Discussion
That's the problem right there.
'Old farts'. What does that even mean. A decent car is a decent car.
You're giving the kid (no disrespect meant there as I'm only 23 myself) the idea that certain cars should only be driven by certain age groups.
Why are high performance saloons only a viable choice for 'old farts'. He asked for performance and comfort so I gave him suggestions.
At 23 with the required cash, I would be driving around in something like this without the chav bits.
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/3309814.htm
Far more interesting than what any of the people within our age group typically drive.
'Old farts'. What does that even mean. A decent car is a decent car.
You're giving the kid (no disrespect meant there as I'm only 23 myself) the idea that certain cars should only be driven by certain age groups.
Why are high performance saloons only a viable choice for 'old farts'. He asked for performance and comfort so I gave him suggestions.
At 23 with the required cash, I would be driving around in something like this without the chav bits.
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/3309814.htm
Far more interesting than what any of the people within our age group typically drive.
Corsair7 said:
Tonberry said:
snorkel sucker said:
I can't understand why you would want to pay almost £2000 A YEAR purely to insure the car. And then spend most of your time driving it in an urban environment. You WILL suffer with mpg in an ST in that situation. I ran one (an upgraded one running 290bhp) and it got me 28mpg on a motorway/dual carriageway commute. You will get less.
Take the advice from many experienced people on here. Don't go wasting your money at your age on something that is going to cost you the earth to buy and run, purely because you think it looks cool. Use your head, and some ideas on here, to get something which is fun to drive and cool in a way not obvious to your average Joe.
You will have much more fun talking to people about your car, probably meet many more interesting people from car clubs/enthusiasts etc, and spend less money.
If you have £5k saved - fair play to you. I would spend that, or less, and not worry about being in debt.
I would also strongly suggest that you spend some of the money you save doing some trackdays and / or performance car tuition. At 21, that would be the best money you could spend, and you will get much more enjoyment out of your performance cars now and in the future.
This. Take the advice from many experienced people on here. Don't go wasting your money at your age on something that is going to cost you the earth to buy and run, purely because you think it looks cool. Use your head, and some ideas on here, to get something which is fun to drive and cool in a way not obvious to your average Joe.
You will have much more fun talking to people about your car, probably meet many more interesting people from car clubs/enthusiasts etc, and spend less money.
If you have £5k saved - fair play to you. I would spend that, or less, and not worry about being in debt.
I would also strongly suggest that you spend some of the money you save doing some trackdays and / or performance car tuition. At 21, that would be the best money you could spend, and you will get much more enjoyment out of your performance cars now and in the future.
If you're happy with a car that returns 20MPG then you might as well do it properly.
You claim you want comfort and performance so take a look at the following.
Volvo S60R
BMW 328i E36
BMW 330i E46
BMW 530i E39
BMW 540i E39
Alpina B10 V8
Alpina B10 3.3
Mercedes C43 AMG
Surely driving around in a 4.4 ltr V8 BMW is far cooler than a Ford Focus (lets be honest here, you want one because your mates will think it's cool and you want to impress them).
Apart from the AMG Mercedes, none of them should cost much more to run than the ST. They can all be purchased far cheaper than a decent ST can too which will go along way in offsetting fuel and maintenance costs.
All of the above cars will seat 5 too so you have no excuse
Edited by Corsair7 on Wednesday 23 November 14:05
It's all relative really.
If a good example is aquired of any of those cars then large bills should not be warranted. I admit the E39 does a few cooling system foibles and a slight penchant for bushes but besides that, what else? Or have I just been spending far too large in the bargain barge thread?
Insurance on all but the AMG and two Alpina shouldn't be any more to insure than the ST.
We've gathered that fuel consumption will be similar.
So that leaves servicing and maintenance.
Again, all but the AMG and two Alpina should be similar in costs.
The lower purchase price of a E39 540i leaves 4-5k in the bag as a contingency fund.
Sorted.
If a good example is aquired of any of those cars then large bills should not be warranted. I admit the E39 does a few cooling system foibles and a slight penchant for bushes but besides that, what else? Or have I just been spending far too large in the bargain barge thread?
