RE: PH Blog: What makes the autobahn brilliant

[thewheelman]

Disastrous said:

thewheelman said:

Disastrous said:

thewheelman said:

btdk5 said:

Disastrous said:

thewheelman said:

M666 EVO said:

"And if that makes me sound like the sort of chap who sits two inches from the car in front, then I don't intend it to - it's just ruddy irritating when you want to make progress"

I hear you there. I was tootling to Reading last Saturday on the M4, in the fast lane, stuck behind an RX8 and he would not move over. I don't understand it. At one stage the entire 3 lanes were clear but he would not move to the middle lane at all. I obviously wasn't going to undertake him but when you have an XJR up your trumpet at up to 120 mph, do the sensible thing and shift over... I think he was upset that an old mans car was ready to show him a very clean pair of heels, bless...

120mph on U.K. roads......wow, very clever.....I hope you get the ban you deserve.

What does the UK have to do with it? Surely if he deserves a ban, then it's for dangerous driving, which would be dangerous in any country! Or does he deserve the ban simply for breaking the law?

Exactly the type as discussed earlier in the thread.

Would try to block you from just getting on with it.

Idiot.

The only idiot here is the one doing 120mph on U.K. roads. What a selfish, arrogant prick. The speed limit in this country is 70mph, doing 120mph is the kind of speed that gets you put in prison & a long ban.

Clearly he's an idiot for doing it, & even more of a fool for admitting it in a public forum. If the police read this, i'm sure they'd like a word with him.

Be good if you addressed my point though...why is it more dangerous in the uk? Or should he just get banned for breaking the law?

Wait, are you trying to defend this? Or do you have some kind of problem with the law, & safety to others? I very much doubt the roads in the U.K. are upto the standard to allow such speed limits.

I'm not defending it at all. I'm just pointing out that saying something is 'dangerous' simply because it breaks an arbitrary legal limit is the definition of simple, IMO.

Also, it's the Police's job to catch people who break the law, not yours. How do you know he put the safety of others in jeopardy and what do you base your assertion that uk roads will not support a car driven at 120mph?

Would this have been equally dangerous in the autobahn, or do you think that would have been ok?

Firstly, i'm not reporting him to the police. I was just pointing out that it's not the smartest thing to state you were doing 120mph, & then name his destination, all on a public forum. Add that with his profile, i'm sure the old bill could find him easily, especially cctv footage of that road on that day.

The age old argument of would it be safer on the Autobahns then here? I can only say form your own opinion, i'd say the road infrastructure in Germany is superior to ours. That's just an observation.

If you want an argument over doing 120mph in the U.K., then i really cant be bothered to bite.

[Disastrous]

thewheelman said:

Disastrous said:

thewheelman said:

Disastrous said:

thewheelman said:

btdk5 said:

Disastrous said:

thewheelman said:

M666 EVO said:

"And if that makes me sound like the sort of chap who sits two inches from the car in front, then I don't intend it to - it's just ruddy irritating when you want to make progress"

I hear you there. I was tootling to Reading last Saturday on the M4, in the fast lane, stuck behind an RX8 and he would not move over. I don't understand it. At one stage the entire 3 lanes were clear but he would not move to the middle lane at all. I obviously wasn't going to undertake him but when you have an XJR up your trumpet at up to 120 mph, do the sensible thing and shift over... I think he was upset that an old mans car was ready to show him a very clean pair of heels, bless...

120mph on U.K. roads......wow, very clever.....I hope you get the ban you deserve.

What does the UK have to do with it? Surely if he deserves a ban, then it's for dangerous driving, which would be dangerous in any country! Or does he deserve the ban simply for breaking the law?

Exactly the type as discussed earlier in the thread.

Would try to block you from just getting on with it.

Idiot.

The only idiot here is the one doing 120mph on U.K. roads. What a selfish, arrogant prick. The speed limit in this country is 70mph, doing 120mph is the kind of speed that gets you put in prison & a long ban.

