RE: PH Blog: Clio is the unsung hero
Discussion
entropy said:
Hmmmm. No mention of the Mini Cooper S and its derivatives considering its the better private buy as its a 1.6 turbo.
Saying that I do know someone who went straight for a Clio 200.
When I was looking for my last car I had my heart set on a Cooper S, they looked brilliant the interior was lovely and it had supercharger! Saying that I do know someone who went straight for a Clio 200.
However I test drove a Mini Cooper S from a dealer and I found it to be surprisingly uninspiring/unengaging and a lot slower than I had expected. Granted I didn't take it down a b-road and give it chance to come alive but I didn't do this with any of the cars I test drove.
I then drove a Twingo 133 Cup and from the first bump, turn of the wheel and application of the ultra sharp brakes it felt much more like it to me, it had me smiling the whole test drive.
So the logical thing to do was to try a similar car with more power and what do you know I bought a 182 Cup and it feels infinitely better in every way than the Mini did. Well apart from the slightly better refinement of the Mini.
It all just depends on what you want in a car, but there is no doubt that for the purpose of just driving the thing, Renaultsports will win hands down.
If I wanted a more refined larger all-rounder I would probably buy a Golf GTI............. No wait they do a Renaultsport Megane!
Mark Smith said:
Hello!! What planet are you on? Try changing a headlight bulb on a VW Passat! The entire front of the car has to be removed to do the job. The bulbs are just as difficult on practically any other make of car. The suspension on my X reg 172 is original and isn't rusty.
Jbi drives a car with lamp posts for bottom arms and anvils for hub assembly's you do really talk drivel don't you pmslGreat appraisal Mark.
Clio 172 / 182 are now superb value and a great basis for a trackday / fast -road car.
The Clio 200 Cup described in the article has superb handling, not too bad ride (versus a Ford RS or Honda Type-R) and a fantastic quick steering rack. You do need to put a few quid aside for when they are out of warranty, but less money than any similar MINI Cooper S where you need to buy the JCW version to get similar bhp/ton to the Renaultsport Clio!
The seats in the 197/200 are also better designed than the 172/182 so you don't necessarily need Recaros now.
In summary, Renaultsport Clios are great value.
Clio 172 / 182 are now superb value and a great basis for a trackday / fast -road car.
The Clio 200 Cup described in the article has superb handling, not too bad ride (versus a Ford RS or Honda Type-R) and a fantastic quick steering rack. You do need to put a few quid aside for when they are out of warranty, but less money than any similar MINI Cooper S where you need to buy the JCW version to get similar bhp/ton to the Renaultsport Clio!
The seats in the 197/200 are also better designed than the 172/182 so you don't necessarily need Recaros now.
In summary, Renaultsport Clios are great value.
Mark Smith said:
I own a Clio 172 Phase 1 that I bought three and a half years ago. I bought it without any service history from a trader. The car was covered in green pollen from the tree it was sat under but when I started the engine I just knew it felt right and in the end it was. The tyres were like driving on square wheels but once they were replaced the car transformed into a lovely car to drive. Over the past three and a half years I've done 15 track days in it and every one has got better than the last. The car now has 124,000 miles on it and still drives really well. the acceleration is as sharp as ever and the handling is sublime. I've fitted Ferodo DS2500 pads all round, Brembo HC front discs, braided brake lines and DOT 5.1 fluid. Green cotton air filter element in OE 172 airbox. K-TEC engine mountings, Powerflex dogbone bush. Toyo R1-R tyres and Scorpion catback stainless steel exhaust system. The engine is standard 172 and is as sharp now as when it was a lot newer.
The Renaultsport Clio's are all built in Dieppe at the Alpine factory as were the Williams models and all previous Gordini and R5 hot hatches. The only one thats built away from Dieppe is the Megane RS models which are built in Spain. The attention to detail during the build is second to none. They only build 18 cars a day at Dieppe so there's plenty of time for checking every stage of the construction. They also build all the motorsport cars there except F1.