Insurance on all but the AMG and two Alpina shouldn't be any more to insure than the ST.
We've gathered that fuel consumption will be similar.
So that leaves servicing and maintenance.
Again, all but the AMG and two Alpina should be similar in costs.
The lower purchase price of a E39 540i leaves 4-5k in the bag as a contingency fund.
Sorted.
3000GT ANT said:
if you want a hot hatch buy an Alfa 147 GTA, i think it is the best and i own a focus ST. The focus ST is a very good car, i get anywhere between 17-30mpg and the boot has yet to let me down when carrying stuff. Unless you need 5 seats get the ST3 as it comes with heated leather.
Get an average of 26MPG in the 147GTA with mixed driving. Motorway will easily see over 30MPG but floor it and you can see 15MPG easily!!!!Still wouldn't ever get rid of it.
Tonberry said:
That's the problem right there.
'Old farts'. What does that even mean. A decent car is a decent car.
You're giving the kid (no disrespect meant there as I'm only 23 myself) the idea that certain cars should only be driven by certain age groups.
Why are high performance saloons only a viable choice for 'old farts'. He asked for performance and comfort so I gave him suggestions.
Come on, you know exactly what he means.'Old farts'. What does that even mean. A decent car is a decent car.
You're giving the kid (no disrespect meant there as I'm only 23 myself) the idea that certain cars should only be driven by certain age groups.
Why are high performance saloons only a viable choice for 'old farts'. He asked for performance and comfort so I gave him suggestions.
AMGs and Alpinas are lovely, but they are expensive to insure and maintain, so they make more sense for older and wealthier folk than they do for 21 year olds.
For a lot of younger people, four door saloons just aren't cool, no matter what's under the bonnet.
Tonberry said:
This.
If you're happy with a car that returns 20MPG then you might as well do it properly.
You claim you want comfort and performance so take a look at the following.
Volvo S60R
As much as I love this car, I wouldn't recommend it to the OP. They can be had so, so cheap these days but if the trick suspension goes bang it can be upwards of £1000 a corner to fix. That said, the S60 is a good suggestion. An older S60 T5 can be had for peanuts these days and are seriously quick cars, returning about the same MPG as the Focus ST but being a better car overall. I used to have an S60 2.0L Turbo and I loved it. Had I not already 'been there and done that' with the S60 I'd be quite happy to buy an S60 T5 now. If you're happy with a car that returns 20MPG then you might as well do it properly.
You claim you want comfort and performance so take a look at the following.
Volvo S60R
excel monkey said:
Tonberry said:
That's the problem right there.
'Old farts'. What does that even mean. A decent car is a decent car.
You're giving the kid (no disrespect meant there as I'm only 23 myself) the idea that certain cars should only be driven by certain age groups.
Why are high performance saloons only a viable choice for 'old farts'. He asked for performance and comfort so I gave him suggestions.
Come on, you know exactly what he means.'Old farts'. What does that even mean. A decent car is a decent car.
You're giving the kid (no disrespect meant there as I'm only 23 myself) the idea that certain cars should only be driven by certain age groups.
Why are high performance saloons only a viable choice for 'old farts'. He asked for performance and comfort so I gave him suggestions.
AMGs and Alpinas are lovely, but they are expensive to insure and maintain, so they make more sense for older and wealthier folk than they do for 21 year olds.
For a lot of younger people, four door saloons just aren't cool, no matter what's under the bonnet.
BTW, I'm mid forties, overweight and balding.... and would love an orange ST (or better still an RS). But 500 mile commute a week just means I cant pay the government that much extra tax....
excel monkey said:
Tonberry said:
That's the problem right there.
'Old farts'. What does that even mean. A decent car is a decent car.
You're giving the kid (no disrespect meant there as I'm only 23 myself) the idea that certain cars should only be driven by certain age groups.
Why are high performance saloons only a viable choice for 'old farts'. He asked for performance and comfort so I gave him suggestions.
Come on, you know exactly what he means.'Old farts'. What does that even mean. A decent car is a decent car.
You're giving the kid (no disrespect meant there as I'm only 23 myself) the idea that certain cars should only be driven by certain age groups.