Clearly he's an idiot for doing it, & even more of a fool for admitting it in a public forum. If the police read this, i'm sure they'd like a word with him.

Be good if you addressed my point though...why is it more dangerous in the uk? Or should he just get banned for breaking the law?

Wait, are you trying to defend this? Or do you have some kind of problem with the law, & safety to others? I very much doubt the roads in the U.K. are upto the standard to allow such speed limits.

I'm not defending it at all. I'm just pointing out that saying something is 'dangerous' simply because it breaks an arbitrary legal limit is the definition of simple, IMO.

Also, it's the Police's job to catch people who break the law, not yours. How do you know he put the safety of others in jeopardy and what do you base your assertion that uk roads will not support a car driven at 120mph?

Would this have been equally dangerous in the autobahn, or do you think that would have been ok?

Firstly, i'm not reporting him to the police. I was just pointing out that it's not the smartest thing to state you were doing 120mph, & then name his destination, all on a public forum. Add that with his profile, i'm sure the old bill could find him easily, especially cctv footage of that road on that day.

The age old argument of would it be safer on the Autobahns then here? I can only say form your own opinion, i'd say the road infrastructure in Germany is superior to ours. That's just an observation.

If you want an argument over doing 120mph in the U.K., then i really cant be bothered to bite.

Apology accepted.

Fwiw, I agree that German roads are better. I also agree with Riggers that there places in the UK where 120 is doable, condition dependent.

Dangerous driving is dangerous driving wherever it is, IMO

[Disastrous]

KM666 said:

Disastrous said:

That actually means nothing. "up your trumpet" is no measure of proximity I'm aware of, and could just as easily be exaggeration. Besides, I'm making a general point about why something is dangerous 'in the UK'. Ether it's dangerous or it isn't.

Really? So "up your trumpet" doesnt say tailgating to you?
I thought it was laymans myself.
It is dangerous full stop, the relevence of 'in the UK' is that the article specifies that UK drivers cannot be trusted to deregulation, but the article cites yoofs in Saxos going for a V-max as the reason, not the appauling example of driving M666EVO admits to.
As much as we might dislike to admit it typical UK motorway users are switched off to whats going on around them and so an extra level of caution is required, tailgating at 120mph is beyond tempting fate in a no-going-back way, it shows nothing less than contempt for other road users.

You can get a ban for doing 100mph at 3am on a clear motorway. The cited example of driving is deserving of far harsher penalty.

Stop crying about the tailgating! I only used that example to highlight that saying '120 is dangerous in the UK' doesn't make sense. Forget these particular circumstances as they are largely irrelevant.

[KM666]

Disastrous said:

KM666 said:

Disastrous said:

That actually means nothing. "up your trumpet" is no measure of proximity I'm aware of, and could just as easily be exaggeration. Besides, I'm making a general point about why something is dangerous 'in the UK'. Ether it's dangerous or it isn't.

Really? So "up your trumpet" doesnt say tailgating to you?
I thought it was laymans myself.
It is dangerous full stop, the relevence of 'in the UK' is that the article specifies that UK drivers cannot be trusted to deregulation, but the article cites yoofs in Saxos going for a V-max as the reason, not the appauling example of driving M666EVO admits to.
As much as we might dislike to admit it typical UK motorway users are switched off to whats going on around them and so an extra level of caution is required, tailgating at 120mph is beyond tempting fate in a no-going-back way, it shows nothing less than contempt for other road users.

You can get a ban for doing 100mph at 3am on a clear motorway. The cited example of driving is deserving of far harsher penalty.

Stop crying about the tailgating! I only used that example to highlight that saying '120 is dangerous in the UK' doesn't make sense. Forget these particular circumstances as they are largely irrelevant.

Eh? Why are you trying to justify an appauling piece of driving based on an ambiguously worded response?

