So that panic buying looks really silly now...
Discussion
martin84 said:
aryastark said:
The countries full of retarded lemmings, many of whom are on this forum. I dread to think what will happen when/if something really kicks off.
I'm struggling to remember that clearly but I'm pretty sure there wasn't panic buying in 2000 long before any protest was even arranged.Nowadays, in 2012 the news ain't what it was - it's not news any more, rather more propoganda-like. This is how the "panic buying" started last month (as you say, no date was ever set
), because of shoddy "news" across the channels available. It was a non-story; it is a non-story, and until a date is set it will continue to be a non-story putting the wind up people who (frankly) need to get a grip but are no-longer able to think much for themselves nor see any bigger picture that there might be. But while these "news" non-stories continue, I'm rather more concerned about what's not being publicised that the government are planning/doing... "Pasty Tax" scandal, my
- what were the government doing/planning/introducing when people were bellyaching about that then? (And I'll be honest... I missed it 
).Back in 2000, the dispute came "out of the blue" from memory - no notice given, it kicked off just like that. There was plenty of queuing off forecourts onto main roads, garages running out of fuel and limited quantities available of what was left (15l of LRP was all I could get in the centre of Bury after queuing for 30 minutes, about 4 days in to the incident). But petrol was freely available at garages in the next town, and the 24 hour garages there were not busy in the wee small hours.
UK 2012, eh? Who'd live here?
(And who'd watch and believe the "news" 
.)Hang on a sec, OP. you keep spouting this crap (or at least where I've got to do far) about 'bringing the whole nation to a standstill'. What a load of st. I live in the south east and ever since the strike rumours were circulated, have the roads ever been at a standstill. The worst I saw was a queue of traffic at one petrol station of about 14 cars for 6 pumps. Hardly the armageddonic epic that you keep say happened to 'the nation'.
And then you accuse people of being on their Tory high horse. Do fk off.
ETA: Oh, and only one fuel station here ran dry...and that was just of boggo unleaded because their delivery driver didn't turn up. So the country wasn't 'run dry' either
t. I live in the south east and ever since the strike rumours were circulated, have the roads ever been at a standstill. The worst I saw was a queue of traffic at one petrol station of about 14 cars for 6 pumps. Hardly the armageddonic epic that you keep say happened to 'the nation'.And then you accuse people of being on their Tory high horse. Do f
k off.ETA: Oh, and only one fuel station here ran dry...and that was just of boggo unleaded because their delivery driver didn't turn up. So the country wasn't 'run dry' either
Edited by The Moose on Sunday 15th April 17:16
Rich W said:
OH FFS Do you ACTUALLY understand the current economic situation. You do understand that when we have 1 Trillion of debt you have to make MASSIVE cutbacks everywhere you can. I don't like it anymore than you. But I do accept it has to happen. Unlike Labour I don't beleive there is a money tree
The Conservative's are not making massive cutbacks everywhere they can. They're making minor cutbacks which will see them unelectable in 2015. The public will not vote for slashing public spending, its a simple as that, especially when its including expensive destruction of the NHS. The Tories are actually increasing spending and putting a lot of money into politically expensive reform which is unlikely to even save money. The reality is theres no single economic theory or principle which can solve the issue. Any idiot can take the tact of cutting taxes, cutting spending, increasing spending etc. The trick is to find the right blend to generate growth and increase tax revenue in the country and usually that depends on leaning on a bit of all economic theories. How much of each is the 64 million dollar question and a question I dont believe Osborne is capable of answering. He is a weak Chancellor with no growth plan of any sort.Rich W said:
We weren't in the dire financial straights your beloved Labour have managed to get the UK into now.
Right back up a second, its none of your business but you might want to know I have no connection to the Labour Party at all other than voting for them in 01 and 05, I have a long list of criticisms of the Labour Party as long as my criticisms of the Tories. If I was twice as old as I am I doubt I'd have voted for the likes of Kinnock or Foot when Labour were actually a genuine left wing party. I dont love any party, for the record. Secondly, the banks played a pretty big part in the collapse of the entire financial system, you cannot entirely blame the Government and indeed nearly 9 million people voted for the Party you credit with destroying the World in 2010. May I remind you this is a worldwide economic crisis, Gordon Brown didn't cause the sub prime mortage problems in the US, he didn't shut down Lehmann brothers, he didnt mismanage RBS to the point of needing Government bailouts. Its unfair to blame one man for a WORLDWIDE problem.You may dislike the fact it was a worldwide recession, because that gave Labour a fighting chance because they could blame the economic issues of the UK on the rest of the World. You could say this partly prevented Cameron winning a majority.
Rich W said:
I wonder why Milliband didn't say the Fuel strikes were a bad thing though? Corruption? Self interest?