Why are high performance saloons only a viable choice for 'old farts'. He asked for performance and comfort so I gave him suggestions.
AMGs and Alpinas are lovely, but they are expensive to insure and maintain, so they make more sense for older and wealthier folk than they do for 21 year olds.
For a lot of younger people, four door saloons just aren't cool, no matter what's under the bonnet.
edited to add: Tonberry, why suggest a B10 3.3? The B3 3.3 has the same engine but isn't the 'old man' five series
Edited by St John Smythe on Wednesday 23 November 16:36
Tonberry said:
This.
If you're happy with a car that returns 20MPG then you might as well do it properly.
You claim you want comfort and performance so take a look at the following.
Volvo S60R
BMW 328i E36
BMW 330i E46
BMW 530i E39
BMW 540i E39
Alpina B10 V8
Alpina B10 3.3
Mercedes C43 AMG
Surely driving around in a 4.4 ltr V8 BMW is far cooler than a Ford Focus (lets be honest here, you want one because your mates will think it's cool and you want to impress them).
Apart from the AMG Mercedes, none of them should cost much more to run than the ST. They can all be purchased far cheaper than a decent ST can too which will go along way in offsetting fuel and maintenance costs.
All of the above cars will seat 5 too so you have no excuse
You are joking aren't you?If you're happy with a car that returns 20MPG then you might as well do it properly.
You claim you want comfort and performance so take a look at the following.
Volvo S60R
BMW 328i E36
BMW 330i E46
BMW 530i E39
BMW 540i E39
Alpina B10 V8
Alpina B10 3.3
Mercedes C43 AMG
Surely driving around in a 4.4 ltr V8 BMW is far cooler than a Ford Focus (lets be honest here, you want one because your mates will think it's cool and you want to impress them).
Apart from the AMG Mercedes, none of them should cost much more to run than the ST. They can all be purchased far cheaper than a decent ST can too which will go along way in offsetting fuel and maintenance costs.
All of the above cars will seat 5 too so you have no excuse
Are you trying to bankrupt the OP?
Most of the above apart from the 328i and possibly the 330i will cost alot to run properly with potential big bills, they are gettin gon a bit.
The tyres on the Alpina's must be £150 a corner.
Podie said:
Tonberry said:
Volvo S60R
BMW 328i E36
BMW 330i E46
BMW 530i E39
BMW 540i E39
Alpina B10 V8
Alpina B10 3.3
Mercedes C43 AMG
...
Apart from the AMG Mercedes, none of them should cost much more to run than the ST.
What?!BMW 328i E36
BMW 330i E46
BMW 530i E39
BMW 540i E39
Alpina B10 V8
Alpina B10 3.3
Mercedes C43 AMG
...
Apart from the AMG Mercedes, none of them should cost much more to run than the ST.
Also doubtful a 21 year old will get a decent insurance quote on any but the e36.
Go buy an ST. If you have a serious lust for the Focus then I'm sorry but a 3 series from the 90s isn't going to scratch that itch.
Can you afford it? Is your job secure? Are you going to continuously fret about filling it up? Are you going to put a tenner in each week and drive like Miss Daisy?
Fast Fords seem to hold their value quite well, if you realize a year down the line you want a change then get rid and get an old mans Volvo, thus keeping PH happy and saving £xxxx a month and the world wont explode.
Can you afford it? Is your job secure? Are you going to continuously fret about filling it up? Are you going to put a tenner in each week and drive like Miss Daisy?
Fast Fords seem to hold their value quite well, if you realize a year down the line you want a change then get rid and get an old mans Volvo, thus keeping PH happy and saving £xxxx a month and the world wont explode.
Jimmy No Hands said:
Go buy an ST. If you have a serious lust for the Focus then I'm sorry but a 3 series from the 90s isn't going to scratch that itch.
Can you afford it? Is your job secure? Are you going to continuously fret about filling it up? Are you going to put a tenner in each week and drive like Miss Daisy?
Fast Fords seem to hold their value quite well, if you realize a year down the line you want a change then get rid and get an old mans Volvo, thus keeping PH happy and saving £xxxx a month and the world wont explode.
