RE: PH Blog: Politeness costs nothing...
Discussion
Phone parking is the way forward.
I know it cost money to call
And for the pleasure of using the system
But at least it texts you to pay more if your times up.
Expensive but cheaper than a £100 ticket!
Cant wait until the new 5p and 10p coins come out, and most pay and display machines arent set for both types!
I know it cost money to call
And for the pleasure of using the system
But at least it texts you to pay more if your times up.
Expensive but cheaper than a £100 ticket!
Cant wait until the new 5p and 10p coins come out, and most pay and display machines arent set for both types!
Being courteous on the road goes hand in hand with caring about your own driving and safety.
The more that you actively observe and analyse the road and other drivers the more likely you are to leave space and acknowledge others helpful gestures or positioning.
Unfortunately this is becoming less common in general on the road.
As stated in the article, the authorities don't help this scenario. Driving in Edinburgh inevitably leads to conflict and aggro due to the continuous switching of lane markings on 2 lane sections of road. If you do not know the section well it is impossible to not be caught out by a lane that is marked straight ahead changing to left or right turn only, after you have passed a point where merging is difficult.
Fortunately the last time I had to use an outdoor car park in Glasgow I was delighted to find numerous people trading in tickets. A white van man offered me an all day pass as he had finished his job for the day, in return I passed that to someone as I left. Just as well because I couldn't get the machine to take my change.
The more that you actively observe and analyse the road and other drivers the more likely you are to leave space and acknowledge others helpful gestures or positioning.
Unfortunately this is becoming less common in general on the road.
As stated in the article, the authorities don't help this scenario. Driving in Edinburgh inevitably leads to conflict and aggro due to the continuous switching of lane markings on 2 lane sections of road. If you do not know the section well it is impossible to not be caught out by a lane that is marked straight ahead changing to left or right turn only, after you have passed a point where merging is difficult.
Fortunately the last time I had to use an outdoor car park in Glasgow I was delighted to find numerous people trading in tickets. A white van man offered me an all day pass as he had finished his job for the day, in return I passed that to someone as I left. Just as well because I couldn't get the machine to take my change.
My town has just introduced pay and display, the princely sum of 50p for an hour or £1 for 2. Good value, yes. But a nightmare as I would typically go to town to shop and have some lunch out. No longer available due to time constraints. Ridiculous short sightedness by local councillors. And the car parks are empty now anyway!
)These things are a nightmare when they are working, and even worse when they're not. I was trying to get to Reading a while back, was going to take the train because I didn't want to get caught in the xmas shopping car parking rush. Drove to Oxford station, which isn't far from my house, pulled into the car park, went to the meter... It doesn't take cash. Apparently "For my convenience" I can pay by mobile phone instead - which I didn't have with me - and get a PIN number that you can type into the meter to get your ticket. Alternatively I can buy said ticket from the station building. It's a 5 minute walk from the far end of the station car park to the actual station building, assuming a 5 minute queue to speak to someone, then a 5 minute walk back to put the ticket on my car, then ANOTHER 5 minute walk back to the station, I was going to miss the train.
Decided not to bother, drove to Reading. Was issued a ticket at the barrier of the multi story, paid cash when I left. Cost half what the train fare would have been. Next time I didn't even bother considering the train.
Decided not to bother, drove to Reading. Was issued a ticket at the barrier of the multi story, paid cash when I left. Cost half what the train fare would have been. Next time I didn't even bother considering the train.
KB_S1 said:
Driving in Edinburgh inevitably leads to conflict and aggro
I hate driving in Edinburgh, I'm thankful I don't live somewhere like London or Glasgow. I'm in rural NI right now, been here since Saturday. On Sunday, I was infuriated by the (lack of) urgency people display at traffic lights and this whole nonsense about stopping and letting people in/out at junctions. Then I realised that's how it should be. I've become an aggressive city driver, like every other person who has to drive in cities, I think everyone else is an aggressive
but I'm just adding to the problem, I'm one of them. Well no more! I'm going back to my roots. Nice, considerate, leave the house 5 minutes earlier to allow for letting people out at junctions and traffic light dawdlers.
isee said:
Is it lkegally enforceable though?