Maybe because no fuel strike ever happened? 
I know its a difficult message to get across, Francis Maude thought the strike had already started as well.Rich W said:
and benefits for the workshy.
You mean the 3 million unemployed - partly due to the Government sacking them - who are now chasing jobs in a job market with too few to go round? Jobs get about 100 applications each these days, don't confuse 'workshy' with the unemployed. I know PH thinks everybody who receives a benefit is a feckless thug, including pensioners and the disabled and the Tories attitude towards such people has been quite disgraceful.Rich W said:
The problem is the workshy wasters of this country. The benefit cheats and all the rest of the scum have been targetted by the Tories.
For the record, fradulent benefit payments amounted to less than 0.5% of Government expendature last year. The DWP loses a similar amount in administration errors and the Government is spending more than that on reforms to welfare which won't save any money even in the long run. Cameron believes welfare is this massive goldmine for the State to make money out of, he thinks the entire deficit can be solved by punching the unemployed and kicking the disabled out of wheelchairs which makes me sick to the stomach. You accuse Miliband of tailoring his approach to satisfy those who will vote for him, well the Tories know that unemployed people don't vote Conservative so they can attack them while losing little political capital. They won't attack Banks or anybody like that because Cameron went to school with these people and is in the pocket of the City and the Murdoch media.'Workshy wasters' are not the problem, only morons who read the Daily Mail believe rubbish like that. PH believes 'workshy' and 'benefit cheats' are responsible for 110% of the entire economic mess which makes your earlier question of whether I understand the economic situation or not look incredibly stupid. You are a different sort of moronic if you think that is the main problem we face today.
Rich W said:
Oh, and I'm so glad you brought up "Pasty Tax". Pasty Tax was designed to close a VAT loophole that penalised your local, 1 family run Chippy but didn't penalise Greggs the Bakers selling a hot Cornish
I know all of this already. Stop wasting your bandwidth. They could've exempted the local chippy from paying VAT if their only interest was to put people on a level playing field But predictably they took the option which raises them more money. To be 'fair' the Conservative policy is to penalise everybody. Always has been, always will, apart from if you're a top rate tax payer, he wants to help you. Unless you're a rich person who wants to give money to charity to help those the Cameron Ministry is leaving behind of course, then you're a wealthy tax dodger!For the record I have no problem with an expansion of VAT laws, it'll push a pasty up 20p which is hardly a big deal but the fact is the Tories are awful at playing effective politics. They raise money from working class pasty eaters and pensioners while giving a tax cut to the richest in the same day, surely they knew that was never going to play well?
Rich W said:
I loved when Ed Milliband (who is virtually unelectable IMO) stood in Greggs saying how it would hurt a retailer like them. FYI Greggs is listed on the stock market and had a revenue in 2011 of £701M! Hardly the working class he wanted to defend
So now you're saying Labour are on the side of big business? Make up your mind. I was disappointed when Ed won the leadership election, Trade Union votes are like the away goals rule in the Labour Party and in my view they elected the wrong Miliband. Yes the photo-op was cynical but at least the Labour Party have half a clue of how to play effective media politics because whether you like it or not Labour are good at it and it has worked for them before in terms of gaining votes. No matter how much the facts suggest Labour's support for 'Mondeo man' is bogus, the Tories are still viewed as purely on the side of the rich so they're not seen as a viable alternative.I am fully aware of how much Greggs is worth thank you very much. If you think I'm stupid enough to believe a multi-million pound blue chip company will be destroyed by paying VAT like everybody else you clearly don't know much about me at all.
Your 3 million unemployed figure is only the tip of the iceberg, New Labour went to some quite large lengths at great expense to this nation to hide the other 5 million, oh and pay them nicely.
In 2010 so nothing to do with the coalition there were 8 million
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/7257667/E...
In 2010 so nothing to do with the coalition there were 8 million
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/7257667/E...
NoNeed said:
Your 3 million unemployed figure is only the tip of the iceberg, New Labour went to some quite large lengths at great expense to this nation to hide the other 5 million, oh and pay them nicely.
In 2010 so nothing to do with the coalition there were 8 million
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/7257667/E...
Figures are massaged extremely well and they still are so the Coalition has done nothing about it in 2 years. Its in their interests for it to look better than it is of course. I used to work for the Job Centre so I already know all of this as well. I'm not sure what you're getting at. The quarterly jobless figures are a joke and barely tell any of the real story, I know what they're going to say before they come out.In 2010 so nothing to do with the coalition there were 8 million
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/7257667/E...
martin84 said:
NoNeed said:
Your 3 million unemployed figure is only the tip of the iceberg, New Labour went to some quite large lengths at great expense to this nation to hide the other 5 million, oh and pay them nicely.