I went on a factory tour there last year with Renaultsport and it was a real eye opener. The hospitality from Renaultsport was really good and they took us to lunch after the tour in a local restaurant where the food and wine flowed for a good couple of hours.
I'd buy another Renaultsport car any day whether its in or out of warranty. I've no intention of selling my car and hoipe to do many more trackdays and drives out over the coming years. I'm in my mid 50's now and owning this car makes me feel young again so it's definitely staying!
My wife and daughters all say its the best car I've ever owned so that does it for me.
The Renaultsport Clio's are all built in Dieppe at the Alpine factory as were the Williams models and all previous Gordini and R5 hot hatches. The only one thats built away from Dieppe is the Megane RS models which are built in Spain. The attention to detail during the build is second to none. They only build 18 cars a day at Dieppe so there's plenty of time for checking every stage of the construction. They also build all the motorsport cars there except F1.
I went on a factory tour there last year with Renaultsport and it was a real eye opener. The hospitality from Renaultsport was really good and they took us to lunch after the tour in a local restaurant where the food and wine flowed for a good couple of hours.
I'd buy another Renaultsport car any day whether its in or out of warranty. I've no intention of selling my car and hoipe to do many more trackdays and drives out over the coming years. I'm in my mid 50's now and owning this car makes me feel young again so it's definitely staying!
My wife and daughters all say its the best car I've ever owned so that does it for me.
jbi said:
ever tried changing a bulb on a clio?
Ever looked at the paper machete suspension arms/subframe?
Cheap, badly designed tat is all they are.
in reply yes i have and you dont remove the bumper!!!Ever looked at the paper machete suspension arms/subframe?
Cheap, badly designed tat is all they are.
suspension looks just as rubust as bmw/mini/vw set-up matter of fact the independant
swivel hub arrangement on mine is quite trick
obviously your mechanic skills are as bad as your knowledge of the vehicles!
artdealer said:
If Recaro could improve the wear on them I'd be fully sold. So many times I find Recaros are supportive and better looking, but the weakest link on a 3 + year old car.
I concur, the bolster wear is really not great on them.Butter Face said:
Recaros make the car though. They are cracking seats!!
LewisR said:
The Saab 900 Turbo 16S didn't exist in 1979.
You are so right, only the GLE etc and slower Turbo 900's were produced then.You are so wrong about it being a shopping car, the ride is so hard it can be a real pain driving it to the shops sometime but get it on Track or any challenging road then it is unbeatable in class. Not sure what you mean about FWD cars. Take the BTCC for example. Nearly all FWD and most weeks they beat the RWD BMW's. Especially in the wet.
Butter Face said:
tomv1to said:
James1972 said:
Excluding the Renaultsport ones are there any Renaults worth having ? Renault has just withdrawn most of its range from the UK as nobody is buying them.
Quality may be much improved from 20yrs ago but so is everybody elses my experience of middle range Megans etc. as hire cars is that they quickly develop that not properly engineered rattle unlike the boring stuff from Germany.
Whats the JD power rating for Renault - doubt if its top half of the list - bonnet catches and response to says it all.
Would love a play in any of the RS clio's but run one out of warranty ????
Although they no longer manufacturer it the Koleos was a reasonable affordable 4x4. The basic Twingo's are also quite fun. The sceneics are god awful though.Quality may be much improved from 20yrs ago but so is everybody elses my experience of middle range Megans etc. as hire cars is that they quickly develop that not properly engineered rattle unlike the boring stuff from Germany.
Whats the JD power rating for Renault - doubt if its top half of the list - bonnet catches and response to says it all.
Would love a play in any of the RS clio's but run one out of warranty ????
It's been proven that cutting the range is already making a difference, the quality of the range now is fantastic.
All cars come with 4 years warranty, 4 years free servicing too.
The Scenic is cracking, I can't see where you get 'god awful' from. You get a stunning range of equipment standard, the engines are fantastic (drive the 1.6 Diesel stop start for full effect) and they're one of the nicer looking cars in the segment.