Wheelman said:

M666 EVO said:

"And if that makes me sound like the sort of chap who sits two inches from the car in front, then I don't intend it to - it's just ruddy irritating when you want to make progress"

I hear you there. I was tootling to Reading last Saturday on the M4, in the fast lane, stuck behind an RX8 and he would not move over. I don't understand it. At one stage the entire 3 lanes were clear but he would not move to the middle lane at all. I obviously wasn't going to undertake him but when you have an XJR up your trumpet at up to 120 mph, do the sensible thing and shift over... I think he was upset that an old mans car was ready to show him a very clean pair of heels, bless...

120mph on U.K. roads......wow, very clever.....I hope you get the ban you deserve.

It is quite clear what is dangrous in the above, tailgating is extremely relevent. No matter which element you pick up on in the above quote it still demonstrates a unacceptable amount of danger.
In Germany perhaps people expect to have a car travelling at twice their own speed appear from behind, or to have people racing one another on a public highway, in the UK people do not. Is that clear enough as to why doing that in the UK is worse than doing it in Germany?

Edited by KM666 on Thursday 3rd May 17:52

[Disastrous]

What on earth are you on about??

My original response was to thewheelman who said something along the lines of '120mph, in the uk?? Wow, idiot'. I was pointing out that 120mph in the uk is not intrinsically bad yet you are quite literally weeping like a homesick schoolgirl about the specifics of this particular case, which weren't relevant to my initial point?!

[tommy vercetti]

Must go to the autobahn one day.

[sisu]

But this sort of reaction above is exactly what the UK has regarding any rules. Everyone is thinking the worst and running around like insurance salesmen and you have the stupidity that is UK health & safety.
Admit it, this is indemic and you blame it on the Europeans inflicting this on you. Yet the rest of Europe isn't facing the same struggle as the UK when it comes to this?
But admitting that the Germans are more relaxed towards authority doesn't compute in the UK as punters just respond in silly German accents and talk about Hitler and WW2 like a scene from the Faulty Towers.

[KM666]

Disastrous said:

What on earth are you on about??

My original response was to thewheelman who said something along the lines of '120mph, in the uk?? Wow, idiot'. I was pointing out that 120mph in the uk is not intrinsically bad yet you are quite literally weeping like a homesick schoolgirl about the specifics of this particular case, which weren't relevant to my initial point?!

In Germany perhaps people expect to have a car travelling at twice their own speed appear from behind, or to have people racing one another on a public highway, in the UK people do not. Is that clear enough as to why doing 120mph in the UK is worse than doing it in Germany?

What is your point then? You responded to somebodies reaction to a specific example of high speed driving with the claim 120mph is fine on UK roads.

Disastrous said:

What does the UK have to do with it? Surely if he deserves a ban, then it's for dangerous driving, which would be dangerous in any country! Or does he deserve the ban simply for breaking the law?

Wheelman doesnt have to claim it is dangerous it is obvious, however you do make the link between speed and danger in asking why he (M666EVO) deserves a ban. Because that is the punishment for getting caught driving at 120mph, a ban. He (M666 EVO) is deserving of a ban driving at that speed in the UK because in the UK the punishment driving at such speed is a ban. He got away with doing it at the time and then admits to it on a public forum incriminating himself. If i boasted of how I could score you the best dope in the southwest on facebook I'd deserve to get arrested for being so flippant admitting to nefarious activities. Whatever your point is spit it out.

Speed is nothing to do with it. Admitting to criminal activity is. Would sombody who comes on here claiming they never paid a penny insurance in their life not be deserving of whatever punishments are designated to that crime?

Edited by KM666 on Thursday 3rd May 18:16

[veevee]

CV35Ian said:

and by the way, whats a Fast Lane (apart from an 80s Mag that I have a few copies of)? I thought there was one driving lane and the rest were overtaking lanes only?

u obviously do'nt no how too drive m8. i'ts the 1st thing wen u learn 2 drive.