What if I don't want the local authority to have my number plate, or I can't remember it and i cannot be bothered walking back to my car to look, or i am just in a bad mood?
Whast if I punch in random numbers, yet pay for the ticket? Would it be reasonable to argue that I did what I was obliged to do (i.e. pay for the parking space) but refused to jump through hoops to do it?
I always put 000000 in, an impossible number plate (though I'm sure it will crop up on the chav plates thread. They do not state you have to put the correct number plate into the machine in the car parks I use, it's participating in enforcing the no transfer rule when you don't need to. What if I don't want the local authority to have my number plate, or I can't remember it and i cannot be bothered walking back to my car to look, or i am just in a bad mood?
Whast if I punch in random numbers, yet pay for the ticket? Would it be reasonable to argue that I did what I was obliged to do (i.e. pay for the parking space) but refused to jump through hoops to do it?
And I can never remember the plate.
.Papa Hotel said:
I hate driving in Edinburgh, I'm thankful I don't live somewhere like London or Glasgow.
Glasgow is generally better for driving as it has a better layout and the majority of drivers are more courteous.This is tempered by the occasional late night M8 slip closures and the ridiculous diversions.
Papa Hotel said:
KB_S1 said:
Driving in Edinburgh inevitably leads to conflict and aggro
I hate driving in Edinburgh, I'm thankful I don't live somewhere like London or Glasgow. Anyway back to the topic, there are a few machines in edinburgh which people will stick tickets on with time left on which is lovely, so much so I've started to do it myself
10 Pence Short said:
Is it unfair of councils to monetise assets they rightfully own?
We own them, not the council, they run them on our behalf and as Harris has pointed out this sort of policy increases the amount of hassle and bad feeling that there is already too much of.Surely most people would like their services run on the basis of improving life for everyone?
The Jolly Todger said:
Every Pay & Display car park ticket I've ever looked at has said that they are not transferable. So as far as the car park operators are concerned, nothing has changed with this new system, it just makes it impossible to break the rules.
Absolutely correct.If you pass on your parking ticket, the recipient is not entitled to use it. The warden will note the ticket number against the registration when they do their rounds, if they return and find the same ticket in a different car, the ticket is invalid and they will get the usual sticky yellow envelope on the windscreen.
This is one of those situations where you are paying specifically for the use of a facility for a certain vehicle on a single specific occasion. You can't even take the car away and bring it back to the same space and rely on the same ticket.
Good call Chris - this is so true.
I think there is a definite decline of manners and courtesy on the road. I always wave or flash people to say thanks and regularly let people merge or join in front of me on my slog into work every morning.
Unfortunately as many fellow PHers will atest, when you drive a car perceived as a 'flash Harry' motor incidents of aggression and discourtesy ramp up enormously.
I drive a new shape Alfa Spider into Manchester city centre every day in thick traffic. Obviously it is no exotic, but you don't see many on the road so the car seems to get rather a lot of attention. Unfortunately for every pointing child or enthusiastic petrol head, there are a horde of people determined to try to cause an accident it seems.
People just love to tail gate me, even in rush hour traffic. Heaven forbid I should leave a cars length gap in front to gently keep idling forward rather than constantly being on the accelerator or the brake in thick traffic or travel. Should I do 30mph in a 30mph zone people following me seem to degenerate into crazed maniacs, pressing right up behind me. When it comes to a lane merge situation people would rather die than let me in, even when it is clearly my priority. I had a guy in a Passat nearly drive into me this morning in a desperate bid to prevent me merging in front of him despite him coming from a full cars length behind. When he realised that this was not possible without physically driving into me he proceeded to tailgate me for two miles in thick traffic. WTF??
The other one I see often is when you see someone else indicating to change lanes to move into a gap in the lane next to them, and the car in the adjacent lane then accelerates into the gap to shut the lane changer out. What is wrong with people?? You were happy for there to be a gap there but as soon as another motorist tries to change lanes you deliberately deny them.
By contrast on a journey the other day a car was driving in the dark with no lights on, so I gave them a few flashes and turned mine on and off again quickly til they realised and gave me a friendly wave. These little incidents of connection with your fellow drivers share good will, but seem to happen more and more rarely which is a shame.