Think I might just go for it. Only live once I suppose, learn by your mistakes, that's if I realise I made a mistake.Can you afford it? Is your job secure? Are you going to continuously fret about filling it up? Are you going to put a tenner in each week and drive like Miss Daisy?
Fast Fords seem to hold their value quite well, if you realize a year down the line you want a change then get rid and get an old mans Volvo, thus keeping PH happy and saving £xxxx a month and the world wont explode.
Doea anyone know of any common faults I should be made aware if?
The dealer said he'll give me a month warranty and labour warranty, which can be extended, probably for a fortune!
I might be lucky to cheek some extra off him.
The Apprentice said:
Jimmy No Hands said:
Go buy an ST. If you have a serious lust for the Focus then I'm sorry but a 3 series from the 90s isn't going to scratch that itch.
Can you afford it? Is your job secure? Are you going to continuously fret about filling it up? Are you going to put a tenner in each week and drive like Miss Daisy?
Fast Fords seem to hold their value quite well, if you realize a year down the line you want a change then get rid and get an old mans Volvo, thus keeping PH happy and saving £xxxx a month and the world wont explode.
Think I might just go for it. Only live once I suppose, learn by your mistakes, that's if I realise I made a mistake.Can you afford it? Is your job secure? Are you going to continuously fret about filling it up? Are you going to put a tenner in each week and drive like Miss Daisy?
Fast Fords seem to hold their value quite well, if you realize a year down the line you want a change then get rid and get an old mans Volvo, thus keeping PH happy and saving £xxxx a month and the world wont explode.
Doea anyone know of any common faults I should be made aware if?
The dealer said he'll give me a month warranty and labour warranty, which can be extended, probably for a fortune!
I might be lucky to cheek some extra off him.
Be cheeky and ask for a minimum of 3 months warranty. Or more! I managed an extra few months warranty on mine, knocked off a few hundred quid and managed to get 3/4 tank on pick up out of them too. There's plenty of them out there so shop around and don't be scared to haggle or even walk away. It's winter, your financing some of the monies, and it's not a cheap car so be as cheeky as you want.
Head over to the STOC and post a topic, they'll tell you everything you need to know. I personally think the electric orange ST3s are probably your best bet if you want better residuals, as they seem the most sought after.
Head over to the STOC and post a topic, they'll tell you everything you need to know. I personally think the electric orange ST3s are probably your best bet if you want better residuals, as they seem the most sought after.
@Corvus.
I know mate, the 182's are lovely looking cars, great handling, better on fuel and probably more fun. But like you said, the ST is so comfy and roomy for my long legs.
I've just got rid of my little C2 VTR, I know they're only 110bhp but it was a fun car.
Was like a go-kart, but so uncomfortable it was getting tiring. Furthest I ever went in it was about 20 mile round trip and that was too much lol.
I know mate, the 182's are lovely looking cars, great handling, better on fuel and probably more fun. But like you said, the ST is so comfy and roomy for my long legs.
I've just got rid of my little C2 VTR, I know they're only 110bhp but it was a fun car.
Was like a go-kart, but so uncomfortable it was getting tiring. Furthest I ever went in it was about 20 mile round trip and that was too much lol.
The Apprentice said:
Think I might just go for it. Only live once I suppose, learn by your mistakes, that's if I realise I made a mistake.
Doea anyone know of any common faults I should be made aware if?
The dealer said he'll give me a month warranty and labour warranty, which can be extended, probably for a fortune!
I might be lucky to cheek some extra off him.
I loved mine and I would seriously consider going back to one. Doea anyone know of any common faults I should be made aware if?
The dealer said he'll give me a month warranty and labour warranty, which can be extended, probably for a fortune!
I might be lucky to cheek some extra off him.
Re fuel if you pick your moments to exercise the engine you can get high twenties. I had a 2010 model and rarely saw less than 20mpg in day to day driving. Sure If your on a mission or drive like your hair is on fire everywhere it'll be painful at the pumps but you're either very lucky or very stupid if you can drive like that every day.
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