[Antj]

sisu said:

But this sort of reaction above is exactly what the UK has regarding any rules. Everyone is thinking the worst and running around like insurance salesmen and you have the stupidity that is UK health & safety.
Admit it, this is indemic and you blame it on the Europeans inflicting this on you. Yet the rest of Europe isn't facing the same struggle as the UK when it comes to this?
But admitting that the Germans are more relaxed towards authority doesn't compute in the UK as punters just respond in silly German accents and talk about Hitler and WW2 like a scene from the Faulty Towers.

The germans are not more relaxed to autority, they simply have a more grown up approach that if you are over 18 you are responsible for it. hence unlimited 3rd party liability etc.

They also tend to be a little more clearcut about events than us in the UK. For example 2 years back there was a bike accident outside the ED petrol station on Dottinger ( ring), a bike turned across a car on the other side of the road. That section of road was closed for no more than 90 minutes!!! All cleaned up and everybody carrying on. In the UK that same accident would have closed the road for 6 or maybe more hours due to the death.

I can't put my finger on what it is but in Germany on the whole things just work better, sure theres still the bureacracy and so on but everyday life works better. I think of Germany now as the UK was say 30 years ago, they respect the police ( we do not) they respect each other more ( where as we do what ever pleases us) and they are in general more mature than we are. In fact you can extend that to a lot of western Europe, the Uk has unfortunately followed America too much when we should have continued like Europe and stuck to our principles.

[Use Psychology]

having said all this nice stuff about germnay i feel compelled to provide some balance.

i was reading a german cook book the other day, here is one of the recipes:

get some mince and spread it out in a baking dish.

stick a cauliflower in the middle

put a tomato (whole) in each corner

pour over some kind of white sauce

stick it in the oven.

wtf.

(some of the food is very nice though)

[ringweekends]

I'll consistently tell anyone who'll listen, you can cover distance by car in Europe in a way you never can in the UK.

As soon as you hit the M20 from your channel crossing home you're instantly reminded how crap our roads really are in comparison.

[MBK]

I was lucky enough to live in Germany for 4 years or so in the 90's and yes the Autobahn was fun, the car will age the story, my 306 GTi-6 would just about see a real 130mph on a good day and a long straight but it sure felt quick then. My mates M3 of the day was a rocket ship by comparison. The Ring was also far less well known and a whole lot of fun and gave you somewhere to blast down the Autobahn to. It's not all roses though and quite a few people we knew had nasty shunts - and were sometimes in trouble for being the person who pulled out in front of faster traffic and deemed to have caused the accident. Driving there does require a lot more attention and discipline which is of course is generally a good thing.

I'd say the autobahn experience got the need for big straight line speed out of my system and I'm quite happy to be sensible back on our congested roads these days. I still enjoy the odd A & B road blast when the timing and conditions are right but more than anything the Ring opened my eyes to the track which is where the real fun is to be had with without fear for your licence.

[TallbutBuxomly]

ringweekends said:

I'll consistently tell anyone who'll listen, you can cover distance by car in Europe in a way you never can in the UK.

As soon as you hit the M20 from your channel crossing home you're instantly reminded how crap our roads really are in comparison.

M20?

Nothing wrong with it imho. Would happily do 150-180mph on there. Wide open 4 lanes good surface. No issues really.

Edited by TallbutBuxomly on Thursday 3rd May 20:14

[DexterBerkeley]

PILCH 23 said:

Perhaps the UK should have a few sections of de-restricted motorway as a two year trial. If it was applied to low density sections on a variable basis then I doubt that the accident rates would change. Potential sections could be the M62 east of the A1, the M69 and the M180.

The M69 has a speed limit? Doesn't appear that way whenever I'm on it.