Sorry for the essay - glad I got that off my chest.
I think there is a definite decline of manners and courtesy on the road. I always wave or flash people to say thanks and regularly let people merge or join in front of me on my slog into work every morning.
Unfortunately as many fellow PHers will atest, when you drive a car perceived as a 'flash Harry' motor incidents of aggression and discourtesy ramp up enormously.
I drive a new shape Alfa Spider into Manchester city centre every day in thick traffic. Obviously it is no exotic, but you don't see many on the road so the car seems to get rather a lot of attention. Unfortunately for every pointing child or enthusiastic petrol head, there are a horde of people determined to try to cause an accident it seems.
People just love to tail gate me, even in rush hour traffic. Heaven forbid I should leave a cars length gap in front to gently keep idling forward rather than constantly being on the accelerator or the brake in thick traffic or travel. Should I do 30mph in a 30mph zone people following me seem to degenerate into crazed maniacs, pressing right up behind me. When it comes to a lane merge situation people would rather die than let me in, even when it is clearly my priority. I had a guy in a Passat nearly drive into me this morning in a desperate bid to prevent me merging in front of him despite him coming from a full cars length behind. When he realised that this was not possible without physically driving into me he proceeded to tailgate me for two miles in thick traffic. WTF??
The other one I see often is when you see someone else indicating to change lanes to move into a gap in the lane next to them, and the car in the adjacent lane then accelerates into the gap to shut the lane changer out. What is wrong with people?? You were happy for there to be a gap there but as soon as another motorist tries to change lanes you deliberately deny them.
By contrast on a journey the other day a car was driving in the dark with no lights on, so I gave them a few flashes and turned mine on and off again quickly til they realised and gave me a friendly wave. These little incidents of connection with your fellow drivers share good will, but seem to happen more and more rarely which is a shame.
Sorry for the essay - glad I got that off my chest.
On it's own just another small annoyance, but it all adds to the general picture to cause people minor stress and to contribute to what, taken as a whole, is perceived as a considerable worsening of civil liberties and general ease of living..
I think if you had a look at any internal UK local Council memos/emails you would see they now generaly refer to themselves (and probably have done for quite some time) as a 'Business', not a 'Service'. A multitude of people will be employed to maximise revenue streams at the expense of any other consideration (quite often masquerading under an 'it's to save the environment' or 'keeping traffic moving' banner)..
..as for incentivising and targeting Traffic Wardens/Civil Enforcement Officers (or whatever is their official title this week)!?..I have yet to meet one who is capable of communicating eloquently with another human being..vile little people drunk on a miniscule amount of power..
I think if you had a look at any internal UK local Council memos/emails you would see they now generaly refer to themselves (and probably have done for quite some time) as a 'Business', not a 'Service'. A multitude of people will be employed to maximise revenue streams at the expense of any other consideration (quite often masquerading under an 'it's to save the environment' or 'keeping traffic moving' banner)..
..as for incentivising and targeting Traffic Wardens/Civil Enforcement Officers (or whatever is their official title this week)!?..I have yet to meet one who is capable of communicating eloquently with another human being..vile little people drunk on a miniscule amount of power..
Edited by billzeebub on Tuesday 17th January 11:48
It's such an obvious money making scheme that I'm suprised I haven't encountered any Pay & Display machines here in the Netherlands. Pay in advance and non transferable... it has Dutch written all over it 
Over here the old fashioned parking meters are slowly being replaced by "Pay as you leave" systems.
Sure, you can't give your ticket to someone else, but in my experience it doesn't happen very often to have enough time left for it to be usable by somebody else.
With the old systems it's just the frustration of paying more money than necessary, be it in the form of a ridiculous start fee or unused remaining minutes.
Over here the old fashioned parking meters are slowly being replaced by "Pay as you leave" systems.
Sure, you can't give your ticket to someone else, but in my experience it doesn't happen very often to have enough time left for it to be usable by somebody else.
With the old systems it's just the frustration of paying more money than necessary, be it in the form of a ridiculous start fee or unused remaining minutes.
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