of FWD cars then get mentioned but the OP is called retarded when he points out that they aren't what he wants....
OP , I can tell you that the GTV6 had the most responsive engine I have driven, but that would be 25 years old or more by now, so it's probably not what you're looking for.
thread title was altered, that's why. initially it simply said "best 6 cylinder"OP , I can tell you that the GTV6 had the most responsive engine I have driven, but that would be 25 years old or more by now, so it's probably not what you're looking for.
300bhp/ton said:
V8 on individual throttle bodies then and a custom ECU map.
How many six cylinder V8s are there? Any of BMW's M Power sixes (particularly the S54 in CSL form) or Porsche's NA flat six in any of its GT3 incarnations, presumably the latest 4.0 is the best of the breed.
The Jaguar XK six in carbureted guise is a pretty special and responsive thing to find oneself sat behind too, likewise TVR's Speed Six.
Herman Toothrot said:
You seem to have missed the 6 cylinder bit...
Not really. I know the OP said 6 cylinder, but they also seemed to fail to add why or what they where looking at. From what I've read in the rest of the thread it seems to actually be a what car for a car with really good throttle response.Suspect something like a AJPV8 Cerbera would be a good bet.
300bhp/ton said:
Not really. I know the OP said 6 cylinder, but they also seemed to fail to add why or what they where looking at. From what I've read in the rest of the thread it seems to actually be a what car for a car with really good throttle response.
Suspect something like a AJPV8 Cerbera would be a good bet.
He also asked what others are as smooth. A TVR V8 (either flat-plane or cross-plane) is nowhere near in the same ballpark of smoothness as an inline or flat six. From a technical point of view - they simply can't be, although some flat and inline 8s can. As can a V12. Suspect something like a AJPV8 Cerbera would be a good bet.
Wiki article on engine balance said:
There are four different forces and moments of vibration that can occur in an engine design: free forces of the first order, free forces of the second order, free moments of the first order and free moments of the second order.
The straight-6, certain straight-8, flat-6, flat-8 with 180 degree firing, flat-12, flat-16 with 90 degree firing, V12, V16, and W16 designs have none of these forces or moments of vibration and hence are the naturally smoothest engine designs. (See the Bosch Automotive Handbook, Sixth Edition, pages 459-463 for details.)
The straight-6, certain straight-8, flat-6, flat-8 with 180 degree firing, flat-12, flat-16 with 90 degree firing, V12, V16, and W16 designs have none of these forces or moments of vibration and hence are the naturally smoothest engine designs. (See the Bosch Automotive Handbook, Sixth Edition, pages 459-463 for details.)
flatline84 said:
what about the S50 and S52 engines, in the E36 M3s? Do they also have throttle delay?
UK E36 M3s only had S50 engines in B30 (3.0) and B32 (3.2 "Evo") forms. The S52 was a North American engine and quite different in design and power output. S50 uses six individual throttles, connected by cable to the pedal just as previous Motorsport sixes all did, the S52 uses a single throttle on a more standard BMW 1 into 6 inlet manifold. M52 sixes 1995-2000 use cables, M54 sixes 2000-2005 use "drive by wire" electronic throttle modules, so there's no longer a physical connection between the pedal and the throttle, it's entirely electronic. (S designated engines = Motorsport engine, M or since 2001 N designated engines = standard production series engine)
The S54 six as used in E46 M3, M3 CS and CSL, along with late Z3 and all Z4 M Roadsters and M Coupes (earlier Z3 Ms used S50 B32s) shifted from cable to electronic throttle operation (which meant those cars could then be equipped with DSC). However there isn't the response delay of the vanilla M54 family owing to the fact that S54s are still equipped with six individual throttles rather than one as in M54s.
Some people have found ways to modify their S54 to use a cable throttle, the main difference then being the "weight" of the throttle pedal, electronic ones don't have any real weight to them as they're not physically operating the throttles, whereas in all previous BMW sixes, they did. It's quite easy to feel the difference by driving an E46 328i and 330i back to back.
Edited by Zwoelf on Tuesday 11th October 19:42
300bhp/ton said:
Herman Toothrot said:
You seem to have missed the 6 cylinder bit...
Not really. I know the OP said 6 cylinder, but they also seemed to fail to add why or what they where looking at. From what I've read in the rest of the thread it seems to actually be a what car for a car with really good throttle response.Suspect something like a AJPV8 Cerbera would be a good bet.
flatline84 said:
Im interested in this one. Were they common in manual version? good drive? I know it was a very LONG engine, other than that a bit of a dark horse, albeit perhaps a worthy left-field choice?
I remember back about 6 years ago I looked at Supras and the classifieds at the time were full of n/a manual Supras, all very cheap as well, a good £2K cheaper than the Turbos.http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/3104127.htm
To early to be a VVTi I think, but you get the idea
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