[Disastrous]

KM666 said:

Wheelman doesnt have to claim it is dangerous it is obvious, however you do make the link between speed and danger in asking why he (M666EVO) deserves a ban. Because that is the punishment for getting caught driving at 120mph, a ban. He (M666 EVO) is deserving of a ban driving at that speed in the UK because in the UK the punishment driving at such speed is a ban. He got away with doing it at the time and then admits to it on a public forum incriminating himself. If i boasted of how I could score you the best dope in the southwest on facebook I'd deserve to get arrested for being so flippant admitting to nefarious activities. Whatever your point is spit it out.

Speed is nothing to do with it. Admitting to criminal activity is. Would sombody who comes on here claiming they never paid a penny insurance in their life not be deserving of whatever punishments are designated to that crime?

Edited by KM666 on Thursday 3rd May 18:16

This is starting to hurt my face.

Forget the 'confession' of dangerous driving completely. It's not relevant.

My point was that the statement that 120 in the UK is dangerous, is simply not true.

Anyway, I'm sure everyone else understands the semantic difference so it doesn't really matter...

[Davidonly]

Germany and my M3 were made for each other. Then the people the environment and the pragmatism of the state add another dimension to the joy of visiting that great nation. I am there at least once each year, even if I head to another destination I will drive via Germany and spend a few nights there on the way. It keeps me sane !

The UK may not be the worst place but it needs to take a good look as the petty rule making, fines for everything and every decreasing degree of self determination are slowy squeezing the life out of us.

Even the USA 'feels' better to me now. Well Texas anyway.

[Davidonly]

veevee said:

CV35Ian said:

and by the way, whats a Fast Lane (apart from an 80s Mag that I have a few copies of)? I thought there was one driving lane and the rest were overtaking lanes only?

u obviously do'nt no how too drive m8. i'ts the 1st thing wen u learn 2 drive.

Are you serious?

[Chas-Chiro]

TallbutBuxomly said:

Interesting that this has come up. I have had this all week. People sitting in the wrong lanes at 60-70mph daydreaming and not moving left when clear.

But to cap it all off yesterday I had some pillock in a passat give me the finger for going past him on the motorway.

Pulls out and overtakes someone then pulls back in and as I went past I noticed he was giving me the middle finger.

I was going substantially faster than him but didnt flash my lights put my indicator on or even get anywhere near within two car lengths of him in the time it took for his overtake.

People in this country are thick as pig st.

You are not alone. I get this a lot in national speed limit areas. I don't think they realise that overtaking is still allowed and national means 60mph (for cars) not 45mph.

It amazes me they actually passed the driving test....then again, it's not really a driving test, just a set of questions they have been prepared for and to prove some safe maneuvering in town traffic. They don't even do the test if weather becomes inclement, but can drive in ice, snow, heavy rain, floods and high winds the minute they pass. Ridiculous!

[Chas-Chiro]

Riggers said:

benim83n said:

Maybe i just an exuberant yoof trying to max-out his Saxo, but no speed limits does sound very appealing!

It does sound very appealing, but the point is the the Germans have always had parts of the road network that are de-restricted. In the UK that went south barely a few years into the existence of the M1.


As a consequence, the vast majority of drivers have no idea about how a car will handle above 90 mph, nor how much you have to adjust your focus on the road at those sorts of speeds and above.

Therefore, the chap squeezing 120mph out of his Saxo VTS might actually be perfectly capable of driving at such speed, but the 65mph dawdler in the Xsara Picasso won't be expecting them, or used to looking out for them...

That's a very valid point. But I have yet to hear about anybody being convicted of lane hogging or pulling out to overtake on a motorway without looking first. We all know it happens even the police do, but they do nothing about it. (Except for one case on the Isle of Wight where an old lady was prosecuted for Driving Without Due Care because she unreasonably held up the traffic).

That is a prime opportunity for them (police) to use their unmarked cars to spot these drivers and give them a good ticking off with three points to remember it by. They would not hog the middle / outside lane if this happened, thus making proper use of the lanes and not causing traffic jams. Currently this goes unchecked even though it's unlawful.

Funny how they can constantly look in the mirror to see how close someone is behind but cannot see the lane is clear to the left.