RE: Pic of the Week: Classic & Sports Car's 30th
Discussion
srob said:
JS100 said:
Best looking car there by a mile is the Esprit. Tragic that the manufacturers around it in the pic have gone on to be hugely successful and Lotus has withered on the vine. Wasted talent IMO.
I'll have an ounce of what ^ he's smoking 
Twincam16 said:
JS100 said:
Best looking car there by a mile is the Esprit. Tragic that the manufacturers around it in the pic have gone on to be hugely successful and Lotus has withered on the vine. Wasted talent IMO.
Yeah, 'cause DeLorean and Alpine dominate the market don't they. If only Lotus had the foresight to develop a small, back-to-basics mid-engined roadster with an innovative extruded-aluminium chassis, then upscale the recipe into supercar territory with a kind of modular architecture based on the same aluminium technology, they might still be around today, not only making their own cars, but also helping other manufacturers out with theirs. Such a sad waste 
Remainder of your response, completely agree with you. Great and pioneering engineers, truly dreadful businessmen!
Twincam16 said:
Frimley111R said:
Slightly depressing. Lotus look right up there as Ferrari competitors. Where did it all go so wrong 
It didn't really. There's nothing wrong with the cars even today, and once the new range is out there'll be even less to complain about on that front.I think it's perception that's changed. Back in 1982, even though the country was riddled with strikes and we still made Austin Allegros, people still bought British and were proud to do so. Sticking up for the underdog was an integral part of Britishness because we believed in fair play and giving everyone a fair shot.
Nowadays we seem to have become a lazy nation happy to bung money towards ever-greedier monopolies in order to make our lives easier. If a firm makes a car that's the slightest bit demanding or different, rather than being drawn to it, we not only slag it off on the internet, we actually wish death on the company and redundancy on the employees in a kind of 'I told you so' act of social Darwinism. We want to be seen to be on the 'winning' side even if that victory actually hurts the country's economy because at some point we lost that gritty, sarcastic British sense of humour and adopted the corporate-American one, in which arrogance is 'justified' and there's humour in identifying and mocking 'losers'.
Interestingly, in other countries Lotus is still seen as a rare and desirable exotic, especially in America, where the Esprit always sold well - they even got versions we didn't, like the X180R racer and the Jim Clark edition. The Evora is quietly meeting its sales targets, it's just in other countries. Over here, we sneer at our own products, overlooking such important attributes as 'handling' and 'fun' and agonising at great length over how the doors sound when they close, and the sound your knuckles make when you rap them on some part of trim you wouldn't ordinarily even touch unless you were seeking to make a point.
Our motoring press has dished out all manner of awards to Lotus, but we've fetishised German cars, especially Porsche, BMW and Audi to such an absurd degree we're in danger of overlooking positive attributes in cars designed in Britain with British roads and drivers in mind that the German manufacturers don't even bother with.
Twincam16 said:
It didn't really. There's nothing wrong with the cars even today, and once the new range is out there'll be even less to complain about on that front.
I think it's perception that's changed. Back in 1982, even though the country was riddled with strikes and we still made Austin Allegros, people still bought British and were proud to do so. Sticking up for the underdog was an integral part of Britishness because we believed in fair play and giving everyone a fair shot.
Nowadays we seem to have become a lazy nation happy to bung money towards ever-greedier monopolies in order to make our lives easier. If a firm makes a car that's the slightest bit demanding or different, rather than being drawn to it, we not only slag it off on the internet, we actually wish death on the company and redundancy on the employees in a kind of 'I told you so' act of social Darwinism. We want to be seen to be on the 'winning' side even if that victory actually hurts the country's economy because at some point we lost that gritty, sarcastic British sense of humour and adopted the corporate-American one, in which arrogance is 'justified' and there's humour in identifying and mocking 'losers'.
Interestingly, in other countries Lotus is still seen as a rare and desirable exotic, especially in America, where the Esprit always sold well - they even got versions we didn't, like the X180R racer and the Jim Clark edition. The Evora is quietly meeting its sales targets, it's just in other countries. Over here, we sneer at our own products, overlooking such important attributes as 'handling' and 'fun' and agonising at great length over how the doors sound when they close, and the sound your knuckles make when you rap them on some part of trim you wouldn't ordinarily even touch unless you were seeking to make a point.
Our motoring press has dished out all manner of awards to Lotus, but we've fetishised German cars, especially Porsche, BMW and Audi to such an absurd degree we're in danger of overlooking positive attributes in cars designed in Britain with British roads and drivers in mind that the German manufacturers don't even bother with.
Have you been reading my posts?I think it's perception that's changed. Back in 1982, even though the country was riddled with strikes and we still made Austin Allegros, people still bought British and were proud to do so. Sticking up for the underdog was an integral part of Britishness because we believed in fair play and giving everyone a fair shot.
Nowadays we seem to have become a lazy nation happy to bung money towards ever-greedier monopolies in order to make our lives easier. If a firm makes a car that's the slightest bit demanding or different, rather than being drawn to it, we not only slag it off on the internet, we actually wish death on the company and redundancy on the employees in a kind of 'I told you so' act of social Darwinism. We want to be seen to be on the 'winning' side even if that victory actually hurts the country's economy because at some point we lost that gritty, sarcastic British sense of humour and adopted the corporate-American one, in which arrogance is 'justified' and there's humour in identifying and mocking 'losers'.
Interestingly, in other countries Lotus is still seen as a rare and desirable exotic, especially in America, where the Esprit always sold well - they even got versions we didn't, like the X180R racer and the Jim Clark edition. The Evora is quietly meeting its sales targets, it's just in other countries. Over here, we sneer at our own products, overlooking such important attributes as 'handling' and 'fun' and agonising at great length over how the doors sound when they close, and the sound your knuckles make when you rap them on some part of trim you wouldn't ordinarily even touch unless you were seeking to make a point.
Our motoring press has dished out all manner of awards to Lotus, but we've fetishised German cars, especially Porsche, BMW and Audi to such an absurd degree we're in danger of overlooking positive attributes in cars designed in Britain with British roads and drivers in mind that the German manufacturers don't even bother with.
You maybe surprised to see someone agreeing with such jingoistic claptrap but I do!
However I think it's been 'cool' to buy german for some time. But it's really sad that there isn't more domestic support for our cars in the UK. There's plenty in germany, italy and france for their cars whereas we overwhelmingly favour german cars, ironic given our history with that country and continued rivalry when it comes to sport.
There was a brief period when TVR of all people stepped in to fill the vacuum left by the porsche 911 falling out of favour in financial services (early to mid 90's). A glorious period of success for an audacious british sportscar maker that led to TVR having the funds to launch a new generation of cars and even make their own engines. Just proof that domestic support matters to smaller car makers. Yes it could have been spent more wisely in hindsight but it gave the world the TVR Cerbera, Tuscan, Tamora, T350, Sagaris and Typhon, a successful factory GT program, as well as the Speed 12, Speed Six, AJP 8 engines. That lot's responsible for a lot of great memories.
I've often thought that a porsche on Lotus resources wouldn't be worth considering (would have to be worse than the 924 for starters!) whereas a Lotus on porsche resources would be an overnight game changer. Porsche is holding back the development of the sports car through its 'evolutionary' approach and stifling development of the superior boxster/cayman configuration so that it doesn't expose the limitations of the 911. So what we have now is a rear engined car being the most successful and popular sports car in the world. In 2012. I doubt porsche themselves (who tried to kill the 911 in the 70's afterall) could have ever imagined such a peculiar state of affairs.
Fortunately british cars are more appreciated elsewhere as that's where they have to look for survival.
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