New Clio due early next year, and Renault are pioneering Electric cars with some of the first (affordable) electric vehicles to market.
Shame the next Clio is 5 door only. The next gen RS Clio may look somewhat odd.
philis said:
FlavaDave said:
I once went from 172 cup TO Integra THEN BACK to 172 cup. Integra has had it's day IMO.
I did the same but i found it to be utter s
te in comparrison to the Honda?I didn't much care for the Clio.
thiscocks said:
900T-R said:
Barring track width (or relative lack of it) a classic Saab 900 Turbo would be a better base for a fast FWD car than the last generation Renault Megane.
How so?Then RenaultSport comes and makes a giant killer out of those pedestrian origins!
The Saab was FWD out of conviction, not because it was cheaper or offered more passenger space (compared to its peers, it did neither of these things). Suspension set up bred from 30 years in top level international rallying; double wishbones at front, fully adjustable (toe, castor, camber). Rear beam axle with four longitudinal links set up to give a small degree of passive rear steer, and a Panhard rod. All designed to work without anti-roll bars (later cars did get them, but that was to compensate for softer springs/shocks) Equal length driveshafts. Engine placed between the wheels rather than entirely in front of the axle line. Short wheelbase by current standards. Little rubber in the suspension, no subframes, steering rack directly bolted to the main longitudinal beams in the engine bay. 2-door models should be easily brought down to sub-1,100 kg - especially as base models featured wind up windows, no central locking etc - so a Turbo can easily be retrofitted with very basic equipment.
Today, inferior to all but the smallest/cheapest current cars in terms of NVH/comfort/passenger space - but therefore better suited to converting into a FWD track/fun car than the current batch of small/midsize family hatches. Dial out the 'safe' understeer that it was set up with, and you're halfway there.
Arch said:
I went from Civic Type-R ( 2 years) to Clio 182 (9 months) to Integra (5 years).
I didn't much care for the Clio.
I didn't much care for the Clio.
The 182 is getting on now, the RS Clio 200 especially with the Cup chassis is in another league. This article is about the current Clio which if you drive it may well change your mind.
foxspeed said:
jbi said:
ever tried changing a bulb on a clio?
Ever looked at the paper machete suspension arms/subframe?
Cheap, badly designed tat is all they are.
in reply yes i have and you dont remove the bumper!!!Ever looked at the paper machete suspension arms/subframe?
Cheap, badly designed tat is all they are.
suspension looks just as rubust as bmw/mini/vw set-up matter of fact the independant
swivel hub arrangement on mine is quite trick
obviously your mechanic skills are as bad as your knowledge of the vehicles!
Can't comment on the BMW as I don't have much experience swapping suspension parts around on them, but I have plenty of experience with fords, chevrolets and toyotas.
Edited by jbi on Wednesday 25th April 19:56
jbi said:
foxspeed said:
jbi said:
ever tried changing a bulb on a clio?
Ever looked at the paper machete suspension arms/subframe?
Cheap, badly designed tat is all they are.
in reply yes i have and you dont remove the bumper!!!Ever looked at the paper machete suspension arms/subframe?
Cheap, badly designed tat is all they are.
suspension looks just as rubust as bmw/mini/vw set-up matter of fact the independant
swivel hub arrangement on mine is quite trick
obviously your mechanic skills are as bad as your knowledge of the vehicles!
It probably is easy to change the headlight bulbs in your cars because they're as big as a bus and the suspension is made from girders
Picking on things like headlight bulb fitting is a terrible argument and deriding possibly one of THE best suspension setups on the market today is just weak.
Sorry man.
(P.S - Also a Clio driver)
Butter Face said:
jbi said:
He's binning it now for a seat.
Jesus. Good luck.I work for a Renault/Seat dealership and ALL of our technicians rate Renaults over Seats.
I don't really know much about the seats, but they don't rate very highly from what I have read about them.
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