In 2010 so nothing to do with the coalition there were 8 million
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/7257667/E...
Figures are massaged extremely well. I used to work for the Job Centre so I already know all of this as well. I'm not sure what you're getting at. The quarterly jobless figures are a joke and barely tell any of the real story, I know what they're going to say before they come out.In 2010 so nothing to do with the coalition there were 8 million
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/7257667/E...
New labour ruined the economy, new labour not the coalition.
swerni said:
Nope but they did spend 13 years investing the proceeds in the public sector instead of investing in industry.
To be fair to them they were doing that when they, you and all of us thought banks knew what they were doing. Unfortunately all the money was spent by the time we found out the multi-millionaires running the banks actually didn't know how to do their job properly at all. A Labour Government will always invest in the public sector and I don't see the Tories specifically advocating a small state style Government either.My point is New Labour did not cause all the problems we have here today. To pin everything on them is just the mark of a frothing nutcase who hates them so irrationally that they'll find any way to blame them for something.
martin84 said:
NoNeed said:
You were quoting jobless figure like it's the coalitions fault, it isn't.
New labour ruined the economy, new labour not the coalition.
New Labour caused the worldwide banking crisis?New labour ruined the economy, new labour not the coalition.
In the first ten years in office.......
New labour sold off the gold.
New labour raided the pension funds by £5 Billion every year
New labour doubled taxation from £700 Billion in the ten years from 1987-1997 to a whopping £1.4 trillion 1997 to 2007.
Yet they still despite all this extra income ran at a £30 Billion deficit, this was before the banking crisis. In fact they allowed our national debt to rise to a massive £494 Billion in 2008 and if they hadn't, if they had save we wouldn't have had a banking crisis we would have had a small banking problem.
Labour ruined our economy by not saving when they had the chance, they ruined it by continually spending more than we were making every single year in office and not once ever only spending what we made. They lived on borrowed money they encouraged (and still do) the public to borrow more and more, they are the party of debt.
Labour allowed our banks to operate in markets they previously couldn't they (ed balls)called it soft touch regulation, they de-regulated the banks they caused the problem.
It was Labour, 13 years of stupidity, 13 years of debt and not a penny saved. The economy boomed for their first ten years and they despite all the things above still borrowed on a massive scale.
All the jobs lost are down to Labour, all the current unemployed is down to Labour and probably all the union problems the coalition faces will be down to labour.
Like I said before the fuel thing was a small problem, it wasn't an illegal war that cost over 100,000 innocent lives was it.
Edited by NoNeed on Sunday 15th April 18:07
martin84 said:
So New Labour didn't ruin the economy then? Seeing as Banks had their major part to play as part of a worldwide financial services crisis.
However much of the banking crisis could have been avoided had regulators been more competent. In particular the collapse of Northern Rock was avoidable if lending / capital finance restrictions hadn't been relaxed. RBS/HBOS could have avoided bailouts if the local regulator (FSA) had basically been competent to regulate such complex global banks and didn't assume the bankers knew best. martin84 said:
You're just embarassing yourself now you know that.
Everything is down to Labour? Nothing is anybody elses responsibility? I mean absolutely NOBODY outside of New Labour has responsibility for anything?
After 13 years? who elses fault would it be?Everything is down to Labour? Nothing is anybody elses responsibility? I mean absolutely NOBODY outside of New Labour has responsibility for anything?
Either tony B Liar and Gordon Clown were complicit with knowledge or incompetent without knowledge but as the leaders they are at fault.
Edited by NoNeed on Sunday 15th April 18:11
NoNeed said:
After 13 years? who elses fault would it be?
For a worldwide financial crisis? Lots of people.For instance do you not feel its the responsibility of hugely well paid banking executives to control their own budget? Or is the nanny Government supposed to hold their hands and do it for them?
New Labour didn't cause the problems, who did then?
Whilst I fully understand the current bunch are fairly inept the damage Blair, Brown and Darling did is very well documented.
It's so easy being in politics, just blame the last lot in power, shame that was the lefties (well sort if left middle) for a decade, no, not their fault lol.
These things take time to fk up properly before impending retirement into the old people's home in Brussels.
I watched the New Statesman again recently and it's as true today as it was back then, politicians are vile leeches with no regard for anything other than money.
Whilst I fully understand the current bunch are fairly inept the damage Blair, Brown and Darling did is very well documented.
It's so easy being in politics, just blame the last lot in power, shame that was the lefties (well sort if left middle) for a decade, no, not their fault lol.
These things take time to f
k up properly before impending retirement into the old people's home in Brussels. I watched the New Statesman again recently and it's as true today as it was back then, politicians are vile leeches with no regard for anything other than money.
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